In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg break down the latest in the ongoing battle over NAR’s three-way agreement and how Phoenix Realtors’ recent compromise with NAR might reshape the industry. They explore whether this is a true win for NAR or just the beginning of a major shift, debating the rise of the “Freedom Plan” and how it could spread across the country. With bold predictions, deep industry insights, and a fair amount of sarcasm, this episode is a must-listen for anyone keeping an eye on real estate governance.

Key Takeaways

• Phoenix Realtors’ “Compromise”: Did they cave to NAR, or did they find a way to rewrite the rules on their own terms?

• The Freedom Plan vs. Realtor Membership: How the rebranded “Non-Member MLS Access” could be the start of a larger movement.

• Will Other Associations Follow?: If Phoenix can do it, why wouldn’t Scottsdale and other local associations jump on board?

• State Associations’ Next Move: Will Arizona Realtors create their own version of the Freedom Plan to retain members?

• Is the Three-Way Agreement Dead?: Rob argues that this move could mark the beginning of the end for NAR’s traditional membership structure

Inman News: NAR, Phoenix Realtors settle fight over MLS Choice

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Overview

In this special live episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg broadcast from the Virtual MLS Summit, where they tackle one of the biggest questions in real estate today: What does “cooperation” mean in a post-settlement world? They explore how the industry’s shift away from compensation impacts the role of MLSs, debate the long-standing relationship between brokerages and associations, and challenge whether MLSs should truly be considered “broker cooperatives.” This episode is packed with bold insights, historical context, and plenty of Rob vs. Greg fireworks.

Key Takeaways

• The Evolution of Cooperation: With compensation no longer tied to MLS participation, what does cooperation actually mean now?

• MLS Governance and Broker Control: If MLSs are broker cooperatives, why are associations still making the rules?

• The Fiduciary Duty Dilemma: Can cooperation exist when agents owe full fiduciary duties to their clients?

• The Government’s Potential Role: If the industry doesn’t self-regulate effectively, will federal regulators step in and take over?

• Lessons from Global Real Estate: Why other countries envy the U.S. MLS system—and what we risk losing if we dismantle it.

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In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg dive into one of the most heated debates yet—was NAR’s fight for survival a necessary battle, or did it do more harm than good? They analyze the fallout from the settlement, discuss the rise of leaders like Michelle Harrington who are ditching corporate-speak for real talk, and debate whether NAR should have surrendered years ago to avoid the lawsuits entirely.

Key Takeaways

• Michelle Harrington’s Blunt Truths: The First Team CEO calls the settlement “bulls***,” and Rob and Greg love her authenticity.

• Corporate-Speak vs. Real Talk: Why real estate leaders should ditch the PR fluff and embrace straight-shooting communication.

• The $2 Billion Club Controversy: Why independent brokerages feel abandoned and how the settlement exposed them to legal threats.

• Should NAR Have Surrendered in 2018? Rob argues they could have avoided everything if they had just given in earlier. Greg pushes back.

• Zombie Members or Hostages? Rob says NAR fought to protect dues from disengaged agents. Greg insists they were an opportunity, not a liability.

Inman story on FirstTeam CEO, Michelle Harrington; "A broker left out of NAR settlement gets candid: 'I'm still pissed'"

Todd Carpenter's LinkedIn post on "Zombie members vs. Super members"

Rob Substack, "Between Black Pill and White Pill"

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In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg recap Greg’s recent MLS Reset conference and dive into key industry insights. They discuss governance reform, competition between MLSs, data sharing agreements, and bold ideas for innovation in the real estate world. From pitch battles for tech innovation to thought-provoking commentary on leadership, this episode offers plenty of takeaways for industry professionals.

Key Takeaways

• MLS Reset Conference Recap: Greg shares highlights, including impactful presentations by Brian Boero, Michael Wurzer, and Curt Beardsley, Ben Graboske, who challenged the industry to embrace optimism.

• Governance Reform: Rob emphasizes the importance of reducing board sizes and increasing nimbleness

• Data Sharing and Competition: Rob and Greg debate whether MLSs should compete on services, price, and tech while maintaining data-sharing agreements.

• Source MLS Branding: A conversation on Michael Wurzer’s Source MLS concept as a trusted, transparent data brand.

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In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg navigate the fallout from key legal decisions and the broader implications for the real estate industry. They analyze the Supreme Court’s denial of NAR’s cert petition, its potential effects on DOJ actions, and how shifting dynamics—such as commission lawsuits and housing market pressures—might reshape the landscape. The conversation also previews upcoming events and industry challenges that will define the next chapter of real estate.

Key Takeaways

• Supreme Court Denies NAR’s Petition: What this decision means for DOJ’s antitrust investigations and future legal battles.

• Commission Lawsuits Continue: Why the litigation isn’t over and what could come next, including potential first-time homebuyer class actions.

• DOJ’s Goals: Rob and Greg speculate on what the Department of Justice ultimately wants for the real estate industry, including reducing transaction fees.

• Housing Market Pressures: Rising costs, insurance challenges, and inventory shifts, including their impact on rentals and sales.

• Upcoming Events: The MLS Reset Conference and the first-ever Industry Relations live stream scheduled for February 7th.

