In this second part of her conversation with Robert Nicastro, theologian and spiritual teacher Sheri Kling deepens the discussion on how process and open and relational theologies can reshape our spiritual lives.

What does it mean to pray into immanence rather than plead to a distant deity? How can our rituals and symbols come alive again when they're held with spaciousness? And what does faith beyond belief look like in a world longing for depth and connection?

Sheri shares how process theology transforms worship, preaching, and community life—and offers tools for religious leaders hoping to revive faith without falling into dogma. From quantum entanglement to Ezekiel’s dry bones, she invites us to imagine a God intimately present in all things, calling us toward healing, renewal, and co-creative hope.

Later in the episode, Sheri reflects on spiritual maturity, recovering from toxic religion, and why deconstruction must give way to reconstruction rooted in wonder, trust, and love.

ABOUT SHERI KLING

“We are a fragmented people in a fragmented world—but when we begin to think with a more integrative, relational vision of reality, faith can come alive again. We discover that we matter, we belong, and we can participate in the sacred work of a whole-making cosmos.”

Sheri D. Kling, Ph.D., is a writer, theologian, songwriter, and spiritual teacher who serves as director of Process & Faith with the Center for Process Studies, interim minister of Redeemer Lutheran Church in Bradenton, Florida, and teaches regularly for the Haden Institute and Claremont School of Theology, from which she earned her doctorate. She is the author of A Process Spirituality: Christian and Transreligious Resources for Transformation and editor of Renewing Faith: Reigniting Faith and Ministry through Process and Open & Relational Theologies. She speaks, teaches, and leads retreats on spirituality, theology, and transformation, and her work can be found online at sherikling.com and her Substack, The Sacred Everywhere.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this episode of Hunger for Wholeness, Robert Nicastro welcomes back theologian, minister, and director of Process and Faith, Dr. Sheri Kling, for a rich conversation on the power of theology to renew spiritual life in a fragmented world.

Sheri shares the story behind Renewing Faith, a newly released collection of essays emerging from a 2025 conference that brought together voices exploring how process and open and relational theology can breathe new life into Christian practice. Together, she and Robert unpack how these movements offer a vision of God not as a distant, all-controlling force, but as a deeply relational presence—persuasive, not coercive, and intimately involved in the unfolding of creation.

Throughout the episode, Sheri explains key theological ideas in everyday terms, weaving in science, mysticism, and lived experience. She reflects on her own journey from Jungian psychology to process thought, and how this path gave her a more integrated, healing view of God, suffering, and spiritual wholeness.

Later, Sheri offers a profound reimagining of divine power—sharing a story from Proverbs of Ashes that illustrates how a theology of persuasive love can make space for grief, agency, and hope.

ABOUT SHERI KLING

“We are a fragmented people in a fragmented world—but when we begin to think with a more integrative, relational vision of reality, faith can come alive again. We discover that we matter, we belong, and we can participate in the sacred work of a whole-making cosmos.”

Sheri D. Kling, Ph.D., is a writer, theologian, songwriter, and spiritual teacher who serves as director of Process & Faith with the Center for Process Studies, interim minister of Redeemer Lutheran Church in Bradenton, Florida, and teaches regularly for the Haden Institute and Claremont School of Theology, from which she earned her doctorate. She is the author of A Process Spirituality: Christian and Transreligious Resources for Transformation and editor of Renewing Faith: Reigniting Faith and Ministry through Process and Open & Relational Theologies. She speaks, teaches, and leads retreats on spirituality, theology, and transformation, and her work can be found online at sherikling.com and her Substack, The Sacred Everywhere.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

Ilia Delio welcomes back Rev. Dr. Hillary Raining to probe a live question for faith communities today: when our concepts of God become narrow—or distorted—how do they derail spiritual growth and even undermine justice? Hillary names the fears that keep churches clinging to old power structures, and offers a pastoral imagination big enough for an evolving, more-than-abstract God. From “theology police” moments in grief care to the responsibility we bear as Christ’s body, she invites a shift from transactional religion to a life transfigured by love.

The conversation moves into language itself. Do words like Christ and God still help? Hillary shares why she often leads with “Spirit” in wider settings, why the church still needs a reclaimed Christ-language, and how wisdom and creation-energy weave through our lives. Drawing on her Indigenous heritage, she describes practices of reciprocity with the land and how those experiences shape a joyful, resilient path forward for St. Columba’s: centers of prayer and discernment where head and heart meet, contemplation births action, and hope endures.

ABOUT REV. DR. HILLARY RAINING

“The emotional and physical lives of our ancestors… fundamentally affect our emotional and physical lives as well… The practice of gratitude… changes—not only those who practice it—but also the generations that follow.”

