On June 18 the Supreme Court of the United States ruled on US v. Skrmetti, deciding whether a Tennessee law prohibiting certain medical interventions on youngsters violates the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment. The Hon. Elspeth Cypher (ret.) a.k.a. Judge TERF joins the Dorx to dissect the case, the decision, the concurrences, and the dissents. Which concurrence is best, Thomas’s or Barrett’s? Does Justice Sotomayor suffer from pathological empathy? If Skrmetti were a pasta, what type of sauce would be best on it? Plus Nina mis-sexes Chase Strangio (whoops!), Cori’s gender is Jewish, and Judge TERF solves the crisis in the Middle East.

Links:

US v. Skrmetti Decision, June 18 2025: https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/24pdf/23-477_2cp3.pdf

Judging US v Skrmetti with Judge TERF, December 2024: https://heterodorx.substack.com/p/judging-us-v-skrmetti-with-judge-891

Cori posts on Thomas’ concurrence: https://x.com/heterodorx/status/1935380685490880949

JD Vance tweets a screenshot of a post on Bluesky reposting Cori’s screenshot from Twitter (what?): https://x.com/JDVance/status/1935457852082016556

How The Transgender Rights Movement Bet On The Supreme Court and Lost by Nicholas Confessore (NYT): https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/19/magazine/scotus-transgender-care-tennessee-skrmetti.html?unlocked_article_code=1.QE8.JUql.PEoYV35S-FVz&smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

Our episode on NYT podcast The Protocol: https://heterodorx.substack.com/p/episode-171-poop-and-protocol

Glenna Goldis Bad Facts: https://badfacts.substack.com/

Ilya Shapiro - Lawless: https://manhattan.institute/book/lawless-the-miseducation-of-americas-elites

WoLF: https://womensliberationfront.org/

How old is Cori? Will the NYT podcast The Protocol change minds? Is there any competence in the Trump administration? Why is Nina’s cat pooping on the floor? These questions and more are asked, but not entirely answered, as we move in and out of the fetal position, name-drop various GC power players, and read aloud comments from another podcast’s subreddit.

Important note: Cori is COMPLETELY WRONG about last week’s timeline: Nina wrote about her cat 2 days after we recorded last time. Is his muddled thinking a symptom of estrogen withdrawal, or turning 50? SO MANY QUESTIONS

Links:

Pussy Whipped (Nina’s blog): https://blog.ninapaley.com/2025/06/07/pussy-whipped/

Informed Dissent analysis of The Protocol: Part 1

Part 2:

Missing from NYT's podcast THE PROTOCOL (Glenna Goldis on X): https://x.com/glennagoldis/status/1930969733748113531

Elliot Page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elliot_Page

Kinnon MacKinnon https://www.yorku.ca/positivechange/2022/06/24/kinnon-mackinnon/

Dude Looks Like A Lady (Aerosmith):

The comments we read from the Blocked & reported subReddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/BlockedAndReported/comments/1l1971t/comment/mwmctet/

Credit Is Due (The Attribution Song):

The Young Generation (Cori) reaches out to the Old Generation (Nina) and exhibits patience while pretending to listen to geezer tales of things that go wrong with body parts and the SSDI Blue Book. Then we get into the hip, happenin’, swingin’ NOW with the latest news on gay martyrs, fake martyrs, and trans martyrs. Nina consents to Cori’s exposition on immigration, and somehow gets stuck comparing illiberal policy to her Junior High school cafeteria. Plus: tribal identities, Cori’s synagogue, lenses, spicy food, organ recitals, Title VII, cooling sheets, and a surprisingly out-of-character bathroom joke.

Cori and Nina may not be equals, but they are co-hosts, which is about as close as we can get in this life.

