Twins Clare and Jessie Stephens have been by each other's side for all of life's firsts. The first day of school, first job, first love, first pregnancy and birth plus that time Clare dyed her hair brown (spoiler alert: disaster).

The sisters, both writers and podcasters, live in tandem. They're also competitive high achievers.

So what's it like when your best friend is also your harshest critic, most fierce rival and biggest cheerleader? How do you figure out who you are when your identity and DNA are so closely linked with another? Yumi Stynes sits down with the twins for a raucous conversation about the love and war of sisterhood.

Clare Stephens is the author of The Worst Thing I've Ever Done and host of The Pile On podcast. Jessie Stephens is the author of Something Bad Is Going to Happen and host of the Mamamia Out Loud podcast.

What to listen to next:

Sashi Perera on reinvention

Rosie Waterland and Jamila Rizvi's broken brains

Jessie Tu, on miscarriage and doing motherhood her way

The price of perfectionism

You can binge more episodes of Ladies, We Need to Talk on the ABC listen app (in Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. 

What to read next: 

How Turia Pitt's body image changed in motherhood

The dark side of being a perfectionist

Shame and disgust: Why we find this STI so hard to talk about

What happens to your sex life during perimenopause?

This episode contains references to pregnancy, miscarriage, jealousy, envy, twin, sisterhood, family, depression, anxiety, relationships, Jessie Stephens pregnancy, identical twins.