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In this thought-provoking episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg explore the seismic changes shaking up the real estate world as Phoenix Realtors challenge the NAR three-way agreement. They delve into the implications of member-driven value propositions, whether NAR can reinvent itself, and the ongoing debate over what truly inspires and retains Realtor memberships. The conversation is a deep dive into the challenges and opportunities ahead for the industry.

Key Takeaways

• Phoenix Realtors’ Bold Move: The Phoenix Association’s MLS Choice Program creates a potential watershed moment, questioning the viability of NAR’s three-way agreement.

• Membership Value Propositions: Rob and Greg discuss the importance of offering concrete benefits to agents versus relying solely on advocacy or inspiration.

• NAR’s Leadership Challenge: Speculation on whether high-profile leadership, such as a celebrity figure, could transform NAR’s narrative and mission.

• The Future of Realtor Memberships: Exploring voluntary membership models and the need for NAR to rethink its approach to retaining and attracting agents.

• Big Questions for 2025: What does it take for an agent to see NAR membership as a must-have in a post-Phoenix world?

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In this final episode of the year, Rob and Greg deliver their predictions for 2025, exploring how the real estate industry will evolve. They tackle everything from transaction volumes and mortgage rates to the fate of MLSs and the potential unraveling of the three-way agreement. Along the way, they discuss societal trends, like the importance of community and the role associations can play in bringing people together, while reflecting on industry dynamics and the future of key players like Realtor.com and Compass.

Key Takeaways

• Predictions for 2025: Rob and Greg forecast transaction numbers, mortgage rates, home prices, and the biggest M&A moves.

• The Fate of MLSs: Discussion on whether MLSs will remain relevant or adapt to changing times.

• Unraveling the Three-Way Agreement: The potential impact of associations like Phoenix breaking away from NAR.

• The Importance of Community: Inspired by the book Bowling Alone and the documentary Join or Die, they discuss how associations can evolve to foster better connections.

• Major Industry Moves: Speculation on Realtor.com’s next big acquisition and predictions around mergers like Bright MLS and Stellar MLS.

Bowling Alone Book

Join or Die Movie

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In this Industry Relations episode, Rob and Greg reflect on the pivotal events of 2024, dubbing it “The Year of the Settlement.” They analyze the seismic shifts in real estate, including the impact of high-interest rates, low inventory, NAR’s declining influence, and the ripple effects of major lawsuits. The duo also previews what these changes could mean for 2025 and beyond, setting the stage for a new era in real estate.

Key Takeaways

• 2024: A Year of Change: Why the settlement and other industry events signal the dawn of Real Estate 3.0.

• NAR’s Decline: The fallout from scandals and lawsuits has shifted perceptions of NAR as an industry powerhouse.

• Housing Market Woes: High-interest rates and inventory challenges persist, affecting transactions and industry morale.

• The CCP Debate: Controversy surrounding Clear Cooperation Policy continues to evolve, with implications for the future of MLSs.

• Compass’s Moves: The acquisition of @properties and its strategy around private exclusives sparks debate.

Washington Post CCP Article

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In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg tackle the latest controversies surrounding NAR  and the recent investigative article from The New York Times. They debate the role of lobbying, explore accusations of corruption and financial mismanagement, and reflect on the broader challenges facing NAR’s leadership and reputation.

Key Takeaways

• NAR and Lobbying Controversy: Discussion on how NAR funnels money to political groups through entities like the American Property Owners Alliance (APOA).

• The “Woke vs. Conservative” Debate: Examining NAR’s conflicting image as both progressive and a supporter of conservative causes.

• Transparency Issues: Why NAR’s approach to handling controversies feels “astroturfy” and the need for more open dialogue with members.

• Organizing Homeowners: The untapped potential of grassroots homeowner advocacy and how it could reshape lobbying strategies.

• PR Missteps: Criticism of NAR’s traditional PR playbook and a call for leadership to adopt more authentic communication strategies.

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Overview

In this special episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg welcome economist and author Professor Bryan Caplan to discuss his latest book, Build Baby Build: The Science and Ethics of Housing Regulation. The trio dives into the housing crisis, exploring how deregulation could address affordability, inequality, and other societal issues. Bryan’s insights challenge conventional thinking, offering bold solutions for the future of housing.

Key Takeaways

• Core Argument: Bryan argues that excessive housing regulations have driven up costs, stifled innovation, and exacerbated inequality, advocating for widespread deregulation.

• The 50% Reduction Claim: Deregulation could halve housing prices nationwide by enabling construction and reducing bureaucratic hurdles.

• NIMBYism and Local Politics: Local resistance to development, often driven by fear and misinformation, remains a significant barrier to solving the housing crisis.

• Economic and Social Benefits: Lower housing costs could address issues like inequality, mobility, and declining birth rates, while also improving quality of life.

• Role of Realtors: Real estate professionals and associations could play a pivotal role in advocating for deregulation to increase housing supply and affordability.

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Check out Bryan's amazing graphic novel: Build Baby Build: The Science and Ethics of Housing Regulation

Connect with Rob and Greg: 

Rob’s Website

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Our Sponsors:

CoreLogic

Notorious VIP

The Giant Steps Job Board

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios