Cold War Conversations

South Africa in the 1980s is a brutal, racist Apartheid regime. Those who oppose it risk their lives. Apartheid was a system of institutionalised racial segregation that existed in South Africa from 1948 to the early 1990s

Sue Dobson is moving easily through the echelons of the racist government in her work as a journalist, whilst concealing her espionage and military training in the Soviet Union, and her intelligence work for the banned African National Congress. She interviewed Apartheid ministers and had a honey trap affair with a police chief involved with the Namibian independence process.

However, Sue's cover is blown leading to her desperate flight across Southern Africa with the Apartheid security police snapping at her heels. We hear in detail about her tense three day car journey to the Soviet Embassy in Botswana and how her KGB training saved her life…

0:00 Introduction and Sue Dobson's Espionage Journey

2:22 Sue's Role in the South African Bureau of Information and Namibia's Independence

8:21 Sue's Encounter with Key Information Source and Communication with ANC

13:55 Sue's Meeting with Apartheid Era Figures and Confrontation with Pik Botha

18:44 Sue's Moral Dilemma and Justification for Her Actions

20:37 Global Attention on South Africa and Tactics Used in Namibia

22:37 Sue's Job Offer and Realization of a Potential Exposure

24:15 Sue's Escape Plan and Journey through Namibia

32:58 Sue's Close Encounter with Surveillance and Journey to Botswana

40:12 Sue's Refuge in the Russian Compound and Escape to Europe

44:27 Sue's New Life in the UK and Fears of Parcel Bombs and Poisonings

47:22 Sue's Decision to Share Her Story

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Cold War history is disappearing; however, a simple monthly donation will keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history.

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Listeners can find details of our book giveaway here https://coldwarconversations.com/giveaway/

Episode extras including videos and photos https://coldwarconversations.com/episode295/

Support the project! https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

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South Africa in the 1980s is a brutal, racist regime. Those who oppose it risk their lives.

Sue Dobson, was a young white South African woman who was also a spy for the banned African National Congress. The ANC was a liberation movement known for its opposition to apartheid

In the 1980s she built a legend, a fake persona where she pretends to conform, moving easily through the echelons of the racist government in her work as a journalist, whilst concealing her espionage and military training in the Soviet Union, and her intelligence work.

We begin with her childhood and what life was like under apartheid. Sue then describes her journey to joining the African National Congress, her recruitment into the armed wing, and her training in the Soviet Union.

0:00 Introduction and brief history of apartheid

0:31 Sue Dobson: Life as a spy for the ANC

8:35 Geopolitical outlook of South Africa during the Cold War

15:40 Sue Dobson's initial contact with the ANC and her training

24:38 Living a lie permanently and returning to London

27:43 First impressions of the Soviet Union

32:57 Building strong bonds with the training team

39:55 Shocking news upon return to South Africa and becoming a spy

44:31 End of part one and preview for next week

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Buy the book here and support Cold War Conversations

Cold War history is disappearing; however, a simple monthly donation will keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history.

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Enter our book giveaway here https://coldwarconversations.com/giveaway/

Episode extras including videos and photos https://coldwarconversations.com/episode294/

Support the project! https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

Follow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/ColdWarPod

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In November of 1982, at the height of the Cold War, Samantha Smith, a 10-year-old girl from Manchester, Maine, wrote to the Soviet leader Yuri Andropov and asked him if he was going to wage a nuclear war against the U.S.

When an unprecedented response from Andropov arrived, and Samantha received an invitation to visit the USSR, she and her family embarked on a journey that brought the two warring nations closer together.

We speak with author Lena Nelson who was born in the Soviet Union and has spent the past 15 years researching and documenting the story of Samantha Smith and creating an archive at https://www.samanthasmith.info/.

Lena reveals how Samantha Smith's journey in the summer of 1983 helped melt the hearts of the Soviets and thaw the ice of the Cold War. We talk about the interviews she conducted in both the US and Russia with key players in the events of those days and tell the story of this unprecedented moment in history.

0:00 Introduction and interview with author Lena Nelson about Samantha Smith

1:35 Sponsor: Support for Cold War Conversations

5:24 Samantha Smith's motivation to write to Yuri Andropov and her history of letter writing

14:54 Lena's impressions of American life from Samantha Smith's documentary

20:49 Samantha Smith's preparation for her trip to the Soviet Union

25:41 Samantha Smith's arrival in the Soviet Union and the initial reactions

33:54 Natasha's accidental trip to Artek and meeting Samantha Smith

43:25 The incident over the colour of hot dogs in the Artek cafeteria and Samantha's image as an ideal American representative

48:37 Samantha's post-trip experience and school life

57:04 Circumstances of Samantha's tragic death and Lina Nelson's memory of hearing the news in the Soviet Union

1:05:16 Lina's collaboration with Jane and the evolution of her project

1:07:19 Podcast conclusion, invitation to Facebook discussion group and closing remarks by Ian Sanders

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Lena’s book America's Youngest Ambassador: The Cold War Story of Samantha Smith's Lasting Message of Peace is available via this link https://uk.bookshop.org/a/1549/9781684750207

Cold War history is disappearing; however, a simple monthly donation will keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history.

