Law firms spend enormous amounts of time and money winning new clients, then often overlook the relationships they have already built. In episode 636 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Stephanie Everett talks with EJ Stern and Katherine Wilson about how intentional client nurturing can lead to stronger relationships, repeat business, and more referrals. 

EJ and Katherine explain why clients can quietly disappear when firms stop staying connected, why asking for feedback can strengthen rather than threaten a relationship, and how lawyers can move beyond being the person clients call with one legal problem to becoming a trusted advisor they call about everything else. 

They also share practical ways to stay top of mind, from LinkedIn and personal check-ins to thoughtful gifts, memorable experiences, and small gestures that show you actually know the person behind the matter. As AI-generated communication becomes easier to produce, authentic human connection may become even more valuable. 

If your firm is constantly focused on finding the next client, this conversation is a reminder that some of your best growth opportunities may already know, like, and trust you. 

Listen to the previous episodes of our Client Retention, Referral Growth & Relationship Building. 

Links from the episode: 

https://smith.ai/ 

8am Kaleidoscope: https://www.8am.com/events/kaleidoscope/ 

Fractional Law Firm CMO 

Fractional Law Firm CMO on LinkedIn 

EJ Stern on LinkedIn 

Katherine Wilson on LinkedIn 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

 00:00 – Introduction 

01:16 – Getting More From Conferences 

03:02 – AI in Law Firms 

06:39 – AI for Client Intake 

08:15 – Intake Is a Sales Funnel 

11:19 – Fixing Intake Leaks 

13:22 – AI for Sales and Intake 

14:53 – Meet EJ Stern & Katherine Wilson 

15:36 – Why Client Retention Gets Overlooked 

16:19 – Turning Clients Into Referrals 

17:47 – Why Lawyers Avoid Feedback 

21:01 – Why Client Experience Matters 

21:54 – Becoming a Trusted Advisor 

22:54 – How to Ask for Client Feedback 

24:33 – Staying Top of Mind 

25:27 – Building Client Loyalty 

26:50 – Past Clients and Referral Sources 

28:41 – Creative Client Gifts 

32:22 – Human Connection in the Age of AI 

34:50 – Invest in Existing Clients 

35:21 – Building Long-Term Client Relationships 

36:11 – Marketing Is Like the Gym 

37:13 – LinkedIn and Staying Top of Mind 

38:00 – Keep Repeating Your Message 

38:21 – Closing Thoughts 

Law firms know change is coming. Knowing what to do about it is harder. In this episode of the Lawyerist Podcast, Stephanie Everett talks with Debbie Foster about leading a law firm forward as technology, client expectations, and the business of law evolve. 

Debbie explains why strategy often gets pushed aside for urgent client work and day-to-day demands. Together, they explore why firms struggle to move beyond “we’ve always done it this way,” how consensus can stall progress, and why great ideas mean little without execution and team buy-in. 

They also examine how AI is raising the stakes for law firm leaders. Waiting for certainty is not a strategy. Stephanie and Debbie share practical ways to protect time for strategic thinking, challenge assumptions, build buy-in, and help teams adapt to change. 

If your firm keeps talking about what needs to change but struggles to make it happen, this episode will help you move from ideas to action. 

Listen to the previous episodes of our Law Firm Leadership Series. 

Links from the episode: 

https://posh.com/lawyerist/ 

https://lawyerist.com/scorecard/ 

https://beanextlevelleader.com/ 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read Be a Next Level Leader yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

01:47 – The New Small Firm Scorecard™ 

03:23 – Making Law Firm Progress Easier to Measure 

06:38 – AI & Virtual Receptionists 

08:08 – AI vs. Automation: What’s the Difference? 

09:03 – Using AI to Enhance the Client Experience 

12:03 – AI for Sentiment Analysis & Quality Assurance 

13:04 – Keeping Humans in Control of AI 

14:56 – Leading Your Law Firm Forward 

15:24 – Why Law Firm Strategy Gets Pushed Aside 

16:54 – AI Is Changing the Game for Law Firms 

18:35 – Law Firms Are Playing 3D Chess 

19:30 – Why Strategic Thinking Needs Protected Time 

20:40 – Looking Beyond the Day-to-Day 

22:47 – Moving Past “We’ve Always Done It This Way” 

24:02 – Why Leading Through Change Is So Hard 

24:34 – Great Ideas Aren’t the Problem. Execution Is. 

