In today's Welcome To Cloudlandia episode, we'll embark on a fascinating exploration of history, communication, sports, and advertising.

Tune in as we navigate historical examples that underscore how technology has revolutionized our ability to record and reuse conversations, touching on debates of our founding fathers and Biblical texts.

Then shift gears as we deeply examine the thrilling journey of Deion Sanders and his remarkable leadership of Colorado University football, fueled by what we call "irrational confidence."

Throughout the conversation, the powerful theme of "irrational confidence" emerges. Join us for this captivating discussion spanning diverse topics.

SHOW HIGHLIGHTS

Links:
WelcomeToCloudlandia.com
StrategicCoach.com
DeanJackson.com
ListingAgentLifestyle.com

(AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors)

Dan: That's right and reused and reused permanently recorded. Yeah, what do you think about that?

Dean: I'm pretty excited about it actually. I mean, you know, it's the whole thing where, when Joe Polish and I started the Olive Marketing podcast, it was basically because we'd been having conversations like this that were just for us and we were talking about how. You know, wouldn't it be great if we could go back and listen to conversations? You know, if they imagine they got together and talk and shared ideas and their thoughts and what's working, and we thought, you know, 100 years from now, it's pretty interesting for people to see you know, I don't know Like did you imagine if it was?

Dan: we probably would have a lower opinion of the founding fathers.

Dean: Yeah exactly.

Dan: Yeah, Hamilton, we got a bit of an asshole. Actually we have their recorded newspapers and a lot of the founding fathers had their own newspapers and they used their newspapers to attack the other founding fathers you know and they were and we have no comprehension of how vicious they were towards each other, compared with what people are bothered about today with social media.

Dean: Oh man, yeah.

Dan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you think about what the you think about.

Dean: The Federalist papers were probably the very first full-on like proper game. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dan: Well, actually probably the Bible is.

Dean: Right, that's probably true.

Dan: Yeah, you know. And people, I think that human nature stays pretty much the same. I mean, I've read, you know the writings of people who lived 2,500 years ago and and you know, if you could speak the language and you were in the setting, you would totally understand what they were talking about and you wouldn't find it odd from the standpoint of what the person is describing about themselves and their lives.

We you know they probably have some different habits, they have some different activities that they're involved in, but it wouldn't take as very long to say you know, there's not much difference between what they were doing and what I do every day when I get up.

Dean: It's true isn't it? I mean, when you think about yeah, I think about Socrates and back, you know the letters to Well,

Dan: by the way, we don't have a single thing that Socrates ever said or ever wrote. You know people say well. Socrates says well, not really, play doh, put these words into Socrates' mouth. We only know. For the most part we only know Socrates because somebody else wrote about him. You know it's the same as Jesus. You know I mean Jesus says this and Jesus says this. Well, actually we're quoting somebody who wrote down somebody's recollection of what Jesus somebody's recollection. Yeah.

And there's four different versions of it. There's four different versions of it. So until we get to the point where the person themselves is doing the writing, I mean we can say play doh said this. Play doh said that with a great deal of confidence because play doh was a writer. And we have the original writings, but what he puts into the mouths of other people, well you know, you got to take it with a grain of salt, yeah they came up with.

They came up with thoughts that are more or less permanent thoughts. You know they lived an ordinary life, but they came up with thoughts that are the same of the great advertising people that you quoted. Dean, you're familiar with marketing. How many things do you see that are new? And marketing every year, using new technology, which really are based on some pretty old principles?

Dean: Oh, everything is based on old principles and new vehicles. You know, that's really the big thing, that's what's so. You know, I mean, I think when Joe and I were talking about it with you know, claude Hopkins and Albert Lasker, the thing that people would do then, I mean the big ways of communicating to a mass audience, were with newspaper ads and with magazine ads and billboards and direct mail. You know, that was really the ways of getting in front of people. There were no, there wasn't radio and television and all the. You know all those things.

But all the successful people, you know, even David Ogilvy, you know, years later, founded everything on. You know, basically the principles of Claude Hopkins and going all the way back, you know, those are the things. That's really about human nature. I think, claude Hopkins, if you really look back at his which I read those books every year, I'm an annual reading of the my life in advertising and scientific advertising and essentially what he's describing is, you know, along the lines of Joe, joe Pollis, what's in it for them. That's really the guiding principle which goes all the way back.