The Rev. Dr. Hillary Raining is an Episcopal Priest serving as Rector at St. Columba’s in Washington, D.C. She is also the founder of The Hive (www.thehiveapiary.com), an online spirituality and wellness community. Actively involved in the Episcopal Church, she served on multiple committees and as a professor and consultant for various Seminaries. She is also a published writer and a sought-after public speaker. With several degrees and certifications in theology, liturgy, psychology, trauma integration, yoga, and forest therapy, she seeks to empower others through healing and spiritual direction while leading innovative ministry projects.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this episode of Hunger for Wholeness, Ilia Delio talks with Episcopal priest and spiritual director Rev. Dr. Hillary Raining about what happens when public life shows up in the parish—how pastors can hold political tension without letting church life collapse into partisanship, and why hope and joy remain non-negotiable in a polarized age. Together they explore a renewed mystical imagination for Christianity: experience that leads to transformation, and transformation that bears fruit in justice.

Hillary reflects on leading a large Washington, D.C. congregation where worship must flow into weekday service while also tending the inner life. Along the way, the conversation names the fatigue and anxiety many younger adults carry (economy, climate, AI) and re-centers practices that steady courage: prayer, community, and a lively sense of God’s presence. Later, Ilia and Hillary speak candidly about serving as women in systems marked by patriarchy, and what an integrated, humane faith might look like now.

ABOUT REV. DR. HILLARY RAINING

“The emotional and physical lives of our ancestors… fundamentally affect our emotional and physical lives as well… The practice of gratitude… changes—not only those who practice it—but also the generations that follow.”

The Rev. Dr. Hillary Raining is an Episcopal Priest serving as Rector at St. Columba’s in Washington, D.C. She is also the founder of The Hive (www.thehiveapiary.com), an online spirituality and wellness community. Actively involved in the Episcopal Church, she served on multiple committees and as a professor and consultant for various Seminaries. She is also a published writer and a sought-after public speaker. With several degrees and certifications in theology, liturgy, psychology, trauma integration, yoga, and forest therapy, she seeks to empower others through healing and spiritual direction while leading innovative ministry projects.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this episode of Hunger for Wholeness, Robert Nicastro continues his conversation with philosopher Don Viney. Together, they explore Teilhard de Chardin’s vision of a planetary mind—asking whether today’s global networks are cultivating consciousness and love, or tempting us to worship technology for its own sake.

What happens when tools eclipse persons? When CGI and AI overwhelm story and relationship? Viney contrasts spectacle with narrative and argues that technology should serve the growth of consciousness—embodiment, compassion, and responsibility—rather than replace it. He also pushes back on disembodied transhumanist dreams, advocating for a deeply human path forward.

Later in the episode, Robert and Don turn to “building the earth,” love as the axis of evolution, and a daring theology of the “not-yet”—where God’s actuality grows in relationship with the world. Along the way, they consider citizenship of the universe and Teilhard’s incandescent hope that humanity might one day “master the energies of love.”

ABOUT DON VINEY

“True love unites in such a way as to augment rather than to diminish the personalities of those caught in its Fire.”

Donald Wayne Viney, Ph.D. received degrees in philosophy from Colorado State University (1977) and the University of Oklahoma (1979, 1982). He is a three-time recipient of the title “University Professor” at Pittsburg State University (Kansas) where he taught from 1984 until his retirement in 2022. He is the author of Charles Hartshorne and the Existence of God (1985), senior editor of Hartshorne’s Creative Experiencing: A Philosophy of Freedom (2011), and co-author, with George W. Shields, of The Mind of Charles Hartshorne: A Critical Examination (2020). He has written extensively on the nineteenth century Breton philosopher, Jules Lequyer, and published two books of translations of Lequyer’s writings. In addition, he is the author of dozens of scholarly articles and reviews on a variety of topics, including six articles on Teilhard de Chardin and an annotated translation of Marcel Brion’s 1951 interview with Teilhard. He serves on the editorial boards of Process Studies and the American Journal of Theology and Philosophy. Viney is also a singer-songwriter.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this episode of Hunger for Wholeness, Robert Nicastro sits down with philosopher and musician Don Viney to trace his journey from the arts to philosophy—and the unexpected conversion that led him to process thought. Together, they explore the creative tension between art and thought, and how beauty, music, and literature often touch places philosophical language cannot reach.

Don shares formative moments from studying with Charles Hartshorne and his early fascination with Teilhard de Chardin—unpacking how Teilhard’s evolutionary mysticism resonates with those seeking meaning in a fragmented world. Along the way, the conversation wrestles with non-toxic, life-giving concepts of God and what makes a metaphysical vision truly satisfying in a scientific age.

Later in the episode, Viney reflects on Teilhard’s radical hope, personhood at the heart of the cosmos, and the power of process thinking to awaken a fresh sense of spiritual responsibility.