26:58 – The Business Case for Law Firm Strategy 

28:39 – Creating Believers Inside Your Law Firm 

31:09 – Building a Culture That Thinks Ahead 

32:28 – Why Leaders Will Build the Next Era of Law Firms 

Law firm leaders are often so busy putting out fires that they never get the chance to prevent the next one. In episode 634 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Stephanie Everett talks with Debbie Foster about leading operations, the third cornerstone from their book, Be a Next Level Leader (beanextlevelleader.com). 

Debbie and Stephanie explore what it means to shift from being the “hero” who solves every problem to the architect who builds systems that help the firm run better. They break down how leaders can help teams prioritize urgent versus important work, clarify decision-making authority, and develop the judgment to make better decisions without constantly escalating them. 

They also explain why healthy firms surface problems early instead of hiding mistakes, how solving root causes can prevent recurring operational headaches, and why some law firm meetings cost far more than the decisions being made inside them. 

If your days feel like an endless cycle of interruptions, emergencies, and meetings about the same problems, this episode offers practical ways to build systems that create more clarity, accountability, and consistency across your firm. 

This week's homework: head to beanextlevelleader.com/resources for a free meeting audit calculator to see what your recurring meetings are really costing your firm. 

Listen to our previous episodes on Law Firm Leadership, Systems & Stronger Teams 

Links from the episode: 
Kaleidoscope Conference, September 22-24 in Las Vegas: https://www.8am.com/events/kaleidoscope/ use code “Lawyerist26”  
 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram!  

For more on leading operations, check out Be a Next Level Leader at beanextlevelleader.com. Looking for help beyond the book? 

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

00:37 – Lawyerist Heads to Kaleidoscope in Las Vegas 

03:23 – What Law Firms Can Learn from the Savannah Bananas 

05:01 – Why Ridiculous Ideas Can Lead to Better Solutions 

07:20 – The Third Cornerstone of Law Firm Leadership 

07:44 – Leading Operations: Turning Ideas into Systems 

09:29 – Stop Being the Hero and Start Being the Architect 

11:01 – Why Nonbillable Work Can Be Your Most Valuable Work 

11:35 – Building Better Systems One Problem at a Time 

12:32 – Urgent vs. Important: Helping Your Team Prioritize 

13:13 – Why Urgent Work Keeps Taking Over 

15:07 – Teach Your Team to Think Without Rescuing Them 

15:54 – Priorities, Trade-Offs & Better Judgment 

16:45 – Who Actually Gets to Make the Decision? 

19:18 – Why Law Firms Struggle with the Fear of Being Wrong 

21:02 – Create a Culture Where Problems Surface Early 

23:24 – Stop Fixing Symptoms and Find the Root Cause 

25:10 – Audit Your Law Firm Meetings 

25:50 – The $7,000 Meeting Problem 

27:02 – Death by Meeting vs. Not Meeting Enough 

28:17 – How to Run Meetings That Actually Accomplish Something 

29:27 – Stop the Law Firm Rumor Mill 

30:25 – This Week’s Leadership Homework 

Most lawyers are taught how to practice law, not how to lead people. Then one day, they are handed a team and expected to figure it out. In episode 633 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Stephanie Everett talks with Debbie Foster about leading people, the second cornerstone from their book, Be a Next Level Leader. 

Debbie and Stephanie break people's leadership into four essential responsibilities: building trust, developing others, communicating clearly, and holding standards. They explain why trust grows through small, human interactions, why leaders often overload their most dependable employees, and how delegation can become a tool for development instead of a way to clear your own plate. 

They also explore why teams cannot meet expectations that were never clearly communicated, how positive and constructive feedback help people grow, and why “no news is good news” is not a leadership strategy. 

If you want to build a team that can take greater ownership, perform at a higher level, and succeed without relying on one overburdened A player, this episode offers a practical place to start. 

Listen to our previous episodes on Law Firm Leadership, Delegation, and Building Stronger Teams. 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

00:21 – Track Your Firm’s Progress with the Small Firm Scorecard 

03:17 – Leading People: The Second Leadership Cornerstone 

04:25 – Trust, Development, Communication, and Standards 

05:59 – Why Law Firms Do Not Teach People Management 

07:42 – Building Trust Through Real Relationships 

08:58 – Small Conversations That Strengthen Trust 

10:54 – Delegating to Develop, Not Just to Offload Work 

11:26 – The Overburdened A Player Problem 

12:48 – Becoming a Multiplier for Your Team 

13:31 – Match Delegation to Skill and Readiness 

14:52 – Set Clear Expectations Before Asking for More 

16:38 – Why Feedback Is a Leadership Skill 

18:33 – “No News Is Good News” Does Not Work 

19:08 – Learn How Your People Want to Be Recognized 

19:53 – A Simple Framework for Better Feedback 

21:14 – Holding Standards Without Being Harsh 

22:15 – Closing Thoughts and What Comes Next 

Leaders do not simply enter a room. They change it. In episode 632 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Stephanie Everett talks with Debbie Foster about leading self, the first cornerstone from their new book, Be a Next Level Leader. 

Debbie explains why “leaders bring the weather” and how a leader’s emotions, attention, and energy can shape an entire meeting. Together, they explore what happens when leaders make promises they cannot realistically keep, become bottlenecks for their teams, or undermine decisions by delivering them as someone else’s instructions. 

They also discuss why honoring commitments is essential to building trust, how to renegotiate a deadline without hiding behind busyness, and what it means to speak as a leader even when you disagree with a decision. Debbie and Stephanie share practical scripts, exercises, and shared language law firm teams can use to make better leadership habits part of everyday work. 

If you want your team to trust your word, follow your direction, and feel secure when pressure rises, better leadership starts with understanding how you show up. 

Listen to our previous episodes on Law Firm Leadership, Self-Awareness & Building Stronger Teams. 

Links from the episode: 

https://beanextlevelleader.com/ 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

01:19 – Why Leadership Teams Need Shared Language 

03:16 – Meet Debbie Foster 

03:45 – Why Leadership Starts with Leading Self 

04:13 – Leaders Bring the Weather 

05:27 – Showing Up Fully Present 

06:17 – How Broken Commitments Erode Trust 

08:15 – When the Leader Becomes the Bottleneck 

09:29 – Speak as a Leader, Not a Messenger 

10:11 – Disagree, Commit & Support the Decision 

12:02 – How Leaders Undermine Their Own Credibility 

12:57 – Turning Leadership Theory into Practical Tools 

14:31 – Scripts for Renegotiating Commitments & Receiving Feedback 

16:10 – How the Book and Workbook Took Shape 

17:21 – Shared Language Creates Stronger Leaders 

19:26 – Leading When Responsibility Exceeds Authority 

21:21 – How Do You Show Up Under Stress? 

22:34 – Closing Thoughts 

When everything feels urgent, meaningful work rarely gets the attention it deserves. In episode 631 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Zack Glaser talks with leadership researcher and author Shawn Vanderhoven about how law firm leaders can create the clarity their teams need to focus and perform at their best. 

Drawing from his book, Pause: How to Lead Brilliant Work in a Busy World, Shawn explains why effective leadership sometimes requires slowing down before moving forward. He shares what his research revealed about the behaviors that improve focus, the leadership habits that amplify distraction, and why teams struggle when every project is treated like a top priority. 

Together, they explore how to make realistic tradeoffs, involve your team in prioritization, delegate without derailing someone’s entire day, and create systems that make difficult conversations easier. Shawn also explains why asking, “What will it take to do this well?” can lead to better decisions than simply asking whether the work can get done. 

If your law firm is juggling too many priorities, this episode offers practical ways to reduce distraction, lead with greater clarity, and create space for work your team can be proud of. 

Listen to our previous episodes on Law Firm Leadership & Building Stronger Teams. 

Links from the episode: 

https://www.pausebook.co/ 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

00:25 – A Different Kind of Law Firm Conference 

03:10 – LabCon for Law Firm Leaders 

07:05 – What Is Broken About Law Firm Intake 

11:30 – How to Secret Shop Your Firm 

15:15 – The Role of AI in Client Intake 

20:45 – Why Clients Still Want Access to Humans 

26:30 – Meet Shawn Vanderhoven 

29:15 – Why Leaders Need to Pause 

30:25 – How Leadership Can Improve Focus 

33:25 – When Everything Feels Important 

37:15 – Making Prioritization a Team Sport 

40:20 – Choosing Your Majors and Minors 

42:45 – A Better Way to Delegate Work 

46:10 – Navigating Competing Priorities 

49:10 – Making Difficult Conversations Easier 

54:45 – Creating Clarity Around What Matters 

56:10 – Pausing to Help Your Team Move Faster 

59:05 – Closing Thoughts 

Lawyers may soon spend less time opening applications, and more time simply telling AI what needs to happen next. In episode 630 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Zack Glaser talks with innovation strategist Sam Harden about the rise of agentic AI and how tools like ChatGPT Work and Claude Cowork could reshape the way legal professionals work. 

Unlike a traditional chatbot, an agentic system can operate within a workspace, analyze groups of files, create and update documents, develop plans, and connect information from different sources. That could allow lawyers to access emails, calendars, case materials, research, and practice management information through a single working interface. 

Zack and Sam discuss what this means for law firms filled with open Word documents, browser tabs, PDFs, research databases, and disconnected software. They also challenge the idea that AI should perform the most sophisticated legal reasoning while lawyers clean up the formatting. Instead, AI should take on the repetitive administrative work so lawyers can operate at the top of their licenses. 

If you want to understand where legal AI is heading beyond prompting and summarization, this episode offers a grounded look at the tools, opportunities, risks, and experiments shaping the next phase of legal work. 

Listen to our previous episodes on Agentic AI, Law Firm Workflows & the Future of Legal Work. 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

00:18 – What the World Cup Teaches About Professionalism 

05:19 – Meet Sam Harden 

06:25 – The “Claudification” of ChatGPT 

08:15 – From Chatbot to Agentic Workspace 

10:35 – Why ChatGPT Is Following Claude 

13:00 – The Shift from Asking to Delegating 

14:00 – What Agentic AI Actually Means for Lawyers 

17:40 – Making AI the Interface for Legal Work 

19:10 – The Future Surface of Work 

23:30 – When Your Phone Becomes Your Workspace 

25:35 – How Agentic AI Could Transform Law Firms 

26:45 – Letting AI Handle the Legal Busywork 

29:20 – Operating at the Top of Your License 

31:15 – AI Should Format the Work, Not Make the Judgment 

34:30 – How Lawyers Can Start Experimenting Safely 

37:25 – Closing Thoughts 

Privacy is not just about keeping secrets. It is about protecting your power. In episode 629 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Zack Glaser talks with Oxford professor and author Carissa Véliz about how personal data gives companies, governments, and technology platforms the ability to influence our choices and shape our lives. 

Carissa explains why seemingly harmless information, from the music you enjoy to the way your phone battery drains, can be used to identify, categorize, and predict you. They explore how AI has made surveillance cheaper and more powerful, why predictions should never be treated as facts, and how automated scores can affect important decisions without giving people a meaningful way to challenge them. 

The conversation also offers practical ways to reclaim control without abandoning technology entirely. From choosing more private digital tools to questioning the predictions presented as inevitable, Carissa shows why every decision to protect your privacy matters. 

If you have ever clicked “accept” without thinking about what happens next, this episode will change the way you think about your data, your autonomy, and who gets to shape your future. 

Listen to our previous episodes on AI, Privacy & Legal Ethics. 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

00:55 – The Future of Law Firm Leadership 

05:00 – The Four Cornerstones of Leadership 

09:00 – Be a Next Level Leader 

10:45 – Meet Carissa Véliz 

11:45 – Why Privacy Is Power 

13:30 – How Personal Data Limits Your Autonomy 

15:50 – Who Decides What Your Data Says About You? 

17:50 – How Companies Exploit Personal Vulnerabilities 

20:10 – The Data You Never Realized Was Personal 

21:15 – The Connection Between Surveillance and Prediction 

22:30 – Applying Fiduciary Duties to Personal Data 

24:15 – Why You Cannot Contest a Prediction 

26:20 – Banning the Sale of Personal Data 

28:25 – Predictions Are Power Plays, Not Facts 

30:30 – AI and the Expansion of Digital Surveillance 

33:25 – How to Take Back Your Digital Privacy 

37:30 – Why Every Privacy Choice Matters 

40:00 – The Future Is Not Predetermined 

41:25 – The Most Private Way to Read a Book 

Law firm marketing does not have to mean paid ads, aggressive sales tactics, or posting constantly online. 