So the golden rule you know, that's really the whole thing.

Dan: That interpreted that a new time. Yeah, I'm sure pretty much you taught them and distributed what's going on in these modern times, distributed in the current wrapper.

Dean: Yeah, yeah, I think that's exactly right. I've been really thinking through the. What year did you tell me, dan, that you read about the microchip and you decided that's the thing to hitch your wagon? 1973. 1973. That's what I thought I'm coming up.

Dan: 1973 50 years. Yeah, it's about this time. It's about this time 50 years ago, yeah.

Dean: Yeah, and I've been thinking about, if we were to rewrite the big change book from 1973 to it would eclipse the big changes from 1900 to 1950, you know, when you really think about what webecause, I do think we had that 25-year gap from 1950 to 1975 where it was really like a plateau sort of thing and people.

The biggest winners capitalized on executing with the platform that was laid, with all the tool, everything you know, up to 1950. And I think that's going to be true for the next 25 years. I think we've reached that point here. You know, if you think about where, the more things change, the more they stay the same, you know it really comes down to theit really comes down to the ways that we package the. You know the bedrock things of pictures, text, audio and video. That's really what it comes down to, you know.

And we're at a point now where both in the creation, distribution and access to all of that is at peak levels. You know where there'syou reallyyou know we're seeing it again and again. It's not uncommon now for someone to come out of nowhere and have the number one song in the country. That's notI mean when Old Town Road did it and got the longest running ever number one in the history of the Billboard charts.

There's been this long string of people who've come out of their basements with MacBook making the number one song in the country, because they're riding a wave of being able to access billions of people for free.

Dan: Well, it's interesting. You know Jeff Mattoff Babs and I have been involved in his you know potential Broadway musicals. Now for about six years We've been investors and I've probably had more conversations about this particular play with Jeff than he has had with anyone else, because I see it as a classic entrepreneurial startup. You know what he's creating here but the.

You know the main character and his play personality is the very first, what I would say crossover artist. You can legitimately say he was the first rock and roll artist and this is Lloyd Price, 1951, 1952. But he went from being one of a I think it's 11 children family. He was digging septic tanks and six weeks later, because a set of circumstances at the local radio station, he was asked to just perform something that the head of the recording studio had heard in plain.

Just by chance, it was Laudymus Klaan which was the first number one national hip and he was just playing it and at the same time, a recording company president from Los Angeles was in New Orleans with the thought that I have a sense that there's a new kind of music being written out there and I think New Orleans would be a good place to go to find out. And what it was a tremendous population of really good singers and really good musicians who were black and they came out of the churches so they got their musical training by going to church, you know. And they, you know, they had simple instruments, the voice being the easiest, because you don't have to pay for a voice, you just have to acquire.

Dean: Right.

Dan: You have to acquire one through genetics and so anyway, but he was digging a ditch and six weeks later he was making $10,000 a month. So that's an example of a previous time. I mean, we look back at famous people and we say, well, they were known, but they at one point they weren't known at all. You know, frank Sinatra was just this guy who played in you know sort of bars of sang in New Jersey, whole book in New Jersey, and he you know, he had a good voice.

but it was right when Big Band Music was coming up and somebody says, hey, I heard this guy. He's got a great voice, he's from you know, he's got from across the river, you know in. New Jersey and he went right to the top almost immediately he was the first person who you would equate with someone like you know one of the great stars right now who came along and you know just went right to the top but it was radio. It was radio.

Dean: Yeah, which was that? That was the medium then that was the medium in the 50s. That was the distribution.

Dan: This was the medium in the 30s. This was the medium in the 30s. Yeah, and you know, what the medium was that really created. Rock and roll was the really cheap record player with 45, 45 records 40-inch. Rpm records. That was the great breakthrough, because kids could buy a record player.

Dean: Isn't it interesting that the hit song was really shaped, because you know, three and a half minutes was what you could fit on one of those 45. That's how all the hit songs you know were under under three and a half. Yeah, exactly, so they fit on the 45. That's pretty, like you know, pretty amazing.

Dan: Well, and so, anyway, in the play that Jeff Madhuff Jeff's written a phenomenal play and so he sings for this Hollywood producer and radio station manager, Loddy Mascotti, and he does over the top and they have some musicians in. And there's, they got a guy on piano who was just a local guy and he was somebody. He was a really big, fat guy and he was known as Fats Domino oh wow. Fats, that's who played the piano the first audition was Fats Domino, who wasn't known. You know who wasn't known Right right.