ABOUT DON VINEY

“True love unites in such a way as to augment rather than to diminish the personalities of those caught in its Fire.”

Donald Wayne Viney, Ph.D. received degrees in philosophy from Colorado State University (1977) and the University of Oklahoma (1979, 1982). He is a three-time recipient of the title “University Professor” at Pittsburg State University (Kansas) where he taught from 1984 until his retirement in 2022. He is the author of Charles Hartshorne and the Existence of God (1985), senior editor of Hartshorne’s Creative Experiencing: A Philosophy of Freedom (2011), and co-author, with George W. Shields, of The Mind of Charles Hartshorne: A Critical Examination (2020). He has written extensively on the nineteenth century Breton philosopher, Jules Lequyer, and published two books of translations of Lequyer’s writings. In addition, he is the author of dozens of scholarly articles and reviews on a variety of topics, including six articles on Teilhard de Chardin and an annotated translation of Marcel Brion’s 1951 interview with Teilhard. He serves on the editorial boards of Process Studies and the American Journal of Theology and Philosophy. Viney is also a singer-songwriter.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this episode of Hunger for Wholeness, Sr. Ilia Delio continues her conversation with neuroanthropologist Terrence Deacon. Together, they explore how we might “fall up” into a collective future—probing the limits of machines and minds, and why complexity in nature often emerges not by work, but by play.

What happens when we mistake computation for thinking? When our tools become mirrors and we fall for our own reflection? From Plato’s worry about writing to today’s large language models, Deacon asks how outsourcing our capacities can both diminish autonomy and unlock astonishing, shared intelligence—raising new questions about freedom, dependence, and human flourishing.

Later in the episode, Sr. Ilia and Deacon trace “falling up” through biology—hemoglobin’s elegant duplications, altruism, and the rule of play—before turning to the noosphere: a future where persons remain distinct yet increasingly interdependent. Along the way they weigh the risks of “queen bee” totalisms against the promise of a freer, more cooperative species life.

ABOUT TERRENCE DEACON

“Almost everything we do is with respect to something that doesn’t yet exist… All of our actions… are really about that absence. I actually think that this is the essence of what it means for something to be alive.”

Professor Terrence Deacon is Distinguished Professor emeritus at the University of California, Berkeley, and has previously held faculty positions at Harvard University, Harvard Medical School, and Boston University. His research in comparative and developmental neuroanatomy has focused on the human brain, using physiological, quantitative, and cross-species methods. He is the author of The Symbolic Species: The Coevolution of Language and the Brain (1997), which explores how language and the human brain evolved together, and Incomplete Nature: How Mind Emerged from Matter (2012), which examines how thermodynamic, self-organizing, semiotic, and evolutionary processes gave rise to life and mind. He is currently working on a new book, Falling Up: How Inverse Darwinism Catalyzes Evolution, which explores how the relaxation of natural selection and subsequent degenerative processes have paradoxically contributed to the evolution of increasing biological complexity.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this episode of Hunger for Wholeness, Sr. Ilia Delio engages neuroanthropologist Terrence Deacon. Together, they probe the paradox of presence and absence—how constraint, incompleteness, and time shape mind, language, and the emergence of human meaning. From Charles Sanders Peirce to Claude Shannon, Deacon traces a lineage that reframes form not as what’s added, but as what’s held back.

What happens when we privilege what’s present while ignoring the creative force of what’s missing? How does constraint give rise to information, and why might Gödel’s incompleteness illuminate consciousness more than mechanism alone? Moving through Descartes’ split of mind and matter, Deacon proposes that what we call “the mental” is the constraint-aspect of the physical—a shift that dissolves false dualisms and re-roots knowing in embodiment.

Later in the episode, Sr. Ilia and Deacon explore symbolic abstraction, culture, and ecology—how our ungrounded representations both empower and endanger us. They close by examining today’s so-called “artificial intelligence,” arguing it’s better understood as a simulation of intelligence, and asking what a grounded, value-aware future might require of us.

ABOUT TERRENCE DEACON

“Almost everything we do is with respect to something that doesn’t yet exist… All of our actions… are really about that absence. I actually think that this is the essence of what it means for something to be alive.”

Professor Terrence Deacon is Distinguished Professor emeritus at the University of California, Berkeley, and has previously held faculty positions at Harvard University, Harvard Medical School, and Boston University. His research in comparative and developmental neuroanatomy has focused on the human brain, using physiological, quantitative, and cross-species methods. He is the author of The Symbolic Species: The Coevolution of Language and the Brain (1997), which explores how language and the human brain evolved together, and Incomplete Nature: How Mind Emerged from Matter (2012), which examines how thermodynamic, self-organizing, semiotic, and evolutionary processes gave rise to life and mind. He is currently working on a new book, Falling Up: How Inverse Darwinism Catalyzes Evolution, which explores how the relaxation of natural selection and subsequent degenerative processes have paradoxically contributed to the evolution of increasing biological complexity.