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Episode extras including videos and photos https://coldwarconversations.com/episode293/

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Communist Poland had universal conscription and the armed forces were huge by contemporary standards. The Polish People’s Army, Navy, and Airforce had just over 400,000 troops for most of the 1980s in a country of 36 million.

Tom was a conscript in Polish People's Army from 1987-89. He served as a radio operator in Legnica for the rocket artillery. 

His service was at an interesting time when the communist dominance ended as Poland began to embrace democracy in its first free elections before World War 2.

Tom shares details of his conscription process, selection, and initial training. We also hear of training exercises, attempts at political indoctrination, and his role if the Cold War had ever turned hot.

I’m very keen to expand our library of Warsaw Pact voices, so if you know of any other English speakers who served in the Warsaw Pact Forces during the Cold War do let me know.    

0:00 Introduction and background of Polish military conscription

5:18 Issuance of army book and process for students aspiring for higher education

10:59 Political education at the university and military radio training

19:43 Tom's role as a mobile radio operator and experience in an armored truck

27:15 Fear of being ordered to stop demonstrations and participating in Warsaw Pact exercises

35:28 Interactions with the Russian military and instructions if captured by NATO forces

40:31 Living conditions and military structure in Legnica

45:28 Perception of the West as a threat and the Army's transition after the Russian withdrawal

49:37 Reflecting on time in the Polish People's Army and pretending to work

51:27 Episode extras and thanks to financial supporters

51:58 Closing remarks by Ian Sanders

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Cold War history is disappearing; however, a simple monthly donation will keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history.

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Episode extras including videos and photos https://coldwarconversations.com/episode292/

Support the project! https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

Follow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/ColdWarPod

Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/coldwarpod/

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Youtube https://youtube.com/@ColdWarConversations

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It’s 1966 in Berlin and the city has now been divided for 5 years by an almost impenetrable wall erected by the communist German Democratic Republic.

Together with his friends, West German student Volker Heinz joins a group looking for ways to help would-be fugitives escape from East to West.

Their search ends at Checkpoint Charlie, the most heavily secured border crossing of the Berlin Wall. By hiding the fugitives in the trunk of a diplomat's car, Volker Heinz helps East German citizens flee to the West.

However, the Stasi picks up his trail, and Volker is arrested and interrogated. We hear in detail about his time in prison, including the interrogations and fellow cellmates.

Following secret negotiations and a show trial where he is sentenced to 12 years imprisonment, Heinz is eventually swapped for two Soviet spies.

In 2001 Heinz initiated the German-British foundation Temple Gift dedicated to the reconciliation of former foes Britain and Germany. In 2012 he was awarded the Federal Order of Merit in recognition of his courage.

0:00 Introduction and Volker Heinz's story 

5:19 Volker's involvement in helping East German citizens escape

20:01 Reflections on the experience and diplomatic immunity 

30:25 Volker's arrest, interrogation, and time in prison

57:12 Meeting Wolfgang Vogel and trial experiences

1:02:23 Volker's prison experiences and Stasi's recruitment attempts

1:05:54 Volker's release and return to West Germany

1:09:32 Volker's post-prison life and discovery of Stasi's tracking

1:14:21 Volker's book and its contribution to Cold War understanding

1:14:41 Sponsor: Amberley Publishing

1:15:11 Closing remarks and podcast's Facebook discussion group information

Buy the book here and support CWC https://amzn.to/42V7FUK

Cold War history is disappearing; however, a simple monthly donation will keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history.

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Episode extras including videos and photos https://coldwarconversations.com/episode291/

Support the project! https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

Follow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/ColdWarPod

Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/coldwarpod/

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Colonel Terry Chester’s flying career spanned some 42 years, and 10,000 flying hours. He joined the RCAF in Sept 1964 and in 1968 was awarded Navigator Wings.

Terry flew for 3,000 hrs on the Argus Maritime patrol aircraft where he spent a good portion of his RCAF career hunting for Soviet Submarines in both the Pacific and Atlantic areas of operation. 

He was instrumental in the design criteria for sub-hunting capability when Canada procured the new Aurora, for anti-submarine hunting in the early 1980s.

Terry reveals sub-hunting tactics as well as details of Canadian participation in NATO exercises.

Among other stories, he describes how he accidentally attacked a US nuclear submarine, the perils of landing in Gibraltar, and Soviet sub-incursions into Canadian waters. He also recalls airborne meetings with Soviet aircraft and a trip in the British nuclear submarine HMS Churchill. 

0:00 Introduction to Cold War Conversations with Colonel Terry Chester

2:24 Overview of Chester's experiences in Anti-Submarine Warfare and the Soviet Navy

5:05 Accounts of accidental attacks on US nuclear submarines

13:21 Encounters with Soviet aircraft and monitoring of Soviet submarines

20:34 The Gibraltar Base, Spanish tensions, and life aboard HMS Churchill

26:28 Protocols and preparations for potential nuclear warfare 

28:14 Soviet submarine incursions in Canadian waters and international cooperation

32:19 End of the Cold War: experiences and concerns

33:40 Post-Cold War era and the Western Alliance's reduced defense spending

34:21 Reflections on serving in the Cold War and camaraderie during service

35:17 Sponsor: Listener Support and invitation to the Facebook discussion group

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Episode 1 of our interview with Terry is here https://coldwarconversations.com/episode54/

Cold War history is disappearing; however, a simple monthly donation will keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history.

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Episode extras including videos and photos https://coldwarconversations.com/episode290/

Do take a look at  Vintage Wings a collection of historically significant aircraft that Terry has worked on as well as the Royal Canadian Airforce Association of which Terry was a National President.

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The second part of Svetlana’s story starts shortly after her arrival in West Germany with her husband Oleg who is the Chief Editor of the Russian Service of Radio Liberty a CIA-financed station beaming Western propaganda into the Soviet Union. Listen to the previous episode here https://coldwarconversations.com/episode288/

To Svetlana’s horror, Oleg reveals that he has been working for the KGB for 14 years. Svetlana is now trapped. She is in a quandary. Should she betray the man she loves and risk the wrath of the KGB or should she stay loyal to her husband?

Loyalty wins out and she is invited by the Americans to teach Russian to intelligence officers and later becomes assistant to the commander at the US Army Intelligence Institute in Munich.

However, in 1986 Oleg disappears and leaves Svetlana on her own in West Germany. At a press conference in Moscow, he reveals his espionage and suspicion falls on Svetlana…

0:00 Introduction and background of Svetlana's story

5:34 Discussion about Oleg's recruitment into the KGB and his role as a spy

15:18 Svetlana's job with the Americans and the impact on their relationship

24:06 Lie detector test and its implications for Oleg

31:02 The pressures of leading a double life and Oleg's subsequent disappearance

40:50 Svetlana's actions and the aftermath of Oleg's disappearance

46:58 Oleg's return to Munich, American secret investigations, and the disagreement with Germans

55:23 Oleg's encounters with Vladimir Putin and his subsequent help

58:47 Oleg's arrest, trial, and prison sentence

1:03:29 Oleg's life post-prison and his encounters with the FBI and family in the United States

1:07:34 Transition to life in Moscow and political involvement with "John Wood"

1:08:04 Episode extras and thanking financial supporters

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Cold War history is disappearing; however, a simple monthly donation will keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history.

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Episode extras including videos and photos https://coldwarconversations.com/episode289/

Support the project! https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

Follow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/ColdWarPod

Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/coldwarpod/

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Svetlana came from a dissident Jewish family opposed to Soviet rule in Latvia. Her parents survived World War 2, but during the Stalin era two members of her family were held in the Gulags. The family never resigned themselves to Latvia's occupation by the Soviet Union in 1940.

It was almost impossible to legally leave the Soviet Union, however, in 1971 the first opportunities for "Jewish" emigration appeared, and Svetlana, then aged 12 and her family left legally.

At the age of 16, she is staying with her Uncle in London when she comes across Bush House, the home of the BBC Russian Service.

Svetlana manages to get a job there and begins to get promoted. She meets Georgi Markov who is assassinated by Bulgarian Security Services on Waterloo Bridge in London and later she is introduced to Oleg, the Chief Editor of the Russian Service of Radio Liberty, a CIA-financed station beaming Western propaganda into the Soviet Union. This meeting has a profound effect on her life…

0:00 Introduction and Svetlana's Background

7:23 Svetlana's Experiences during the Stalin Era and Attempted Hijack

14:12 Svetlana's Immigration and Figure Skating Career

17:04 Svetlana's Arrival in Vienna and First Impressions of Western Lifestyle

23:51 Svetlana's Experience at BBC and Life in London and Israel

31:42 Encounter with Georgi Markov and Introduction to Oleg

39:43 Oleg's Escape from Soviet Union and Journey to Libya

44:32 Oleg's Role in Radio Liberty

46:57 Svetlana's Move to Germany and Discovery of Oleg's KGB Affiliation

49:21 Preview of Next Episode and Closing Remarks

2:00 Sponsor Message and Testimonial from a Listener

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The fight to preserve Cold War history continues and via a simple monthly donation, you will give me the ammunition to keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history. 

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Details and extra video content on this link https://coldwarconversations.com/episode288/

St Petersburg (Leningrad) aircraft hijack episode https://coldwarconversations.com/episode258/

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We continue Steffen’s story where he tells of serving in three armies – firstly, the NVA, secondly the East German Army between the first free elections and unification, and finally the unified Bundeswehr. 

We start the episode in the Autumn of 1989 where demonstrations are growing against the government in nearby Leipzig and Steffen’s unit is on high alert and confined to barracks. It is clear East Germany is on the cusp of change however, what will be the impact on Steffen and his comrades?

Steffen describes these tense days when rumours abounded of military action against the demonstrators, as well as how he heard about the fall of Honecker and the opening of the border. We also hear about his experiences as the NVA transitions after the first free elections in East Germany and momentum builds for reunification.

Steffen accepts a place in the new unified German army and we hear about the day command is handed over to the Bundeswehr and how he has to learn a different way of thinking, such as the new doctrine of personal responsibility. 

0:00 Introduction and Steffen's account of tension in East Germany

2:26 Steffen's experiences during high alert and rumors of military action

9:41 Steffen's account of the news about Honecker's departure and post-fall experiences

13:29 Steffen's thoughts on a better GDR and first crossing into the West

18:32 Changes in public sentiment during weekly demonstrations and the decline of grassroots groups

24:15 Reunification possibilities and its effect on the NVA

29:11 Steffen's encounter with Bundeswehr troops and changes post-reunification

34:03 Steffen's transition from the East German uniform to the Bundeswehr uniform

43:57 Transformation in the relationship between soldiers and commanders post-reunification

46:51 Impact of reunification on Steffen's parents' jobs and his own career path

54:31 Steffen's comparison between NVA and Bunderswehr

55:46 Sponsor: Reminder about the Facebook discussion group

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The fight to preserve Cold War history continues and via a simple monthly donation, you will give me the ammunition to keep this podcast on the air. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history. 

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Photos and extra video content on this link https://coldwarconversations.com/episode287/

Follow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/ColdWarPod

Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/coldwarpod/

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Steffen was born in Karl Marx Stadt and was conscripted into the NVA (East German Army) in 1988.

When he left school he started an apprenticeship in electronics learning how to build radio receivers at REMA, a then-famous producer of HiFi equipment.

Steffen is called up at 18 for his 18 months of service and he talks of the conscription process and incentives offered to him to serve for a longer period.

Steffen is posted to a unit in Leipzig that was responsible for telephone lines from the NVA Headquarters for the area south of Berlin. He describes the training he took and the role he carried out including installing phones for NATO Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty inspectors.

In the summer of 1989 many citizens of East Germany flee the country via the now semi-open Hungarian border and Steffen describes heightened tension within the Army.

Don’t miss next week’s episode where Steffen describes his transfer into the Bundeswehr, the West German Army.

0:00 Introduction and guest presentation

2:36 Steffen's childhood and school life in East Germany

15:21 Steffen's conscription into the East German army and training experiences

25:37 Steffen's comrades and checks conducted on him before his role

29:38 Steffen's experience with possible Stasi checks

32:34 Steffen's daily duties in the East German army and infrastructure of the East German phone system

37:14 Steffen's mission involving a secret code word and awareness of the Allied military liaison missions

43:16 Access to Western media while in the East German army

47:49 Lead up to Steffen's job on October 7th, 1989 and preview of next week's episode

48:34 Sponsor: Encouragement for listeners to donate and join the Facebook discussion group

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The fight to preserve Cold War history continues and via a simple monthly donation, you will give me the ammunition to continue to preserve these first hand accounts. You’ll become part of our community and get a sought-after CWC coaster as a thank you and you’ll bask in the warm glow of knowing you are helping to preserve Cold War history. 

Just go to https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

If a monthly contribution is not your cup of tea, We also welcome one-off donations via the same link.

Episode extra inc videos here https://coldwarconversations.com/episode286/

Support the project! https://coldwarconversations.com/donate/

Follow us on Twitter https://twitter.com/ColdWarPod

Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/coldwarpod/

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