Yeah and anyway. So he gets producers just knocked out by it. He says, okay, so what's on the B side? And Lloyd Price says B side, what's the B side, you know? And everybody thinks this is really funny. You know, and you know I mean you don't have a hit unless you got a B side. You got to have, you got to have a song on the other side. So yeah, but you know, and think of Motown, you know, think of the incredible assembly line system that Barry Gordy created, you know and he got his idea from working in the auto factory.

He worked in one of the big auto factories and he says why can't we produce music the way we produce?

Dean: cars. It's pretty amazing, isn't it? Yeah? And looking at that thing of producing, setting up the things, that's what I think is pretty cool about what's happening right now. If we take that kind of thing it's the you know this production engines. I think that's where it's headed right now. I was reading a book this week it's about 10 years old called Blockbusters, and it was, you know, kind of brought to my attention about what is happening right now. As you know, competition for attention, like the limited diminishing, you know, available attention. The safest thing to do is to focus on creating blockbusters.

That's what the movie studios are doing the most successful things are to focus not on making a lot of movie, a lot of mediocre movies, but to put all their eggs into making better movies. And that's a really interesting thought, right, and an interesting thing of. If we're in a situation where AI and that enablement sort of thing is going to as near as I can tell, the thing people are infatuated with right now is the ability to create reams of mediocre content.

Dan: Well, you know there's a value to that. You know, for seeds to grow you have to have a lot of manure. You know.

It's part of the thing that I think that we're going to really crave the quality quality, quality that can only come from human thought, you know, yeah yeah, yeah, I'm doing this brain course, you know, and it's called neuro potential, and when I'm here in Toronto I it's a clinic in Toronto that I go to they put sensors on my head, they have like yeah like a hair net, but you don't have to put any.

You know, you don't have to put any lubrication, they just fit it on your head and then they look at the screen and you know the sensors are either red or green so they have to move them up levels. So they get that. I think there's 19 of them, 19 sensors. And what I'm going through over a course of a year is retraining my brain so that when I'm sleeping and when I'm awake I'm doing really good awake things Creative work. Yeah, but I buy it. But it had gotten turned around, you know, maybe from birth where.

I was doing a lot of work during the middle of the night when I should have been sleeping. And I was kind of dozing during the day, when I should have been really creative and a period of about I'm about 10 months in now. I'm about 10 months in. I've done about 30 sessions and but in order to do it and keep your mind focused on something, they have a laptop. You look at and there's a. You can choose a movie. You choose a movie to watch.

And it's 40 minutes. So you 40 minutes sessions, so you'll get what's. What are movies? How long? Generally, hour and 30? Yeah, 90 minutes. So I'll get to. So, but what I chose was a ITV from Great Britain. I did an independent television corporation of a series that came out around 2002. I think it was 2002 to 2015. It was called Foils War and it's about a police detective in the town of Hastings, south coast of England, pretty close to Dover.

And it all takes place during the Second World War and a little bit in the Cold War afterwards, but mostly it's a Second World. A phenomenal actor by the name of Michael Kitchen.

And so there's eight seasons of four 100 minute stories, so 400 minutes broken into eight. You know, broken into eight things. So if you get eight times eight, you'll get 64 of these and or you get 32 stories and it's broken right down. You know, probably, and but I just this was in retrospect now because it finished in 2015,. It's considered probably a good lawn with Inspector Morse, if you remember the Inspector Morse stories from the UK.

This is considered the finest of the genre of TV and it's just phenomenally well done and you just appreciate the quality of it, you know and. I'm not watching television, so I'm not seeing any of the latest stuff on television, but this one. I remembered I'd seen it twice, I'd seen it on television, and then I went and bought the disc set and but I'm just, the writing is superb, acting is superb, everything about it is superb. Foils were and and the actor.

I mean it's just incredible, just an incredible actor you know, but you get him for like 13 years, you know they didn't come out they didn't. They came out about. You know they would do a season and then you had to wait a year and you did another season and you know it went on that. But your mention just before I started this very long sidewinder was the thing that I think quality is going to be the important thing now that we have so much quantity that people it's like yeah it's, you know, wanting some really good vegetables after you've been eating sugar for two weeks.

Dean: Oh wait, wait, so you can have all the junk food.

Dan: I want some broccoli with you know, really good broccoli, you know and I, but my sense is it's always been this way. I mean, we tend to think that our times are an exception, but they're not. Is that when you come up with a new way of producing things, you produce a lot of it?

Dean: I think you're absolutely right. I was just reading about how there's a show on Netflix I think it's Netflix, One of the yeah, I think it's Netflix called Yellowstone with Kevin Costner and it you know taking over you know all the streaming things, but the comment on the thing with it they spend almost $20 million per episode of this show and it is just stunning, right Like beautifully visually, everything. You can see where the money goes, you know, in a way it's different, yeah, and I think we kind of crave that, you know. But I think we look at the, you know looking forward, where that is kind of manifested here. You know, I look at, if we take the VCR formula, vision plus capabilities multiplied by reach, that vision is where the amplifier is. The vision is the thing, it's the qualitative. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of a good yeah.

Dan: And you know, and it's not predictable you were talking about the Blackbuster book. You know what we have to do is do a Blackbuster. But for every 20 Blackbusters that are created, maybe three of them make you know the type of profit that they're planning for the other 17, but the other 17 didn't do it, you know.

Dean: I mean, you're looking at this is where you're getting at your that the biggest winners are the people who can make better guesses, and that's that's I think that the biggest winners are people who are not paying attention to actually do what other people are doing. Right, okay.

Dan: Yeah, I mean you talk about the competition to get people's attention. The people who give their attention to other things all the time, I don't think are the people who actually create new things that get people's attention Right? If you're paying attention to what everybody else is doing, you're not paying attention to your own thinking. Yes, I think that's true.

And so somebody who's paying attention on a sort of private line of thinking for a long period of time that isn't really being influenced by what other people are doing, that's usually the person who comes up with something. I mean, Mr Beast is, you know, a great example of that. And that is all he was trying to do was you know, there was a kid, he was 16. He was trying to, you know, he was just trying to get more viewers for his idiosyncratic videos you know, and he only made them because he liked doing the stuff that he was videoing, you know.

I mean he just kind of he'd like to walk into a store and say I'll buy everything in the store if you can pack it up in two hours.

Dean: Right, exactly, yeah, yeah, that's pretty cool, you know yeah.

Dan: And then everybody says oh, that's the secret. No, that's not the secret. The secret is stop paying attention to what Mr Beast is doing and do something else yeah. Yeah.

Dean: Well, I remember, I still remember when you said about you know, the thought that tipped you over to not watching TV was realizing that there's what's going on, I mean in your mind, is better than anything coming out of that box, basically.

Dan: Well, it's better written.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: It's tested a little bit more, I think, Anyway and anyway. So what's your theme that you haven't talked about before, that you've been working on?

Dean: You know, I don't. We witnessed yesterday. I don't know whether you saw the Eric's been following the Dion Sanders store.

Dan: This is a great discovery on my part of Dean's interest. This is the first time that I've known you for 20 years that you ever mentioned a single thing about sports.

Dean: Is that right, Okay. Well, on Sanders, you know took over the head coach role at Colorado University.

Dan: He was at Fort Atlantic, or where was he before?

Dean: Well, he was so Dion Sanders was. He started coaching at Jackson State. He became the head coach of the. That's Mississippi right. Mississippi was a HBCU, a historically black college, you know. So he took over and in two years went, you know, 27 and six, won two national championships. They were undefeated last year and he, you know, became got the invitation to become the head coach of Colorado University, which was maybe the worst team in college football last year, one and 11.

And as far as major, you know, big football, fcs football goes. And so he came in and it's just been an amazing thing to watch this all unfold, because when you watch the on there's not a thought that you know up until yesterday. Yesterday was their first official game, his first official game.

Dan: Well, I went home and looked it up. I looked it up after Babs got your your post that you were watching this and they were playing TCU, which was in the national championship.

Dean: Yes.

Dan: So so that's Texas Christian. And that was and it was a must have been a wild game. The score was certainly a crazy game.

Dean: I mean, it was the most compelling, exciting college football game that I've seen in ages and ages. And that was a nobody thought. You know he came in with 100% confidence that they were going to be. He's got nothing on his mind other than dominating college football.

And it reminds me there's a book by John Elliott, who another Texas guy I think he's at Texas Tech or was at Rice University Sports Psychologist. He wrote a book called over, and one of the common things that he discovered that all overachievers have is what he called irrational confidence, and I thought a great word pair. You know irrational confidence, because who's to say how much confidence is rational? You know who's rationing out the confidence. You know, and it only makes sense that the more you better to be better to have all the confidence than not enough.

Dan: That's what non confident people call a councilman people.

Dean: They're rationally confident Mom, his fingers in mine.

Dan: No, I mean look at from a certain perspective, you can see, you know everything that's not from your perspective is potentially irrational.

Dean: That's the truth, isn't it? But they went in there, and so their first.

Dan: Well, here's the thing, though I read a little bit of history, because you got me going last night.

Dean: Okay.

Dan: I read a little bit of history from him. He was able to pull that off because of a rule change about five years ago which was called the transfer portal transfer portal. Yeah, yeah, and he just aced what you can do with the transfer portal. Just to put some definition to this, You're at one school and you don't like what's going on with your chances of playing first string.

So or you just don't like the coach or you know you don't see, you don't really done the sutures, so it's sort of free agency for college football. So, what you do is you put your name in and you can. You have a certain time period when you have to put your name in and qualify and and then you can switch to another school. Other schools see your name in the portal and they make offers to you.

Dean: You know, so it's free agent for you for college football? Yeah, yeah.

Dan: And and. As if football coaches didn't have enough to worry about, now they got this and he got 71 of them to switch to Colorado.

Dean: Right, exactly Now. A whole new team, 86 new players of the team. Yeah, and everybody thought, nobody thought he'd be able to pull this off.

Dan: I mean no, well, they were huge 21 point underdogs 20.5,.

Dean: 20.5 point underdogs against PCU. My favorite thing I was watching this morning, seeing all the ESPN analysts having to walk back there de facto this is big boy football. He's not just going to waltz in and beat the national runner up.

Dan: It was like, okay, if I can position this properly, his irrational confidence forced them to walk back. All their irrational confidence?

Dean: Oh, absolutely. Well, they didn't have irrational confidence.

Dan: they had rational confidence, that's exactly right. But his thing.

Dean: I mean the combination. His son, shaddur Sanders, the quarterback, and his other son is a safety and they've got this new kid, travis Hunter. So they've got two really viable Heisman Trophy candidates on their team. I mean between Shaddur and Travis Hunter and it was just Shaddur.

They said, well, the reason he was so good, he was just playing against HBCU teams. He can't do that in major college football and he came out through for five and 10 yards, set a school record. Many in the history of Colorado University is thrown for 510 yards in a single game. Four touchdowns. I mean crazy. But it was just such a great, so great that he was so crystal clear on applying. Imagine if you applied yourself essentially where he started out. He's had to imagine that this is we're going to win the national championship and if we're going to do that, what do we need to do and then execute it. You know, I mean that's really the. It's just such a great, a great vision to see because he starts with a crystal clear, pure vision there's no other thought in Deion Sanders' mind when he wakes up, then how are we going to win football?

Dan: games he played at Florida State, I think himself.

Dean: He played at.

Dan: Florida State and then he went to the 49ers right.

Dean: He played for the. Atlanta. He played for the Alps he went to the 49ers. He played for Baltimore.

Dallas, he played for Dallas, for Dallas, and that was yeah, and he played professional baseball for Atlanta, for Cincinnati, and yeah, the guy I mean just such a. All he does is win and that's kind of a great. It's a great thing to see. So I love to watch stories like that.

I'm not traditionally a real college football fan, you know. I mean we wouldn't. I like exciting storylines, like I was. I'm more. I was a big Tim Tebow fan when Tim Tebow was the quarterback for Florida and we were national champions and that was those were, you know Christ good. Those were good years, yeah, twice, and he was Heisman trophy winner and I was, you know, denver Broncos fan when Tim Tebow was the quarterback for that storybook season there, you know. But I just love to, I love to see things like that taking place. So I look at what you know. You look at what what DM was able to accomplish in Jackson State in really three years, two seasons you spent there, and what are you going to be able to do now in probably five years at Colorado? It's going to be amazing to see. You know they. And the thing was I don't know that any other hire in college football had paid as much dividend in one you know one day as hiring Dion Sanders did for call and they didn't even have the money when they hired him.

The guy, rick George, the athletic director. He, you know they signed a contract with Dion for million dollars for five years and they didn't have all the money, you know. But they've raised $28 million from boosters and alumni. They've sold out all of their season tickets and every game already for the whole season.

Dan: It's like you know they'll get on TV now oh yeah, that's compelling.

Dean: I haven't seen the television ratings, but I got to imagine that all I's in college football were on Dallas yesterday, you know yeah.

Dan: Yeah, Well, it's interesting because I mean it's entrepreneurial. I mean you're taking a resource from a lower level of productivity to a higher level. That's the definition of entrepreneurism. Yeah, but it's got a lot of great story, and he's a great talker too.

Dean: I've seen him interview.

Dan: Yeah, he's really smart, he's really funny, you know, and you know I mean he's. You know he's the all pro of all pros for defensive backs, I mean he's one of the greatest defensive backs. You know, he's kind of like the Jim Brown for the defense. He's sort of that type of player.

Dean: Yeah, there's never been anybody better. Yeah, exactly.

Dan: I mean Jim Brown. When I was 12 years old or 13 years old, I went to my first Cleveland Brown football game and that was rookie year for Jim Brown and that, while it was against the Rams, he was playing against the Rams and he broke the record for the most yards in one game. He scored four touchdowns and this was his rookie season. You know, you could just tell the way that people bounced off him that he was in for a great career you know, and there.

I mean you take the Another five great running backs and you have an interview with them. I'm mentioning this because I actually saw the other night on YouTube and it was you know, it was, you know, the cream of the crop from running backs. And they said who is the greatest running back? And they said Jim Brown, jim Brown. I said nobody could touch Jim and these are the greatest themselves, for their teams, for their times, and they said you know, Jim Brown was the greatest player but, Dion Sanders has that quality on that.

If that's he's, he's sort of you know that does Dan Sullivan among coaches. And he was a showboat kind of guy too. I mean Dion Sanders was a real showboat, real entertainer.

Dean: He was a rationally confident.

Dan: Yeah.

Dean: Oh, that's really what that is.

Dan: Yeah, but he's lost before. That's a good term. That's a good term.

Dean: Yeah, I like it. People say kind of thing.

Dan: See, people don't ask for it now. People want to be confident. The thing you want to be is irrationally confident.

Dean: Yeah, give yourself as much. Dial that up to 11. I mean, since you're going to work anyway, right.

Dan: Don't go half, don't go one-tenth the way rational Confidence is rational. Confidence is one-tenth. You're you're sure changing yourself.

Dean: Well, what do you talk about? You know, it's the whole 10 times thing, you know, you mentioned that it has to start with a vision of 10 times. What would that just actually? What would that be? What does that look like?

Dan: Yeah, since you're going to put in the work anyway.

Dean: Yeah, and you've done it already. If you've been in business for any about a time. You've probably already 10 times.

Dan: Yeah, but I'll keep my. I'll keep an eye out on this. I mean, I wouldn't have really paid any attention to it except you mentioned it yesterday to BAP. So I said, oh and, and I knew who he was, of course, and I knew he had dumbs on some great coaching at a lower level. But I and then I went back and I read through two or three articles. Which is a great part about. The internet is you can read about something, and then you could look up a whole series of other articles and you know, but he's got you know.

I mean now you'll see the portal fill up for next year. Everybody wants to play for Deion Sanders. Oh, my goodness. I mean well, they're you know that game and no other team will want to play them.

Dean: Oh man, I mean now, if you're Nebraska, you know now that's next in Colorado coming in this weekend to to call a lot of fresh off that big win.

Dan: Yeah, nebraska's not that great a team.

Dean: Okay.

Dan: They. They moved over to the big 10 and they were. I mean, they used to be the you know, they used to be the gods of football. Yeah 25, 30 years ago they were yeah, nebraska was an amazing team, but they moved into the big 10, which is now the big 16 or something like that. And, but they, those are really big 10, you know the C and the.

Atlanta Coast Conference are really the three conferences now. That are great teams. Yeah, yeah, I was reading an article the other day about sports, you know, and they still say that about twice as many high school boys play football than they do any other sport.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: That's interesting. Well, the teams are I mean? I mean first of all I mean on the offense and defense, you have 22, and then you got some specialists like the kickers and everything like that. So here that gives us a lot of room for a lot of boys to play football.

