Lenny's Podcast: Product | Growth | Career

Roger Martin is one of the world’s leading experts on strategy and the author of Playing to Win, one of the most beloved books on strategy. He’s written extensively for the Harvard Business Review; consulted for dozens of Fortune 500 companies, including P&G, Lego, and Ford; and written 11 other books. In our conversation, we discuss:

• The five key questions you need to answer to develop an effective strategy

• Why most companies get strategy wrong

• How to avoid “playing to play” instead of playing to win

• Real-world strategy examples from Procter & Gamble, Southwest Airlines, Lego, and Figma

• How to think about differentiation vs. low cost

• Shortcomings of current strategy education

• Much more

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Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-ultimate-guide-to-strategy-roger-martin

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Where to find Roger Martin:

• X: https://x.com/RogerLMartin

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/roger-martin-9916911a9/

• Website: https://rogerlmartin.com/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Roger’s background

(02:20) The importance of strategy

(07:00) Challenges in developing strategy

(08:30) Critique of modern strategy education

(14:00) Hamilton Helmer and Richard Rumelt

(17:40) Defining strategy

(19:12) The Strategy Choice Cascade

(23:20) Playing to win vs. playing to play

(24:57) Examples of strategic success

(30:49) Differentiation and moats

(40:23) Applying strategy to real-world scenarios

(43:47) Customer-centric strategy

(44:45) Defining the market and product

(45:59) Value chain and distribution

(48:28) Cost leadership vs. differentiation

(53:16) Capabilities and management systems

(57:14) Competitive advantage and market positioning

(01:02:41) Counterpositioning and fault lines

(01:05:53) Adapting to AI and market changes

(01:14:11) Betterment over perfection

(01:18:42) Final thoughts on strategy

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Referenced:

• Nearly 10% of S&P 500 CEOs are alumni of Procter & Gamble: https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2023/02/06/10-of-s-p-500-ceos-pg.html

• FigJam: https://www.figma.com/figjam/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• What Is Resource-Based Theory?: https://www.igi-global.com/dictionary/the-impact-of-technological-governance-and-political-capabilities-on-firms-performances-under-economic-turbulence/67915

• Michael Porter on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/professorporter/

• Competitive Strategy: Techniques for Analyzing Industries and Competitors: https://www.amazon.com/Competitive-Strategy-Techniques-Industries-Competitors/dp/0684841487

• VRIO Framework Explained: https://strategicmanagementinsight.com/tools/vrio/

• Business strategy with Hamilton Helmer (author of 7 Powers): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/business-strategy-with-hamilton-helmer

• Good Strategy, Bad Strategy | Richard Rumelt: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/good-strategy-bad-strategy-richard

• 7 Powers: The Foundations of Business Strategy: https://www.amazon.com/7-Powers-Foundations-Business-Strategy/dp/0998116319

• Boston Consulting Group: https://www.bcg.com/

• Bruce Henderson: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Henderson

• Lego: https://www.lego.com

• Vanguard: https://investor.vanguard.com/

• Southwest Airlines: https://www.southwest.com/

• How Amazon Managed to Dethrone Walmart: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/08/20/technology/how-amazon-beat-walmart.html

• GM Lost a 10-Year Battle with Tesla, Pulling the Plug on a Long Line of EVs: https://www.forbes.com/sites/brookecrothers/2023/07/09/gm-killed-its-electric-cars-and-lost-a-10-year-battle-with-tesla/

• Westlaw: https://www.westlawinternational.com/

• What Is an Economic Moat? Why Warren Buffett Says It Matters for Investors: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/economic-moat-why-warren-buffett-160046125.html

• Salomon Brothers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salomon_Brothers

• US Airways: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Airways

• Four Seasons: https://www.fourseasons.com/

• Michael Dell on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mdell/

• Bill Gates on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/williamhgates/

• Mandarin Oriental: https://www.mandarinoriental.com/en/

• Continental Lite: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_Lite

• Ted (airline): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_(airline)

• Case Study: Oil of Olay: https://www.studocu.com/es/document/universidad-de-murcia/estrategia-de-marketing/case-study-old-of-olay/95079369

• AG Lafley on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ag-lafley-2381b3201/

• Jack Bogle: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_C._Bogle

• Seven Ways Windows 95 Changed the World: https://www.forbes.com/sites/ianmorris/2015/08/24/windows-95-changed-the-world/