Links

SSDI Blue Book: https://www.ssa.gov/disability/professionals/bluebook/AdultListings.htm

https://blog.ninapaley.com/2025/05/31/illustrating-the-ssdi-blue-book/

Jonathan Joss: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/jonathan-joss-killing-police-records-neighbor-dispute-rcna210670

Matthew Shepard: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/26/the-truth-behind-americas-most-famous-gay-hate-murder-matthew-shepard

Cori is almost 50, and Nina is 57 going on 80. We discuss bronchiectasis, health hazards, witchcraft, hypertonic saline, nebulizers, oxygen monitors, IQ tests, lifesaving gender-denying healthcare, pulmonology, and being a delicate flower. Cori gives a speech, doesn’t quit his job, and asks: at what age did we become adults? Why was he kicked out of his mom’s house at age 17? How do you pronounce ‘syncytial’? Covid may have taken decades off Nina’s life, but this episode will take less than an hour off yours.

Links:

Cori’s speech: https://x.com/heterodorx/status/1920583202114027686

Respiratory syncytial virus (RSV): https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/respiratory-syncytial-virus/symptoms-causes/syc-20353098

Nina’s illness art: https://blog.ninapaley.com/category/crohns/

Maryn Cadell - The Pope

After several conversations about antidepressants, the Dorx welcome back pediatrician Dr. Julia Mason, who prescribes Selective Seretonin Reuptake Inhibitors (SSRIs) to young people. Do we even know what these drugs do to developing brains? How do antidepressants compare with “gender-affirming care”? Does Barlean’s Fish Oil really taste like lemon custard? We also talk about myelnation, the distress of youth, the parasympathetic nervous system, neurotransmitters, immunosuppression, social costs and benefits of treatments, wildly swinging trends in medicine, unintended consequences, public schools, and the over-diagnoses of Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD). Medical institutions have a lot to answer for, but at least we have Nampons for nosebleeds.

Links:

Nampons: https://nampons.com/

SEGM: https://segm.org/about_us

Feminist blogger with Crohn’s Disease: https://cannabisrefugeeesq.wordpress.com/2018/03/27/cannabis-refugee-esq/

Nina on Prozac: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2025/02/08/back-on-zac/

myelination: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myelination

Barlean’s Fish Oil https://www.barleans.com/collections/fish-oils/products/seriously-delicious-omega-3-fish-oil-lemon-creme

Listening to Prozac: https://www.peterdkramer.com/new-page

The Noonday Demon: https://andrewsolomon.com/books/the-noonday-demon/

Xeno’s Paradox: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno%27s_paradoxes#Dichotomy_paradox

Julia Mason on the Chain of Trust in Medicine:

Hunter in a Farmer’s World by Thom Hartmann: https://www.hunterinafarmersworld.com/

NYT: Have We Been Thinking About ADHD All Wrong? https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/13/magazine/adhd-medication-treatment-research.html?campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20250413&instance_id=152482&nl=the-morning®i_id=58030095&segment_id=195907&user_id=a173f8835e89df3e22af711782032be9

Jamie Reed also recommends Nampons: https://x.com/JamieWhistle

Our 2023 Julia Mason interview: https://www.heterodorx.com/podcast/episode-105-pediatric-disenchantment-with-julia-mason-md/

Cori is a hard-working corporate employee who dutifully contributes to America’s tax base. Nina is a low-income artist with Crohn’s Disease whose medical expenses make her a net parasite, despite also paying taxes. After a surprise performance of improvised music by soda-can virtuoso Cori, we discuss tariffs, security, Medicaid, FICA, “maxing out contributions,” Incidence of Taxation, employment benefits, monetary incentives, distortions, the Tragedy of the Commons, suckers, rationalizations, population collapse/explosion, and episodic disability. Is art, work? How hard is it to be poor? Can air be privatized? Like Life itself, our tax/benefits system isn’t fair, and it cannot go on forever. So a big Thank You to all American taxpayers who support unproductive, under-productive, post-productive, and ill members of society like your show-notes writer.

