In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, we speak with Dr. Jerome “Jerry” Wagner and Patrick O’Leary, two pioneers in the Enneagram field. Patrick is a founding member of the IEA and co-author of the first Enneagram book, and Jerry is the author of the “Enneagram Spectrum of Personality Styles: an Introductory Guide” and an honorary founder of the IEA. This conversation dives into the rich history of the Enneagram as a tool, a model and an organization through these teachers’ individual and collective stories.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

Dr Jerome Wagner:

Web: enneagramspe ctrum.com

Web: training.enneagramspectrum.com

Web: wepss.com

Email: [email protected]

Patrick O’Leary:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/patrick-h-o-leary-5b928760

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

Trainings: flemmingchristensen.com/training

The Enneagram Life Theme: flemmingchristensen.com/enneagram-life-theme.html

Book: “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters”

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

Mentioned in this episode:

Thanks to Evolving Enneagram for Sponsoring Today's Episode!

Learn More About Evolving Enneagram

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, we listen to brief conversations with Lindsay Bailey, Mateo Myrvik, Josie Shardlow, Jeannine Myrvik and Nikki Meyers. Lindsay shares how the Enneagram helps her understand her husband, while Mateo, Josie and Jeannine share how the Enneagram plays a role in their family life. Nikki talks about her experience as a first time attendee to the conference and some memories from training by Dr Jerome “Jerry” Wagner.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

Lindsay Bailey:

Web: rootedcultures.com

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/enneagramlindsay

Josie Shardlow:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/josieshardlow

Jeannine Myrvik:

Web: jeanninemyrviklicsw.com

Nikki Meyer:

Web: createjoytravel.com

IG: @nikkipuravidacd

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

Trainings: flemmingchristensen.com/training

The Enneagram Life Theme: flemmingchristensen.com/enneagram-life-theme.html

Book: “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters”

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, we speak with Renée Rosario and Christopher T. Copeland from the Narrative Enneagram. Renée and Christopher share their history with the Enneagram and how it led them to work at the Narrative Enneagram where they became colleagues and friends. More importantly, they reflect on their trips of walking Camino de Santiago together where they developed their deep friendship, which is present throughout the conversation.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

Renée Rosario:

Web: narrativeenneagram.org

Web: enneasight.com

Christopher T. Copeland:

Web: narrativeenneagram.org

Web: illuminatingpaths.com

Pod: Heart of the Enneagram

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

Trainings: flemmingchristensen.com/training

The Enneagram Life Theme: flemmingchristensen.com/enneagram-life-theme.html

Book: “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters”

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, we hear brief conversations with Rosemary Hurwitz, Demetrius Parker and The Engagement Committee that consists of Linda Meffert, Sarah McMahill, Roland Legge and Nancy Markow. Rosemary and Demetrius share their origin story with the Enneagram and reflect on the Enneagram community today. We also learn how the Engagement Committee helps the people connect with each other at the conference and their motivation to do this work.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

Rosemary Hurwitz:

Web: spiritdrivenliving.com

Demetrius Parker:

Web: enneagrammba.com

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/demetriusparker

Linda Meffert:

Web: mycoffeecoach.com

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/lindabrewstermeffert

Sarah McMahill:

Web: sarahmc.net

Roland Legge:

Web: relconsultants.com

Nancy Markow:

Web: connectingyouwithyourself.com

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

Trainings: flemmingchristensen.com/training

The Enneagram Life Theme: flemmingchristensen.com/enneagram-life-theme.html

Book: “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters”

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, we speak with Russ Hudson and Lynda Roberts of The Enneagram Institute. We hear these two longtime friends and colleagues interact as they share their personal history with the Enneagram. We learn the vast differences that led them to become some of the founding members of the Enneagram. Russ talks about the creation of the IEA and becoming the first vice president for the organization. Lynda reveals some of the things that influence how she engages in the Enneagram, such as her time as a high school math teacher. With their origin stories dating back over 25 years, they discuss how the Enneagram community has evolved over time.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

Russ Hudson:

Web: russhudson.com

Web: enneagraminstitute.com

Lynda Roberts:

Web: enneagraminstitute.com

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

Trainings: flemmingchristensen.com/training

The Enneagram Life Theme: flemmingchristensen.com/enneagram-life-theme.html

Book: “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters”

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

Mentioned in this episode:

Learn About Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, we listen to storybooth interviews from Laura Lentz, Nancy Irish, Dr. Steven Jacob and Joey Jacob. These vignettes recorded at the 2025 IEA Experience present human stories from the dynamic Enneagram community. We hear what drew these four to the Enneagram and how it transformed their lives. Laura talks about her experience as a returning attendee while Nancy shares her hopes to make connections within the Enneagram community during her first time at the conference. Joey and Jacob chat with each other about the Enneagram, sharing their personal connection with Russ Hudson, an Enneagram pioneer and Joey’s brother.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

Laura Lentz:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/laura-lentz-5a207b14