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this continuation of their rich exchange, Sr. Ilia Delio and Dr. Iain McGilchrist explore the deeper dimensions of consciousness—and how our overreliance on the left hemisphere of the brain distorts our understanding of reality, relationships, and even God.

Together, they reflect on:

• How attentiveness shapes the way we relate to the world
• The role of environment in forming perception and meaning
• Why prayer, nature, and human relationships are vital to human flourishing
• The distinction between brain and mind—and the mystery of consciousness itself
• Why the future depends not just on new tools, but on a renewed inner life

With clarity and conviction, Iain invites us to recover the neglected right brain, embrace relational knowing, and remember the divine ground that holds us. In a culture driven by certainty and efficiency, this episode points gently back toward wonder, prayer, and possibility.

ABOUT IAIN MCGILCHRIST

“What is required is an attentive response to something real and other than ourselves, of which we have only inklings at first, but which comes more and more into being through our response to it – if we are truly responsive to it. We nurture it into being; or not. In this it has something of the structure of love.”

Dr. Iain McGilchrist is a psychiatrist, neuroscience researcher, philosopher and literary scholar. He is a Quondam Fellow of All Souls College, Oxford, an Associate Fellow of Green Templeton College, Oxford, a Fellow of the Royal College of Psychiatrists, and former Consultant Psychiatrist and Clinical Director at the Bethlem Royal & Maudsley Hospital, London. He has been a Research Fellow in neuroimaging at Johns Hopkins Hospital, Baltimore and a Fellow of the Institute of Advanced Studies in Stellenbosch. He has published original articles and research papers in a wide range of publications on topics in literature, philosophy, medicine and psychiatry. He is the author of a number of books, but is best-known for The Master and his Emissary: The Divided Brain and the Making of the Western World (Yale 2009). In November 2021 his two-volume work The Matter with Things: Our Brains, Our Delusions, and the Unmaking of the World was published by Perspectiva Press. www.channelmcgilchrist.com

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.

In this episode of Hunger for Wholeness, Sr. Ilia Delio engages renowned psychiatrist and author Dr. Iain McGilchrist. Together, they explore the profound implications of the brain’s divided hemispheres—and how our overreliance on the left brain might be shaping Western culture in unexpected ways.

What happens when we privilege abstract data over embodied experience? When mechanistic thinking crowds out emotional understanding and context? Drawing from his influential works The Master and His Emissary and The Matter with Things, Dr. McGilchrist proposes that the right hemisphere—long neglected—holds the key to restoring balance, wisdom, and connection in our lives and societies.

Later in the episode, Sr. Ilia and Dr. McGilchrist discuss the nature of consciousness, the mystery of mind beyond brain, and the role of implicit knowing in liturgy, love, and the deepest human experiences.

ABOUT IAIN MCGILCHRIST

“What is required is an attentive response to something real and other than ourselves, of which we have only inklings at first, but which comes more and more into being through our response to it – if we are truly responsive to it. We nurture it into being; or not. In this it has something of the structure of love.”

Dr. Iain McGilchrist is a psychiatrist, neuroscience researcher, philosopher and literary scholar. He is a Quondam Fellow of All Souls College, Oxford, an Associate Fellow of Green Templeton College, Oxford, a Fellow of the Royal College of Psychiatrists, and former Consultant Psychiatrist and Clinical Director at the Bethlem Royal & Maudsley Hospital, London. He has been a Research Fellow in neuroimaging at Johns Hopkins Hospital, Baltimore and a Fellow of the Institute of Advanced Studies in Stellenbosch. He has published original articles and research papers in a wide range of publications on topics in literature, philosophy, medicine and psychiatry. He is the author of a number of books, but is best-known for The Master and his Emissary: The Divided Brain and the Making of the Western World (Yale 2009). In November 2021 his two-volume work The Matter with Things: Our Brains, Our Delusions, and the Unmaking of the World was published by Perspectiva Press. www.channelmcgilchrist.com

The Center for Christogenesis is in the midst of our Winter Fundraiser as we celebrate ten years of exploring faith, science, and the promise of a new future. At a time when organizations vital to our shared future are losing support, your contribution affirms that our mission matters. Donate today at christogenesis.org/donate.

Support the show

A huge thank you to all of you who subscribe and support our show!

Support for A Hunger for Wholeness comes from the Fetzer Institute. Fetzer supports a movement of organizations who are applying spiritual solutions to society's toughest problems. Get involved at fetzer.org.

Visit the Center for Christogenesis' website at christogenesis.org/podcast to browse all Hunger for Wholeness episodes and read more from Ilia Delio. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for episode releases and other updates.