Dean: Yeah, what's the state of hockey in Canada now?

Dan: I remember when I was.

Dean: Yeah, I mean, I was growing up. It was like mandatory military service. Oh yeah, you know when. Yeah, you, since you can start skating, and then the hand just thick, oh yeah.

Dan: There's no real change yeah.

Dean: Anyway.

Dan: I should tell you an interesting story when I came to Toronto in 1971. So 52 years ago and. I was at an ad agency, I was a writer, fairly, you know, bbdo big global agency, toronto branch and immediately I got there and I realized I better find out something about hockey.

I won't be able to talk to anybody, so so this one guy said you know they were talking about the great players Gordie Howe, bobby Hall, bobby or, you know, these were all great. You know Murray's Richard, rocket Richard they were mentioning all these names and this guy remember he was an art director, same as Tony Cooper and Tony said you know. He said there's a kid playing out in Brampton, nearby city. It's Brampton or Brantford, I'm not sure which Brantford.

Dean: Brantford, yeah, brantford.

Dan: And he said he's going to be the greatest hockey player of all time. And it was like this, 1971. So he was like 13 or 14, 13 or 14 years old. And he said just his name is Gretzky, wayne Gretzky. And he said, and that in those days, like the Toronto Star, on the weekends they gave all the hockey leagues in the Toronto area, you know the different divisions and they had about eight teams and then they gave the scoring and so you'd normally the top scorer in the league would be. You know, let's say it was near the end of the season. Then he had 50 goals and he had the 50th DSS.

You know he had a hundred points. And then you go to the league that Wayne Gretzky is in and he has 340 points. Oh man. He's got like he's got like 170 goals and the 170 assists, you know. And then, and so I started, you know, just out of curiosity, I started the check in and every league he jumped to another league and it was still 300 goals.

Dean: And then as soon as he could.

Dan: when he was I think he was, I think he was underage she was like 17 years old.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: He went to play for one of the in a newly.

Dean: Indianapolis.

Dan: I think he played for Indianapolis and then he went to Edmonton as soon as he was 18 and you know. The rest is history, you know. But yeah, it's really right. I mean, they're just unique and a million different ways. They're really great ones, they, but my sense is they don't get great by paying attention to what other people are doing.

They, it's like the Palmer lucky who created I knew he was an abundance 360 last year, with Peter Diamandis, and Mer asked a question along the lines of you know, you know. You've created great things at age 30. You've already been enormously successful. So what's your dream? What dreams do you follow? And Tucker Palmer, lucky, says I don't follow my dreams, I follow my talent. Yeah, I just pay attention to what my talent is and where's the best opportunity for my talent. I think that's probably true of all the great ones we're talking to.

They're not, they don't have a big dream, they have a big talent and they just pick the spots where they think is the best use of their talent going forward.

Dean: Yeah, yeah, I think that's, that's a pretty and, you know, luckily, right now we've never had a better opportunity for, you know, code of Lee plugging in to other opportunities, you know. I think I look at this. That's where a lot of my thinking has been going in the last little while. Here is the VCR formula as an organizing and collaborative platform and really strengthening where my talent is in the vision of these things you know and looking at there's any capability, it's axiomatic.

Dan: There's a word axiom is that it's a self-evident truth.

Dean: Okay, yeah.

Dan: And VCR is a self-evident truth. You have to have a vision. You have to have capability and you have to have reach. You can't argue with that. You know it's not something. I mean, you say it and people say, yeah, that's right, you know. So that's. A system starts with an axiom, so you've got your axiom. Mine was Voda. You have a vision, and then you have the opposite to the vision. And then you take the opposition and you transform the vision into action and the action creates the vision. What do you think?

Dean: about that. Well, imagine if you applied yourself. I mean, that's really what.

Dan: Yeah, well, people do something different with. I think the distinction among people is that people who are Innovators do something different with opposition a shrink from it.

Dean: You know, I mean other people, I mean, you know, normal people.

Dan: Most people shrink from it or use it as a way they interpreted as proof that it can't be done.

Dean: Yeah, See, that can't be done.

Dan: I can't be done.

Dean: Yeah, yeah, wow, and I think that the Thing about you know what the great ops, one of the great obstacles that's been taken away from us, is the needing of approval of a gatekeeper all the gatekeepers have been removed. You know, because you don't know even the. You know even music. The fifth is bill required Somebody in a gatekeeper position to discover Lloyd's right. Yeah, and give him, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, that's Absolutely true.

Dan: Now you're using the Dion Sanders Example anybody who? Hires you. It's actually a gatekeeper.

Dean: Yeah, that's true.

Dan: Yeah, I mean he had I think it was Bobby Bowden that Florida State was Netcoach.

Dean: Bobby Bowden was the coach, but you know there's a little. There's an interesting thing now that they you know they passed on beyond as there because they recently hired a new head coach and Dion was seemed like a natural in the conversation and they went another direction.

Dan: Yeah well, they won't make him a serious way at Florida State until Colorado beats the crap.

Dean: Yeah, that's exactly right.

Dan: Whatever, whatever we don't schedule Colorado.

Dean: Man, oh man. You know I just think it's so awesome, so it's gonna be a great compelling story to just watch unfold.

Dan: It's good too. It's good for the times we need that type of person.

Dean: Yeah, yes, absolutely, I think it's really. But I think that there's the thing you imagine how many people if we just had that irrational confidence in Setting that big a vision, as you know, as we can imagine for ourselves this is a really the only I think Peter D Mondes said that too, that really in this World, that.

But I saw something with him and him and Salim their new exponential Organizations book. You know that our biggest thing now is really Underestimating what's possible for us. Think that's really the thing that holds people back the most is Underestimating what we're capable of.

Dan: Well, yeah, I think it's highly individual, so you know it's to me. I don't think that there's really general lessons here. That's. You know, I like the Palmer lucky one just a little bit better, because the its first requirement Is that you figure out what your talent is.

Dean: Okay and then you go looking.

Dan: Okay, so what's the next best opportunity for my talent? I mean, you can pretty well explain the on Sanders Journey that he's got a talent and you know he can do something with his talent now. And yeah, yeah, that's interesting We've got. I've got a topic for one of our future and says called the great meltdown. It's just an idea that I came up with, and melt is acronym, and the acronym me, lt, stands for money, energy, labor and transportation, and Wow, I said mine.

The last 30 years when everybody said things were going exponential, was a unique period in history where four things were really cheap Money was really cheap, energy was really cheap, labor was really cheap and Transportation was really cheap. And in the last three years each of those has gotten more and more expensive and you can feel things slowing down. So my sense is that we're in for a great slowdown period and we talked about this. We talked about those in relationship to the big change.

Yeah and my sense is that all this same things are just going to become the Exponentials are going to go exponential? I don't think they are, because they require money, energy, labor and transportation, and if all those things are slowing down. So my sense is that a lot of the really kind of interesting innovations Going to be those where people are doing a lot with very restricted resources.

Dean: Oh yeah, I mean that that sounds a lot like Peter's.

Dan: I am just had that video oh yeah, yeah, the six Technologies you had one of the limits of innovation. Yeah, the limits of innovation yeah, and anyway, yeah, see the very think what he can do with iPhone.

Dean: Oh man, I know exactly.

Dan: All he needs is an iPhone and Colorado mountains, yeah that's exactly.

Dean: It mostly him just walking and talking. Colorado walking talk.

Dan: Yeah, yeah. Bab sent him an email the other day and he got. He answered right back. I mean, she got, oh yeah, which I found amazing, and he says how do you keep the camera so steady? And he says that zoom, zoom Doesn't zoom. Scott, I equalizer.

Dean: So he said I don't know he reports it on zoom. Oh, that's interesting.

Dan: Yeah, I record, sit on zoom and so he said the eddy says so I don't have to worry about my walking.

Dean: The room will automatically. It must be a very sophisticated and the iPhone does that. Yeah, exactly, yeah, very cool.

Dan: Yeah, yeah, but anyway, and he's Colorado too, so I mean Colorado is. Great things, great things are happening in Colorado, exactly right, who knew?

Dean: well, nobody could see it coming.

Dan: Nobody expects the unexpected. Yeah, dad, but irrational confidence pull this one, that's right. That's right, alrighty Dean.

Dean: Okay, I'll always delightful. I will talk to you next week same time. All right, bye. Thanks, dan, bye.