In episode 628 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Chad Fox talks with Aaron Thomas about marketing for lawyers who do not think of themselves as marketers. Aaron shares how he went from relying almost entirely on referrals to building a more intentional approach that helped grow his firm and bring in better-fit clients. 

They explore why referral marketing is still marketing, how newsletters can keep firms visible, and why useful content often works better than a direct sales pitch. Aaron also explains how lawyers can build stronger referral networks, make their expertise easier to find, and outsource repetitive marketing tasks without hiring a full-time employee. 

If you want to grow your firm without sounding salesy or turning marketing into a second job, this episode provides simple strategies you can begin using right away. 

This episode is sponsored by Posh Virtual Receptionists. As Aaron explains, effective marketing is often less about selling and more about making it easier for the right clients to find, trust, and connect with your firm. Posh helps support that experience by answering calls, improving responsiveness, and helping law firms maintain consistent communication with prospective and current clients. 

Learn more at https://posh.com/lawyerist/. 

Listen to our previous episodes on Law Firm Marketing & Building Client Relationships. 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction 

00:25 – What Happens When a Business Fully Unplugs 

02:05 – Why Rest Belongs in Your Business Plan 

12:15 – Meet Aaron Thomas 

13:05 – Every Law Firm Is Already Marketing 

15:05 – Finding More of the Right Clients 

16:20 – Why Advertising Should Not Be Your First Move 

17:40 – Marketing to Your Existing Network First 

18:50 – Newsletters That Clients Want to Read 

21:05 – Networking Without the Sales Pitch 

21:55 – Creating Referral Partnerships with Other Lawyers 

23:50 – Using Helpful Content to Build Authority 

25:10 – Let Your Expertise Do the Selling 

26:25 – Why Free Information Still Leads to Paid Work 

28:30 – A Practical Starting Point for Overwhelmed Firms 

29:50 – Outsourcing the Work That Never Gets Done 

31:20 – How Basic Marketing Created Rapid Growth 

32:55 – Closing Thoughts 

Knowing your communication style is useful. Knowing when to move beyond it is what creates growth. In episode 627 of the Lawyerist Podcast, Zack Glaser talks with Zeina Baydoun about how law firm leaders and teams can use DISC to better understand themselves, communicate more effectively, and respond with greater intention. 

Zeina breaks down why DISC is not a personality test or a permanent label. It is a starting point for recognizing the behaviors that come most naturally, the blind spots those tendencies can create, and the ways stress may amplify them. Rather than using a profile to say, “That is just how I am,” she encourages leaders to ask whether their default response is actually what the person or situation needs. 

They discuss how different communication styles can create friction inside law firms, why understanding behavior can replace judgment with curiosity, and how teams can better support one another without lowering expectations for growth. 

If you want to improve communication without forcing everyone to think and work the same way, this episode offers a thoughtful framework for building more adaptable leaders and more connected teams. 

Listen to our previous episodes on Leadership, Communication & Building Stronger Law Firm Teams. 

Have thoughts about today’s episode? Join the conversation on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X!  

If today's podcast resonates with you and you haven't read The Small Firm Roadmap Revisited yet, get the first chapter right now for free! Looking for help beyond the book? See if our coaching community is right for you.  

Access more resources from Lawyerist at lawyerist.com.  

Chapters / Timestamps 

00:00 – Introduction
01:25 – Using DISC as an Active Leadership Tool
04:10 – Meet Zeina Baydoun
05:45 – What DISC Reveals About Communication
08:35 – Understanding Behavioral Preferences
12:00 – How Self-Awareness Changes Team Dynamics
14:40 – The Problem with Personality Labels
16:20 – Why Leaders Cannot Hide Behind Their Style
17:40 – Developing Skills Outside Your Comfort Zone
18:55 – Adapting Your Communication to the Situation
21:55 – Leadership and Communication Under Pressure
25:25 – Supporting Strengths and Managing Blind Spots
28:50 – Creating Space for Other People to Lead
31:05 – Moving Beyond Fixed Leadership Styles
32:10 – Building New Behavioral Habits
33:05 – Choice, Growth and Intentional Leadership
35:05 – Closing Thoughts