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Can the war on drugs be responsible for the stigmatization of psychedelic therapies? Join us as we unravel the deep-seated impact of 1980s media and government campaigns on Generation X's perception of drugs, and how it contrasts with the evolving acceptance of psychedelics today. From Miami Vice to DARE, we navigate through a labyrinth of mixed messages, revealing the geopolitical motives behind the war on drugs and its ramifications on public opinion. Hear our candid recollections and firsthand stories that shed light on the intricate relationship between authority, control, and substance narratives.

Our guest, Jesse Gould, takes us on a compelling journey from skepticism to healing through psychedelic therapy. Initially influenced by the anti-drug sentiment of the 'Dare' era, Jesse opens up about his transformative experience with ayahuasca in Peru. This profound encounter not only alleviated his post-traumatic stress syndrome (PTS) but also inspired him to create the Heroic Hearts Project, a beacon of hope for fellow veterans. Discover the multiple-hit hypothesis and how individual backgrounds shape trauma responses, underscoring the need for personalized approaches in treating PTS.

Explore the emerging landscape of psychedelic therapy for veterans, including the financial hurdles and ethical considerations that come with it. We discuss the groundbreaking support from high-ranking military officials and the Department of Veterans Affairs, emphasizing the collective mission to revolutionize mental health treatment. From the strategic rebranding of psychedelics to the community-driven efforts to support veterans, this episode highlights the pivotal shift in perceptions and policies that promise transformative potential for those in need.

John R. Boyd's Conceptual Spiral was originally titled No Way Out. In his own words: 

“There is no way out unless we can eliminate the features just cited. Since we don’t know how to do this, we must continue the whirl of reorientation…”

March 25, 2025

Flow Learning Lab

Find us on X. @NoWayOutcast
Substack: The Whirl of ReOrientation

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Recent podcasts where you’ll also find Mark and Ponch:

The No Bell Podcast Episode 24
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