I remember Chris as a thoughtful person who was often deep in thought when she was a student. The underground LGBTQIA club, Haven, was fairly new, and the school was now fully aware of its existence and activities. Chris was part of the first group of leaders, along with Liz Cirelli, to start openly challenging the school's hateful policies and advocating for the rights of queer students. This led to the school doing the unthinkable to Chris, which made crystal clear the values of evangelical culture. Thankfully, Chris is living a great life today, advocating for queer youth, and raising a family of her own. 

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Elephants with Guns, Azeem Kahn, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

Matt Kendziera is a writer, podcaster, and drummer who has lived an amazing life full of growth and change. And like all of us on Chapel Probation, he has had trouble with the evangelicals. But despite the hard times, Matt is a supremely positive person with a personality that draws people in, allowing them to tell their stories. His book, Bring it Home: The Adventure of Finding Yourself After Being Lost in Religion is out now, and it's a lovely read. You get a sense of nostalgia for childhood and youth, and you get Matt's story of experiencing various christian faiths before leaving most of it to create his own identity. There are many similarities to my own book in the themes, but readers of Matt's book will get a great sense of the midwest and the culture therein. And Matt's podcast, Chasing Goodness is an inspiring conversation between deep thinking people who have experienced a lot of life. 

Matt reflects on his own Inter Varsity Christian Fellowship experience, and relates his life to the themes of Chapel Probation. A really great conversation.

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Elephants with Guns, Azeem Kahn, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

Brent Walmsley has attended 3 evangelical schools, so naturally, he is no longer evangelical. From the Assemblies of God North Central, Bethel, to Fuller Seminary, he deconstructed at each stop, leaving it all in 2016 when Trump became the face of evangelical christianity. Along the way, Brent disagreed with the evangelical treatment of women, LGBTQIA people, and BIPOC people, as the culture of christianity cemented itself into bigotry and hate. Today, Brent is a moderator of the Life After Facebook group which is dedicated to providing resources to ex-evangelicals, and he is committed to being a resource for people who want to get out of evangelical christianity. You can follow him on Tik Tok by clicking his name above. 

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

I needed a little break this week as I finished up copy edits of the book and worked on the amazing Straight White American Jesus series about the New Apostolic Reformation with Brad Onishi and Matthew Taylor. I wrote the scary theme music and do the editing and mixing for them. Mostly I just needed a little breather after 20 straight weeks of putting out episodes. We'll be back next week with another real episode and a new After Hours segment.

This week I talk about the music behind Chapel Probation, shout out a few listeners, and ask the question: What should season 3 look/sound like? Have we decisively made the case against evangelical higher education? Certainly, there are lots more stories to tell, so we'll continue to tell them, but what other angles should we take? Let me know what you think.

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Elephants with Guns, Azeem Kahn, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

This week we have our first staff person who worked at APU. My guest, a super cool Black woman who wishes to remain anonymous, worked at APU for 12 years and was beloved by students and her non-racist co-workers. But the culture of the staff at APU was ridiculously white supremacist and conservative, making most days at work unbearable. Anti-Blackness became the norm at places like APU in 2008 when Obama was first elected, and it rose to a fever pitch by the time Trump was elected. My guest endured so much racism, but she learned to push back before she finally left. The Black students had it bad at APU. The Black staff had it worse. Students were at least paying customers with some protections. There were no protections for staff like my guest today. She was literally told to take the opportunity to exercise forgiveness and grace when racist shit went down. 

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

Mandy Capehart joined me to talk about her thoughts on Chapel Probation and share her approaches to helping people grieve. Her book, Restorative Grief, and podcast of the same name are great resources for anyone processing and living through grief. We talk about Mandy's thoughts about Ella's and Lina's episodes and how telling our stories helps us process trauma and develop our identities.

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

Like some professors at evangelical schools, Michael Smith came to APU assuming he would be teaching at an academic institution. He quickly learned that the school was more concerned with teaching fundamentalist and conservative lifestyles than actual academic learning. Combined with the school's obsession with criminalizing sexuality and any faith traditions outside of evangelical christianity, Professor Smith struggled to find his footing. Faculty and administration seemed wary of his Episcopalian faith and status as a single man. Things got better when he got married, but the seeds of discontent were planted. Like so many other awesome profs, he left feeling disenchanted with both evangelical higher education and christianity in general. 

The draconian treatment of LGBTQIA students, the twisted manner the school treated all sexuality, and the campus-wide internet filters which no one, not even professors, could circumvent ultimately showed Professor Smith that the school was a Sunday School first and an academic institution second.

This week's sketch features Hope and Nikki from the Biola episode that kicked off Season 2.  Along with Scott's kids, Audrey and Owen, they parody the whole internet filter situation.

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

Even though the 4 of us went to an actual "top-notch" university, UC San Diego, our involvement with Inter-Varstiy Christian Fellowship meant our faith was in constant action and activity. We didn't have to deal with a university-wide culture of racism, misogyny, and anti-LGBTQIA hatred, but we embedded ourselves in a clatch of moderately conservative christianity that served to tamp down significant parts of our identities and sexuality. For Tim and Kevin, their experiences as closeted gay men added one more layer of shame, fear, and pain. Even still we were leaders in IVCF. Kevin was even a staff person for 5 years. We lived our faiths in "radical" ways before we all deconstructed to varying degrees of faith and agnosticism. 

It is this experience as the best kind of christian in an academic and scientific setting that gave me (in my mind) the authority and the cred to teach at APU, even after I no longer believed in God. And even though we at UC San Diego got incredible educations, we did not escape the harm done to us by evangelical culture. 

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

Mahrs Schoppman is a graduate of APU who developed his identity as both a queer person and a deconstructed christian while there. He is grateful to APU for providing an easy foil to pick apart the hollow theology of evangelicalism and for introducing him to his community of fellow queer students, with whom he is still friends to this day. He talks about his work with queer clients seeking healing from religious trauma and responds to some of the stories on this podcast. He was actually introduced anonymously in the finale of season 1 when A Scott talked about their relationship, and he shares his thoughts about Abbie and Liz's, Nate's and Ella's stories. You can find out more about Mahrs' work at www.therapywithmahrs.com.

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com

Eugene was a student in my last ever Freshman Writing class at APU. We've kept in touch over the years, and I knew I wanted him to tell his story on Chapel Probation early on. After sharing an experience on the facebook group, Eugene agreed to be interviewed, and I'm so glad. We talk about the special brand of evangelical racism he encountered, his experiences being in all the different choirs, and his memories of being a closeted queer student before coming out years after he left APU. While most non-white cis-het men have to deal with bigotry and marginalization, Eugene had to deal with feeling both invisible and stereotyped as an Asian American, and feeling like his sexual identity was something to tamp down and ignore. Fortunately, he has learned and is learning to explore all aspects of his identity now. And like so many, he has APU to thank for his faith deconstruction, which has enabled him to dive into his identities.

Nate and Gail from the Full Mutuality podcast join me and my daughter Audrey for this week's Chapel Probation players sketch. And we continue with our "special" music bits with a bonus segment in which we re-imagine a beloved worship song as a queer anthem. You'll hear Eugene in the "studio" recording the track as the "producer" tries to make sense of it as the track becomes more and more...horny.

Chapel Probation is part of the Dauntless Media Collective

Music by Scott Okamoto, Jenyi, and Shin Kawasaki and Wingo Shackleford

Join the Chapel Probation Patreon  to support Scott and for bonus content.

Join the Chapel Probation Facebook group to continue the conversations.

Follow Scott on Instagram and Twitter

You can subscribe to Scott's newsletter and learn more about the book, the blog, and performances at rscottokamoto.com