Dr. Steven Jacob and Joey Jacob:

Web: healthoptionsct.com

Web: joeyjacob.com

Nancy Irish:

Web: internationalenneagram.org/find-a/professional/professional-teachers/#!biz/id/686ffa2b9933bc9d58036b29

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

Mentioned in this episode:

Learn About Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, Seth “Creek” Creekmore, Lee Fields, Lindsey Marks and Seth Abram speak with Suzanne Stabile, an internationally recognized Enneagram Master who has conducted over 500 Enneagram workshops for over 30 years. As a first time attendee at the IEA Experience, Suzanne was one of the Enneagram Pioneers that participated in the Keynote Panel along with Russ Hudson, Anne Mureé and Micky ScottBey Jones. Suzanne is joined on this episode by her husband and son, Joe and Joel, as they reveal their story with the Enneagram–how they learned about it and has become woven in their lives. Drawing from her personal experiences, we hear why her unique and practical approach through storytelling is why she is such an influential voice in the Enneagram community.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

Suzanne Stabile:

Web: suzannestabile.com

Web: lifeinthetrinityministry.com

IG: @suzannestabile

Pod: theenneagramjourney.org

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

Trainings: flemmingchristensen.com/training

The Enneagram Life Theme: flemmingchristensen.com/enneagram-life-theme.html

Book: “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters”

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

Mentioned in this episode:

Learn About Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, Seth “Creek” Creekmore, Lee Fields, Lindsey Marks and Seth Abram unpack their experience from the recent Enneagram Experience 2025. With the conference based around experience, they capture the human side of the legends and luminaries of the Enneagram community, including Suzanne Stabile, Russ Hudson, Dr. Jerry Wagner and Patrick O'Leary, highlighting more of who they are and how they relate as people rather than solely focusing on their contribution to the Enneagram. They also facilitated shorter conversational interviews with attendees at the conference that will also be shared in future episodes.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

IEA Conference Proposal Submission Information & Guidelines: internationalenneagram.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/2025-Proposal-Submission-Information-Guidelines.pdf

IEA Global Podcast Proposal Submission Form: forms.gle/Q48QXSwQ3zDfDJaJA

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagrammatic

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Aephoria Partners:

Web: aephoriapartners.com

FB: Aephoria Partners Consulting

Mentioned in this episode:

Learn About Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, we listen to the Endnote presentation by Chichi Agorom from the IEA Global Conference in 2023. Chichi is a certified Enneagram teacher and practitioner, Associate Faculty with the Narrative Enneagram, and holds a Master of Arts in Clinical Mental Health Counseling and a Post-Master's Certificate in Marriage and Family Therapy. Drawing from the theme of the conference–Unite and Ignite–she discusses how the Enneagram can be used as a tool for our collective liberation, drawing from her book, “The Enneagram for Black Liberation.” She explores how motivation behind our behavior and context–social, race, gender, social economics, religion, etc, that impact how we see ourselves and other people–are important for our inner work.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

IEA Conference Proposal Submission Information & Guidelines: internationalenneagram.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/2025-Proposal-Submission-Information-Guidelines.pdf

IEA Global Podcast Proposal Submission Form: forms.gle/Q48QXSwQ3zDfDJaJA

Chichi Agorom:

Web: chichiagorom.com

Book: The Enneagram for Black Liberation

IG: @theenneagramforblackliberation

Aephoria Partners:

Web: aephoriapartners.com

FB: Aephoria Partners Consulting

Mentioned in this episode:

Learn About Flemming Christensen

In this episode of the International Enneagram Association podcast, Seth “Creek” Creekmore and Ahmad Wazir continue their conversation with Flemming Christensen, founder and owner of Think About It and The Enneagram Institute of Denmark. They talk more about his book, “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters,” and his approach to the Enneagram. He highlights shadow work, which illuminates what we are not aware of about ourselves, and explores it within each Enneagram type. He also discusses the distinction between primary type and blind type.

Connect with us:

Web: internationalenneagram.org

IEA Enneagram Experience 2025: ieaexperience.com

Join the email list: [email protected]

IEA Conference Proposal Submission Information & Guidelines: internationalenneagram.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/2025-Proposal-Submission-Information-Guidelines.pdf

IEA Global Podcast Proposal Submission Form: forms.gle/Q48QXSwQ3zDfDJaJA

Flemming Christensen:

Web: flemmingchristensen.com

Trainings: flemmingchristensen.com/training

The Enneagram Life Theme: flemmingchristensen.com/enneagram-life-theme.html

Book: “The Enneagram and why your blind type matters”

IG: @flemmingchristensencom

FB: Flemming Christensen

LinkedIn: Flemming Christensen

Seth "Creek" Creekmore: 

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Ahmad Wazir:

IG: @ahmadwazir19

Pod: Totem Confidence

Aephoria Partners:

Web: aephoriapartners.com

FB: Aephoria Partners Consulting

Mentioned in this episode:

Learn About Flemming Christensen