Udi Ledergor was employee #13 at Gong and the first marketer.

He's a legendary CMO.

Not only did he help build one of the most impressive businesses in SaaS, he built one of the most impressive teams.

People like Russel Banzon (now CMO @ Cresta), Chris Orlob, Devin Reed, Sheena Badani came out of his talent factory.

He came on my podcast to talk about:

* Best practices marketing vs. corageous marketing.

* How to keep boldness in the culture as your team grows.

* Why "different is better than better".

* Why "story-audience fit" matters more than storytelling skills and how to test it properly.

* How AI and modern tools can amplify courageous marketing strategy (but never replace it).

And more.

My favorite takeaways:

1️⃣ "Different is better than better" (and better than boring 'best practices')

By the time something becomes a "best practice," everyone is doing it. If you want extraordinary results, you have to break away. It's risky, but not as risky as getting lost is the sea of sameness.

2️⃣ Simple marketing measurement trumps fancy attribution.

You don't need complex attribution to prove if something works. If it really works, you'll feel it. And if something flops, you'll feel that too. Focusing on clear signals rather than trying to track every micro-conversion frees marketers up to take bigger swings.

3️⃣ Subject matter experts can be your best marketers

Legendary marketers like Chris Orlob or Devin Reed weren't legendary marketers when Udi hired them. They just knew their persona cold. I think this will continue to prove a competitive advantage as AI enables anyone to create AI slop content.

4️⃣ Every touchpoint is a brand moment

From privacy policy emails to webinar invitations, every customer interaction shapes perception. Treat the smallest details as opportunities to reinforce your differentiated brand experience.

5️⃣ ICP Discipline is a competitive advantage

Amit, their CEO would consistently say no to short-term revenue in the early days because he knew it would distract, drain, and diffuse focus. Easy to say, hard to do, but so valuable if you can maintain that focus.

This was one of my favorite episodes.

If you want to learn more from Udi, I can't recommend his book enough. It's a must-read for any marketer looking to level up.

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