Uncomfortable Conversations Podcast

Uncomfortable Conversations Substack

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Josh Szeps is a broadcaster, political commentator, and in my opinion, Australia's best interviewer. 

He has, afterall, conducted thousands of them… and from many different pulpits. Whether it’s podcasting, Huffpost live, or radio, Josh has interviewed everyone from the biggest celebrities in the world, to academics, to geopolitics, to culture wars, comedy, economics and all the rest in between - it’s incredible how flexible Josh is and how well he can extemporaneously talk about or ask the right questions of, seemingly any topic. 

He’s also someone who has been doing this for decades, and seen from the front row the two most significant disruptions to media over that time. I wanted to get something evergreen on Josh’s worldview and evolving timeline of a career…
Josh Szeps is the creator and host of one of my favourite podcasts, ‘Uncomfortable conversations’, and author of a substack by the same name. 

00:00 - Who Is Josh Szeps
05:16 - Navigating Career Paths: Serendipity and Ambition
18:08 - Finding Aliveness: Reflections on Career and Life
22:34 - The Journey to New York: Opportunities and Challenges
33:19 - The Journey to HuffPost Live
37:39 - Memorable Interviews and Guests
39:20 - Preparation for Interviews
42:21 - The Importance of Collaboration
49:12 - Norm MacDonald & Joe Rogan 
58:41 - The Joy of Media Engagement
01:00:02 - Navigating Life Changes and Career Transitions
01:10:50 - Alan Jones
01:11:52 - The Influence of Podcasting
01:12:35 - Living in Australia vs. the US
01:15:09 - The Future of Independent Media
01:21:40 - Innovating in Media Formats

Apologies for my tardiness!

A lot has been going on (including recording lot's of episodes).

I'm keen to hear from you - my email is here - [email protected]

In no particular order...

• Josh Szeps 
• Robyn Davidson 
• Nicholas Gruen 
• Gideon Haigh 
• Tim Cope 
• Sam Roggeveen 
• Pat McGee
• Lawrence Kraus 

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Arne Anderson, Three Tours In Afghanistan For The Swedish Military #46

Swedens Elite Police Unit, Piketen #146

Christopher Neijd Police Lieutenant in Södertälje & Southern Stockholm #165 

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Because of my old mate, Arne Andersson - I’ve been incredibly lucky to have gotten to know several of his old military buddies. There are those listed above...

And then there is my guest for this episode today, courtesy to the serendipity proximate to Arne…

Peter, whose full name will remain redacted - is the head of the isolation ward at Kumla prison, which is the largest maximum security prison in Sweden. We recorded this about 6 months ago, so I am very late to publish, but I hope you’ll agree that the contents are evergreen. Not tied down to any particular time and news, and therefore as useful now as it would have been then as it will be in 5 years time. 

Pete and I sat down together to record this one in Stockholm last late Autumn, it’s as many ins and outs of the prison system that I could think to ask Peter. This is an exhaustive list, but it includes inmate demographics, the impact of overpopulation, the complexities of rehabilitation, the psychological effects of prison on both inmates and staff. the crucial differences between the Swedish prison system other countries, and how it’s portrayed in the media, particularly regarding sentencing and the rehabilitation processes. the challenges of institutionalisation, the dynamics of inmate behaviour. Leadership and de-escalation techniques in managing inmate interactions, as well as the influence of gangs and ethnic divides within the prison system. Informal power dynamics among inmates, the prevalence of violence, self-harm, and the challenges faced by prison officers. The changing attitudes of younger inmates towards authority, the psychological impact of incarceration, and the ongoing issues of contraband and drug addiction. The discussion also touches on the responsibility of prison staff to understand and support inmates, the metrics used to evaluate prison conditions, and the societal perceptions of crime and punishment.

In between all that there is as well Peter’s good humour and the natural tangents much of that may draw you down…

00:00 - Who Is Peter & Intro
03:02 Demographics and Overpopulation in Kumla Prison
05:51 Crime Types and Inmate Behaviour
09:00 Rehabilitation and Sentencing in Sweden
11:59 Isolation Units and Mental Health
14:48 Challenges of Overpopulation and Violence
18:05 Administrative Costs and Efficiency
20:56 Psychological Impact of Isolation
23:53 Interactions with Inmates
27:04 Handling Manipulation and Trust
30:00 Sympathy for Inmates and Their Stories
32:48 Mental Health and Rehabilitation Challenges
35:56 Conclusion and Reflections on the Prison System
45:09 The Nature of Work in Prison
51:49 Rehabilitation vs. Punishment in Nordic Prisons
56:08 Institutionalization and Its Effects
01:01:22 De-escalation Techniques in High-Stress Environments
01:08:15 Leadership in Correctional Facilities
01:16:55 Gang Dynamics in Swedish Prisons
01:26:13 Understanding Power Dynamics in Prisons
01:29:07 The Reality of Violence in Prisons
01:31:34 Addressing Self-Harm and Mental Health Issues
01:34:19 The Challenge of Knowing Inmates
01:36:34 Evaluating Prison Metrics and Crime Hierarchies
01:38:52 Religious Practices and Beliefs in Prisons
01:41:01 Changing Dyn

Watch on Youtube instead - https://youtu.be/RinLuTi04cI

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Colin Thubron (Link's to all books)

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Colin Thubron is one of the greatest living travel writers. 

He started with the Mirror To Damascus in 1967 and with more than half a century and 18 travel books later published his journey along the Amur River just a few years ago. He’s a contemporary of Theroux, Chatwin, early Dalrymple and inspiration for the newer generation of his genre, the likes of Rory Stewart, Levison Wood and many, many more. Colin has been a dream guest of mine for many years.

This interview travelled a line across the map of his career. Colin reflects on his many experiences in Russia and China, the impact of historical events like the Cultural Revolution, the collapse of the Soviet Union - and the broader evolution of travel writing throughout the years. He gets into the effects of globalisation on cultural identities and how it’s effected his experience over the decades. Colin observes the complexities of nationalism and patriotism, and as well discusses the role religion in his life, the nature of belief, and the rationality behind it all. Colin then comments on mortality and his legacy which leads to a discussion on how travel can serve as a coping mechanism for grief. Plus, together we also touch on the choices and more difficult trade offs surrounding parenthood and career, his aspirations for future literary projects, and the influence of serendipity behind it all. 

I can see from the analytics that not even 20% of you who are listening are following the show, I wish this to be 100! Therefore I would ask that you please consider following the show - whether on Spotify or Apple, this, alongside the reviews makes all the difference in the world… 

00:00 - Colin Thubron
02:29 - Reflections on Travel Writing
07:15 - Evolving Perspectives on Russia
10:36 - Cultural Observations in China
15:02 - The Impact of Travel on Identity
22:09 - The Evolution of Travel Writing
32:47 - Brexit and Nationalism: A Personal Reflection
39:55 - The Imprint of Home
46:10 - Religion
50:12 - The Impact of Travel on Grief
56:03 - Influences and Inspirations in Writing
01:03:28 - Serendipity

Consider leaving a review on whichever platform you're listening on!

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Watch on Youtube instead - https://youtu.be/w6Vpcy2cdRk

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Philippe Gijsels Book - https://www.amazon.com/World-Economy-Trends-superinflation-hyperinnovation/dp/9401409013

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The following is with Philippe Gijsels, the Chief Strategy Officer at BNP Paribas Fortis - he co-wrote a book last year called The New World Economy in 5 Trends - which within, reveals much of the new map we now inhabit, especially in light of the perplexing chaos of spearheaded by America’s sloppy leadership in the last weeks. 

Philippe is an erudite bookophile and a banker, a combination that seems not uncommon among the best investors. He and I have been speaking since last year in anticipation of recording this podcast today. I hope you enjoy it. 

I wanted to get the interview into the meat of the book as quickly as possible, therefore, took more liberties with editing than I usually do and have excised a part of the podcast to the end of the discussion. The excised component  was an explanation and brief discussion on the idea of Reflexivity. 

As always, you can navigate through the rest of the show through the timestamps.

Consider leaving this 5 stars on Apple or Spotify - nothing does more to drive the show to new viewers.


00:00 - Philippe Gijsels
02:54 - Understanding the Fourth Turning
11:38 - Serendipity in Innovation
14:40 - Interest Rates & Tolkien
20:52 - The Impact of Inflation on Individuals
26:49 - Wealth Inequality 
39:38 - The Shift to Multi-Globalisation
47:55 - The Future of Work and AI
56:23 - Europe's Role in a Multi-Globalised World
01:12:19 - The Commodities Bull Market
01:14:47 - Demographics and Economic Implications
01:20:46 - Serendipity
01:27:02 - Reflexivity in Economics and Markets

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Youtube Episode - https://youtu.be/fXVZCUR_Row

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Tim Butcher Episode - https://open.spotify.com/episode/6QIQLYuwbA2cFLCzJc8TGl?si=nKU21dGrRX-Z-otWklpxgw

King Leopold's Ghost Book - https://www.amazon.com.au/King-Leopolds-Ghost-Adam-Hochshild/dp/0618001905

From 1885, for 13 years, one man, King Leopold II, owned, as his personal property, one of the largest pieces of geography on earth. The Congo is four times larger than France, it’s bigger than India, it’s bigger than Texas, Alaska, California & Montana combined - the equator runs right through it’s middle and makes it the second largest rainforest on the globe - it’s impossibly rich in resources, and desperately poor in economics. In those 13 years of private ownership, Leopold oversaw potentially one of the most brutal regimes of extraction the world has ever known. The population was estimated to have halved in those 13 years, more than 10 million deaths. It was an exploit in mass slavery, mass death, bodily mutilation and mass extraction. Ivory and wild rubber were in high demand, and so under the guise of media manipulation and PR mastery, Leopold convinced the world that these goods were in fact being traded with, rather than extracted from, the Congo. 

The horror, however, could only be concealed for so long. A fella by the name of Ed Morell who worked for a shipping company in Liverpool noticed the bounty of ivory and rubber arriving from the Congo, with only men and arms making the journey back. His suspicion grew, he found accounts from missionaries and others who had been, and mounted a campaign to undermine the constant wall of propaganda Leopold had financed.

In 1908, the Belgium state purchased the Congo off Leopold… where the country remained a colony of Belgium until 1960. 

And for a myriad of reasons, for which we address in the podcast, the Congo today is still on the back foot. Kinshasa, the capital city already has a bigger population than Paris, and is projected to be as much as 40,000,000 by 2050. The Congo today is among the most resource rich nations on earth, but among the least developed. It still attracts the same predation for extraction as it ever has, although all together less forceful and less violent

The man I speak with on the podcast today wrote the definitive history of this period. His name is Adam Hochschild, he’s an author, journalist and historian and wrote in 1998, 'King Leopold's Ghost'. 

00:00 Congo's Dark History & Adam Hochschild
03:03 Leopold's Brutal Regime
09:02 Modern Parallels of Exploitation
12:11 The Unique Case of King Leopold
14:58 The Mechanics of Control & Media Manipulation
20:45 Campaigning Against Atrocities: The Legacy of Morrell
34:22 Colonialism and Forced Labor: The Belgian Congo
36:16 The Rubber Boom and Its Consequences
38:09 Criticism Of The Book & Congolese Resistance
42:57 Nationalism and Colonialism: Morel's Perspective
44:48 The Impact of Colonialism on Modern Nations
47:17 Geography and Development: The Congo's Challenges
49:51 Natural Resources and Corruption
52:27 The Future of the Congo: A Grim Outlook
57:22 Serendipity

(There was an technical difficulty right at the end of the conversation, which is why it cuts off) 

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Axel Humlesjö is a Swedish journalist against which money laundering, the plumbing of offshore finance and the cancerous nature of dark money, continuously crash up against.

Axel was a part of the team that uncovered systematic money laundering activities with Swedbank in the Baltics. Part of the team behind the series - The Shadow War - which exposed Russian espionage activities in the Nordics and led to the expulsion of five Russian spies from Sweden. Many other stories as well, but of course co-author of his debut book, The Honey Trap which explores Swedbank's involvement in one of the world's largest money laundering scandals and details this extensive operation for how the Russian security service uses sparrows and other means to honey trap and acquire kompromat on a broad slew of people. Honey traps were used directly to illicit compromising material to infiltrate Swedbank.

This podcast goes into Axel’s views on the evolution of journalism in a globalised world, and the significant role that money plays in shaping political landscapes. He goes as far to say it is the single biggest societal issue facing Europe and how intertwined money laundering is with currying foreign influence. 

This was recorded in person in Stockholm with Axel last December, it was the last interview I recorded before I left the country.

00:00 - Axel Humlesjö 
01:30 - Journalism in a Globalised World
06:23 - The Impact of Money Laundering on Democracy
13:28 - The Influence of Russian Oligarchs
15:48 - The Structural Damage of Under Money
25:38 - The Iceberg of Financial Corruption
41:53 - The Impact of Money Laundering on Society
48:58 - The Kompromat Strategy: Honey Traps and Coercion
01:07:01 - The Future of Investigative Journalism

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Youtube - https://youtu.be/4MWFzPXQPY8

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Taiwan is the greatest geopolitical question of the 21st century says Kerry Brown,  sinologist, and former Diplomat to the British Embassy in Beijing. 

He is, I am thrilled to say the guest on todays podcast. A sinologist is a scholar and expert of China, its language, history, politics, and culture - and the theme today is top to bottom the myriad questions looming over one of the largest political issues for China… Taiwan. 

Kerry published a book last year called The Taiwan Story: How a Small Island Will Dictate the Global Future. It is marvelous, and my hope was to do as much justice to the various questions which Kerry approaches Taiwan with as possible in a brief podcast.

The big questions being, the economy, given Taiwan’s semi conductor supremacy with its home grown TSMC, the perplexing idea that Xi would view Taiwanese reunification as the most significant achievement to his legacy, how a more fractured, less unified global order creates lots of wiggle room, Taiwan’s history, and that despite having 95% Han ethnicity, what is it about Taiwan which makes them a distinctly different culture to China, Kerrys feeling for the inevitability of an attempt at reunification and lots more between those cracks. 

00:00 - Kerry Brown
01:20 - Big Opportunity For China
04:13 - Brief Taiwan History
07:33 - TSMC
24:09 - What China Thinks Of Taiwan
37:42 - Taiwanese Identity & Culture
50:14 - It’s All Xi
52:35 - Opinions Of Taiwan
58:30 - Kerry’s Life Work
1:06:00 - Kevin Rudd & Australia
1:16:30 - Indonesia & Serendipity


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Robert Kaplan has been sighted as one of the most influential geopolitical thinkers of the modern era. The Revenge Of Geography, Surrender or Starve, Balkan Ghosts, Asias Cauldron, The Tragic Mind, and so on, I counted 18 books so far with his most recent being - Waste Land: A World In Permanent Crisis.

I’ve listened to many of his books at this point, I found Revenge Of Geography a few years ago whilst preparing for my interviews with Tim Marshall. 

00:00 - Robert D. Kaplan
00:54 - Deterioration Of The Rules Based Order
08:34 - Utopian Versus Tragic Leaders
14:32 - Geographies Role In Shaping Geopolitics
23:05 - Writing For History Or Influence?
25:13 - Australia
28:46 - A Position Robert Holds That Folds Against The Status Quo


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The following is with german political scientist, former beer brewer in the Congo, and author of How Tyrants Fall - Marcel Dirsus

Marcel interviewed coup leaders, dissidents and soldiers to write about the workings and malfunctions of tyrants. Because while the individual personas, eccentricities and reputations might make them all distinct from one another, there are more threads that draw disparate dictator's together than don’t.

I think this excerpt from the book sums up the essence of Marcel’s work and as well, the themes in todays podcast.

“The most powerful tyrants on earth are condemned to live their life in fear. They can make their enemies disappear with a snap of their fingers. They, their families, and their acolytes may control entire countries from the luxury of their palace, but they also have to spend their every waking hour plagued by the fear of losing everything. No matter how powerful they become, they cannot pay for or order that fear to disappear. If such tyrants make one wrong move, they will fall.”

So the interview is about the workings of various tyrants around the world, both living and dead. 

I ask Marcel in the about applying a prisoners of geography lens to this topic, china and the case for dictators not being all bad all the time, marcel’s rogues gallery of tyrants and as well, Marcel offers a raw reflection of the potential future of authoritarianism in the USA particularly because of the astounding moves made so far under trump. This was recorded the day after the US inauguration.

00:00 - Marcel Dirsus
01:40 - Economist's Book Of The Year
03:55 - Serendipity & The Congo
11:35 - Prisoners Of Geography Lens
17:17 - Singapore A Dictatorship?
20:10 - China
27:50 - Saudi & MBS
30:43 - Marcel's Unconventional Idea's
34:15 - Geographical Concentration Of These Regimes
39:10 - Tipping Point (When Regimes Collapse)
49:10 - Rogues Gallery Of Tyrants
53:25 - The Leader Who's Coming Closest To Power
56:46 - Does Global Order Sustain Or Undermine These Regimes?
1:00:25 - Trump's Chances At Dictatorship
1:07:40 - Bullish & Bearish Country


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