Links:

Leta Boylan testimony

Terminator 2: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103064/

Tragedy of the Commons: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

The Economist on more people claiming entitlements: https://www.economist.com/britain/2025/04/02/the-tyranny-of-tiktokkers-who-turn-up

Cori travels from statehouse to statehouse to testify against the worst excesses of gender ideology, while Nina gets sick for a month and loses her voice and relevance. Cori shares news from New Hampshire, where heterodox Democrat Jonah Wheeler is subject to a struggle session; Nina shares about watching television and playing Lexulous. Our lives couldn’t be more different, but we come back together to argue about AI art, neurodivergence, diagnosis skepticism, the attention economy, and ice cream. Our new slogan is “Bring Back Retardation!” and we’re doing our part.

Links

Jonah Wheeler breaks ranks with Democrats: https://x.com/Sidewalk_Steve/status/1902818393373413728

Jonah Wheeler struggle/listening session:

Cones ice cream (closed): https://www.yelp.com/biz/cones-artisanal-ice-cream-new-york

Winter, a trans kid: https://x.com/LGBCourage/status/1899180045870010722

Yarden Silveira: https://www.city-journal.org/article/yarden-silveira-death-transgender-surgery-complications?utm_source=virtuous&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=cjdaily

Ash Hall: https://www.aclutx.org/en/biographies/ash-hall

Ovarit shutting down: https://ovarit.com/o/Announcements/676340/ovarit-is-closing

Severance: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11280740/

Autism self-diagnosis: https://x.com/buttonslives/status/1906851869106082120

B******t Jobs by David Graeber: https://cominsitu.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/david-graeber-b******t-jobs-a-theory-1.pdf

episodic disability: https://episodicdisabilities.ca/home.php

You Be Illin’ - RUN DMC:

Following up on our June 2021 episode What If We Win? the Dorx ask whether we have won the gender wars yet. While discussing weak arguments, bad journalism, wrong pronouns, diversity of tactics, tolerance, metallurgy, the responsibility of power, and Cori’s “boys,” still more questions arise: Why are people who know better still referring to men as women? Who coddles the coddlers? Is a Liberal’s true authentic self an Authoritarian? How do you pronounce “Maori”? Listen to this episode for answers, and remember to STAY MARGINAL!

Links:

What If We Win? Heterodorx June 2021 episode: https://www.heterodorx.com/podcast/episode-21-what-if-we-win/

Blocked & reported Zizians episode: https://www.blockedandreported.org/p/episode-247-the-zizians-reign-of

Informed Dissent podcast on Brianna Wu: https://informeddissentpodcast.substack.com/p/episode-12-the-babies-are-in-charge

Nina’s Tweet about pronouns: https://x.com/ninapaley/status/1893348769053254076

Conservative NZ church hakka disrupts Pride parade: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOjP-L8acU8&ab_channel=AllBlacks

Rumspringa: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rumspringa

Cori suddenly pivots to surprise Nina with an unexpected interview about her lifelong mental health affliction and the medication she takes to manage it. What is the difference between grief and depression? Should you “feel your feelings” when your feelings are broken? What is serotonin? Which is a better theory of the brain: etchings or bike gears? We know very little about brains, which raises another question: can we talk to an SSRI expert?

This is actually a pretty good discussion about depression and antidepressants, which is why we made it its own episode (the previous half is Episode 163: Cori’s Boobs Break The Internet.)

Link:

Back on ‘Zac by Nina: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2025/02/08/back-on-zac/

More than what you ever needed to know about Cori’s breasts! Are they real? Are they implants? Are they gynecomastia? Whatever you call them (Cori calls them “the Boys”) they never fail to upset certain people on Twitter. Plus: Cori’s sweater, Cori’s scarf, Cori’s weight, Cori’s latest testimony at the Indiana Statehouse, Cori’s political opponents, and — as if that weren’t enough — Cori’s conversion to Judaism!

We broke this episode in two because Part Two is about something completely different.

Links:

KJK goes after Cori: https://x.com/heterodorx/status/1889852099518955762

Cori’s testimony: https://x.com/heterodorx/status/1889695879658938488

Sia Liilii: https://nevadawolfpack.com/sports/womens-volleyball/roster/sia-liilii/11631

Chris Daley, Indiana ACLU: https://www.aclu-in.org/en/biographies/chris-daley