• Where to Start with Strategy? Focus on Betterment: https://rogermartin.medium.com/where-to-start-with-strategy-bae40506304c

• Brick by brick: The man who rebuilt the house of Lego shares his leadership secrets: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/on-leadership/wp/2016/12/08/brick-by-brick-the-man-who-rebuilt-the-house-of-lego-shares-his-leadership-secrets/

• A New Way to Think: Your Guide to Superior Management Effectiveness: https://www.amazon.com/New-Way-Think-Management-Effectiveness/dp/164782351X/

• Playing to Win: How Strategy Really Works: https://www.amazon.com/Playing-Win-Strategy-Really-Works/dp/142218739X

• The Design of Business: Why Design Thinking Is the Next Competitive Advantage: https://www.amazon.com/Design-Business-Thinking-Competitive-Advantage/dp/1422177807

• The Opposable Mind: How Successful Leaders Win Through Integrative Thinking: https://www.amazon.com/Opposable-Mind-Successful-Integrative-Thinking/dp/1422118924

• When More Is Not Better: Overcoming America’s Obsession with Economic Efficiency: https://www.amazon.com/When-More-Not-Better-Overcoming/dp/1647820065

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

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Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Rory Sutherland is widely regarded as one of the most influential (and most entertaining) thinkers in marketing and behavioral science. He’s the vice chairman of Ogilvy UK, the author of Alchemy: The Dark Art and Curious Science of Creating Magic in Brands, Business, and Life, and the founder of Nudgestock, the world’s biggest festival of behavioral science and creativity. He champions thinking from first principles and using human psychology—what he calls “thinking psycho-logically”—over mere logic. In our conversation, we cover:

• Why good products don’t always succeed, and bad ones don’t necessarily fail

• Why less functionality can sometimes be more valuable

• The importance of fame in building successful brands

• The importance of timing in product success

• The concept of “most advanced, yet acceptable”

• Why metrics-driven workplaces can be demotivating

• Lots of real-world case studies

• Much more

Note: We encountered some technical difficulties that led to less than ideal video quality for this episode, but the lessons from this conversation made it impossible for me to not publish it anyway. Thanks for your understanding and for bearing with the less-than-ideal video quality. 

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Brought to you by:

• Pendo—The only all-in-one product experience platform for any type of application

• Cycle—Your feedback hub, on autopilot

• Coda—The all-in-one collaborative workspace

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Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/what-most-people-miss-about-marketing

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Where to find Rory Sutherland:

• X: https://x.com/rorysutherland

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rorysutherland

• Book: Alchemy: The Dark Art and Curious Science of Creating Magic in Brands, Business, and Life: https://www.amazon.com/Alchemy-Curious-Science-Creating-Business/dp/006238841X

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Rory’s background

(02:37) The success and failure of products

(04:08) Why the urge to appear serious can be a disaster in marketing

(08:05) The role of distinctiveness in product design

(12:29) The MAYA principle

(15:50) How thinking irrationally can be advantageous

(17:40) The fault of multiple-choice tests

(21:31) Companies that have successfully implemented out-of-the-box thinking

(30:31) “Psycho-logical” thinking

(31:45) The hare and the dog metaphor

(38:51) Marketing’s crucial role in product adoption

(49:21) The quirks of Google Glass

(55:44) Survivorship bias

(56:09) Balancing rational ideas with irrational ideas

(01:06:19) The rise and fall of tech innovations

(01:09:54) Consistency, distinctiveness, and clarity

(01:21:12) Considering psychological, technological, and economic factors in parallel

(01:23:35) Where to find Rory

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Referenced:

• Google Glass: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Glass

• Meta Portal TV: https://www.meta.com/portal/products/portal-tv/

• Rory’s quote in a LinkedIn post: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/brad-jackson-04766642_the-urge-to-appear-serious-is-a-disaster-activity-7093497742710210560-1LYN/

• The MAYA Principle: Design for the Future, but Balance It with Your Users’ Present: https://www.interaction-design.org/literature/article/design-for-the-future-but-balance-it-with-your-users-present

• Ogilvy: https://www.ogilvy.com/

• MCI: https://www.mci.world/

• Veuve Clicquot: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veuve_Clicquot

• Why do the French call the British ‘the roast beefs’?: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/2913151.stm

• The Killing on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/series/the-killing-f5da5c2d-4626-4ba9-bcf3-ff5f891771fb

• Original The Killing on BBC: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b017h7m1

• The Mandarin Oriental, Hong Kong: https://www.mandarinoriental.com/en/hong-kong/victoria-harbour

• SAT: https://satsuite.collegeboard.org/sat

• The Widening Racial Scoring Gap on the SAT College Admissions Test: https://www.jbhe.com/features/49_college_admissions-test.html

• What is the age of the captain?: https://www.icopilots.com/what-is-the-age-of-the-captain/

• Octopus Energy: https://octopus.energy/

• Kraken: https://octopusenergy.group/kraken-technologies

• Toby Shannan: https://theorg.com/org/shopify/org-chart/toby-shannan

• Dunbar’s number: Why we can only maintain 150 relationships: https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20191001-dunbars-number-why-we-can-only-maintain-150-relationships

• AO: https://ao.com/

• Zappos: https://www.zappos.com/

• Joe Cano on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joeycano/

• John Ralston Saul’s website: https://www.johnralstonsaul.com/

• Voltaire’s Bastards: The Dictatorship of Reason in the West: https://www.amazon.com/Voltaires-Bastards-Dictatorship-Reason-West/dp/0679748199

• Psycho-Logic: Why Too Much Logic Deters Magic: https://coffeeandjunk.com/psycho-logic/

• Herbert Simon’s Decision-Making Approach: https://bura.brunel.ac.uk/bitstream/2438/4995/1/Fulltext.pdf

• Robert Trivers’s website: https://roberttrivers.com/Welcome.html

• Crazy Ivan: https://jollycontrarian.com/index.php?title=Crazy_Ivan

• The Joys of Being a Late Tech Adopter: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/28/technology/personaltech/joys-late-tech-adopter.html

• Jean-Claude Van Damme: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Claude_Van_Damme

• Tim Berners-Lee: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Berners-Lee

• Edward Jenner and the history of smallpox and vaccination: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1200696/

• The real story behind penicillin: https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/the-real-story-behind-the-worlds-first-antibiotic

• What Are Japanese Toilets?: https://www.bigbathroomshop.co.uk/info/blog/japanese-toilets/

• reMarkable: https://remarkable.com/

• Chumby: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chumby

• Survivorship bias: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias

• Jony Ive: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jony_Ive

• Marc Newson’s website: https://marc-newson.com/

• Designing Men: https://www.vanityfair.com/news/business/2013/11/jony-ive-marc-newson-design-auction

• Qantas A330: https://marc-newson.com/qantas-a330/

• Herodotus: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herodotus

• Big Decision? Consider It Both Drunk and Sober: https://www.forbes.com/sites/chunkamui/2016/03/22/wine-and-sleep-make-for-better-decisions/?sh=5c97fdc524b1

• How Henry Ford and Thomas Edison killed the electric car: https://www.speakev.com/threads/how-henry-ford-and-thomas-edison-killed-the-electric-car.4270/

• Watch Jay Leno get nostalgic and swoon over this 1909 EV: https://thenextweb.com/news/jay-leno-talk-about-electric-car-1909-baker

• Jay Leno’s Garage: https://www.youtube.com/@jaylenosgarage

• Nudgestock: https://nudgestock.com/

• Akio Morita: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akio_Morita

• Don Norman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/donnorman/

• What Makes Tesla’s Business Model Different: https://www.investopedia.com/articles/active-trading/072115/what-makes-teslas-business-model-different.asp

• Monica Lewinsky on X: https://x.com/MonicaLewinsky

• Blindsight: The (Mostly) Hidden Ways Marketing Reshapes Our Brains: azon.com/Blindsight-Mostly-Hidden-Marketing-Reshapes-ebook/dp/B07ZKZ5DWF

• Branding That Means Business: https://www.amazon.com/Branding-that-Means-Business-Economist-ebook/dp/B09QBCCH9N

• PwC: https://www.pwc.com

• Ryanair: https://www.ryanair.com

• British Airways: https://www.britishairways.com/

• Wrigley’s began as a soap business: know when to pivot: https://theamericangenius.com/entrepreneur/wrigleys-began-as-soap-know-when-to-pivot/

• Transport for Humans: https://www.amazon.com/Transport-Humans-Perspectives-Pete-Dyson/dp/1913019357

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Jessica Lachs is the global head of analytics and data science at DoorDash, where she’s built one of the largest and most respected data organizations in tech. In her more than 10 years at DoorDash, she has served as the first general manager, responsible for launching new markets; the head of business ops and analytics; and the VP of analytics and data science. Previously, Jessica founded GiftSimple, a social gifting startup, and started her career at Lehman Brothers as an investment banking analyst. In our conversation, she shares:

• How to structure and scale a high-impact analytics organization

• Centralized vs. decentralized data teams

• How to pick the right metric and aligning incentives

• Advice for data people on how and when to push back

• Lessons learned from building a global data team

• How to foster a culture of extreme ownership

• The role of AI in improving analytics team productivity

• Advice for aspiring data leaders without formal training

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Brought to you by:

• Webflow—The web experience platform

• Anvil—The fastest way to build software for documents

• Attio—The powerful, flexible CRM for fast-growing startups

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Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/building-a-world-class-data-org-jessica-lachs

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Where to find Jessica Lachs:

• X: https://x.com/jesslachs

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jessica-lachs/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Jessica’s background

(04:59) Centralized vs. embedded analytics teams

(10:52) The benefits of a centralized analytics team

(15:10) Balancing proactive and reactive work

(20:45) Advice on how to push back effectively

(24:20) Hiring for curiosity and problem solving

(28:57) Coming from a non-traditional background

(34:40) The early days and culture at DoorDash

(40:39) Encouraging cross-functional roles

(44:39) Defining effective metrics

(46:30) Simplifying metrics for better outcomes

(55:28) Focusing on edge cases and fail states

(01:00:12) Managing a global data organization

(01:02:31) Leveraging AI for productivity

(01:05:25) Building diverse and skilled data teams

(01:08:40) Lightning round

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Referenced:

• How Netflix builds a culture of excellence | Elizabeth Stone (CTO): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-netflix-builds-a-culture-of-excellence

• Riley Newman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rileynewman/

• Tony Xu on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/xutony/

• Imposter Syndrome: Why You May Feel Like a Fraud: https://www.verywellmind.com/imposter-syndrome-and-social-anxiety-disorder-4156469

• Stanley Tang on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stanleytang/

• Andy Fang on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fangsterr/

• Evan Moore on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/evanmoore/

• How WeDash became the flagship employee program for DoorDash: https://careers.doordash.com/blog/wedash-doordash-employee-program-how-does-it-work

• Leading with empathy | Keith Yandell (DoorDash, Uber): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/leading-with-empathy-keith-yandell

• The Rose Code: https://www.amazon.com/Rose-Code-Novel-Kate-Quinn/dp/006305941X

• Libby app: https://libbyapp.com/

• The West Wing on Prime: https://www.amazon.com/West-Wing-Complete-First-Season/dp/B000KZPG04

• Alias on Prime: https://www.amazon.com/Alias-Season-1/dp/B00748O13S

• Joseon sunscreens: https://beautyofjoseon.com/

• Innisfree sunscreens: https://us.innisfree.com/

• John Steinbeck quote: https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/john_steinbeck_103825

• Vanessa Roberts on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vanessa-roberts-b8a509a/

• Tia Sherringham on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tiasherringham/

• Elizabeth Jarvis-Shean on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elizabeth-jarvis-shean-141a7966/

• Regina (Gina) Tarone on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/regina-tarone-a565a2/overlay/about-this-profile/

• My Journey (Part 1): I have a job that I would never be hired for: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/jessica-lachs_anniversary-datascience-finance-activity-7216912300056727553-mEv6/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_desktop

• Starting an Analytics Org From Scratch — Lessons From a Decade at DoorDash: https://review.firstround.com/starting-an-analytics-org-from-scratch-lessons-from-a-decade-at-doordash/

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Jeff Weinstein is a product lead at Stripe, where he helped grow their payment APIs to hundreds of billions in volume and transformed the way founders start companies into a few simple clicks with Atlas. Prior to Stripe, Jeff led several startups and sold companies to Groupon and Box. He’s known for his customer obsession, craft, quality, and building beloved products businesses rely on. In our conversation, we discuss:

• The power of customer obsession and how to operationalize it in the product development process

• How to pick the right metrics and use them to drive impact

• Techniques for getting things done at big companies

• A group practice Jeff started to uplevel product craft, called Study Group

• The story behind Stripe Atlas and its mission to increase entrepreneurship globally

• Lessons from working with the founders of Stripe

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Brought to you by:

• Pendo—The only all-in-one product experience platform for any type of application

• Cycle—Your feedback hub, on autopilot

• Anvil—The fastest way to build software for documents

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/creating-a-culture-of-excellence

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Where to find Jeff Weinstein:

• X: https://x.com/jeff_weinstein

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffwweinstein/

• Email: [email protected]

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Jeff’s background 

(10:16)  The “go, go, go ASAP + optimistic, long-term compounding” approach

(15:38) The importance of craft and quality

(24:15) Effective customer communication strategies

(28:57) The importance of speed in customer interactions 

(33:19) Narrowing your focus

(36:53) Why you should pay attention only to paying-customer feedback

(40:24) Practicing silence when communicating 

(45:33) The role of metrics in product success

(54:08) Empowering teams with a single metric

(58:23) Picking the right metric for your audience

(01:05:10) The importance of metric hygiene

(01:11:33) How Stripe uses “study groups” for product improvement

(01:37:20) Stripe’s Atlas: simplifying company formation

(01:50:38) Automation and operational efficiency

(01:55:13) Diversity and team building

(02:03:09) Building new products within a large company

(02:21:10) Lightning round

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Referenced:

• Atlas: https://stripe.com/atlas

• Stripe: https://stripe.com/

• SQL: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SQL

• GitHub: https://github.com/

• Linear: https://linear.app/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Jeff’s tweet about Stripe’s bug-finder program: https://x.com/jeff_weinstein/status/1777487507934040300

• The “Collison installation”: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18400504

• How we use friction logs to improve products at Stripe: https://dev.to/stripe/how-we-use-friction-logs-to-improve-products-at-stripe-i6p

• Fidelity: https://www.fidelity.com/

• 83(b) election: https://docs.stripe.com/atlas/83b-election

• Jeff’s tweet about Atlas’s NPS score: https://x.com/jeff_weinstein/status/1788644576330469638

• What is a Delaware corporation? Here’s what makes this state so attractive to businesses: https://stripe.com/resources/more/what-is-a-delaware-corporation

• Incorporating in Delaware explained: Why it’s such a popular option for businesses: https://stripe.com/resources/more/incorporating-in-delaware-explained

• 7 of Pixar’s Best Storyboard Examples and the Stories Behind Them: https://boords.com/blog/7-of-pixars-best-storyboard-examples-and-the-stories-behind-them

• Alex Kehayias on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexkehayias/

• Patrick McKenzie on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmckenzie/

• AngelList: https://www.angellist.com/

• Dan Hightower on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/danhighto/

• Stripe Atlas perks partners: https://support.stripe.com/questions/stripe-atlas-perks-partners

• Vision, conviction, and hype: How to build 0 to 1 inside a company | Mihika Kapoor (Product at Figma): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/vision-conviction-hype-mihika-kapoor

• High Output Management: https://www.amazon.com/High-Output-Management-Andrew-Grove/dp/0679762884

• Orbiting the Giant Hairball: A Corporate Fool’s Guide to Surviving with Grace: https://www.amazon.com/Orbiting-Giant-Hairball-Corporate-Surviving/dp/0670879835

• 7 Powers: The Foundations of Business Strategy: https://www.amazon.com/7-Powers-Foundations-Business-Strategy/dp/0998116319

• Business strategy with Hamilton Helmer (author of 7 Powers): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/business-strategy-with-hamilton-helmer

• Box: https://www.box.com/

• Patrick Collison on X: https://x.com/patrickc

• How to with John Wilson on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/how-to-with-john-wilson

• The Quiet Girl on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/movie/the-quiet-girl-b50a4b8e-d3ff-4635-b806-5e7dbd292ca4

• Raycast: https://www.raycast.com/

• Quicksilver: https://qsapp.com/

• Alfred: https://www.alfredapp.com/help/workflows/automations/

• CleanShot: https://cleanshot.com/

• John Collison on X: https://x.com/collision

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Mike Maples, Jr. is a legendary early-stage startup investor and a co-founder and partner at Floodgate. He’s made early bets on transformative companies like Twitter, Lyft, Twitch, Okta, Rappi, and Applied Intuition and is one of the pioneers of seed-stage investing as a category. He’s been on the Forbes Midas List eight times and enjoys sharing the lessons he’s learned from his years studying iconic companies. In his new book, Pattern Breakers: Why Some Start-Ups Change the Future, co-authored with Peter Ziebelman, he discusses what he’s found separates startups and founders that break through and change the world from those that don’t. After spending years reviewing the notes and decks from the thousands of startups he’s known over the past two decades, he’s uncovered three ways that breakthrough founders think and act differently. In our conversation, Mike talks about:

• The three elements of breakthrough startup ideas

• Why you need to both think and act differently

• How to avoid the “comparison trap” and “conformity trap”

• The importance of movements, storytelling, and healthy disagreeableness in startup success

• How to apply pattern-breaking principles within large companies

• Mike’s one piece of advice for founders

• Much more

Pre-order Mike’s book here and get a second signed copy for free. Limited copies are available, so order ASAP: patternbreakers.com/lenny.

—

Brought to you by:

• Enterpret—Transform customer feedback into product growth

• Anvil—The fastest way to build software for documents

• Webflow—The web experience platform

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-find-a-great-startup-idea-mike-maples-jr

—

Where to find Mike Maples, Jr.:

• X: https://x.com/m2jr

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/maples/

• Substack: https://greatness.substack.com/

• Website: https://www.floodgate.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Mike’s background

(03:10) The inspiration behind Pattern Breakers

(08:09) Uncovering startup insights

(11:37) A quick summary of Pattern Breakers

(13:52) Coming up with an idea

(15:30) Inflections

(17:09) Examples of inflections

(28:10) Insights

(36:58) The power of surprises

(47:36) Founder-future fit

(55:33) Advice for aspiring founders

(56:41) Living in the future: valid opinions

(55:34) Case study: Maddie Hall and Living Carbon

(58:40) Identifying lighthouse customers

(01:00:53) The importance of desperation in customer needs

(01:03:57) Creating movements and storytelling

(01:24:22) The role of disagreeableness in startups

(01:34:42) Applying these principles within a company

(01:40:43) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Pattern Breakers: Why Some Start-Ups Change the Future: https://www.amazon.com/Pattern-Breakers-Start-Ups-Change-Future/dp/1541704355

• Justin.tv: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin.tv

• Airbnb’s CEO says a $40 cereal box changed the course of the multibillion-dollar company: https://fortune.com/2023/04/19/airbnb-ceo-cereal-box-investors-changed-everything-billion-dollar-company/

• Brian Chesky’s new playbook: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/brian-cheskys-contrarian-approach

• The Unconventional Exit: How Justin Kan Sold His First Startup on eBay: https://medium.datadriveninvestor.com/the-unconventional-exit-how-justin-kan-sold-his-first-startup-on-ebay-4d705afe1354

• Kyle Vogt on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kylevogt/

• The State of Telehealth Before and After the COVID-19 Pandemic: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9035352/

• The Craigslist Killers: https://www.gq.com/story/craigslist-killers

• The social radar: Y Combinator’s secret weapon | Jessica Livingston (co-founder of Y Combinator, author, podcast host): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-social-radar-jessica-livingston

• Michael Seibel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mwseibel/

• The Airbnb Story: How Three Ordinary Guys Disrupted an Industry, Made Billions ... and Created Plenty of Controversy: https://www.amazon.com/Airbnb-Story-Ordinary-Disrupted-Controversy/dp/0544952669

• Scott Cook: https://www.forbes.com/profile/scott-cook/

• Chegg: https://www.chegg.com/

• Aayush Phumbhra on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aayush/

• Osman Rashid on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/osmanrashid/

• Okta: https://www.okta.com/

• The Man Who Makes the Future: Wired Icon Marc Andreessen: https://www.wired.com/2012/04/ff-andreessen/

• Peter Ludwig on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peterwludwig/

• Qasar Younis on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/qasar/

• Paul Allen’s website: https://paulallen.com/

• Louis Pasteur quote: https://www.forbes.com/quotes/6145/

• What was Atrium and why did it fail? https://www.failory.com/cemetery/atrium

• Patrick Collison on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickcollison/

• Drew Houston on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drewhouston/

• William Gibson’s quote: https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/681-the-future-is-already-here-it-s-just-not-evenly

• Maddie Hall on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/maddie-hall-76293135/

• Living Carbon: https://www.livingcarbon.com

• Zenefits (now Trinet): https://connect.trinet.com/

• Sam Altman on X: https://x.com/sama

• Steve Wozniak on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/wozniaksteve/

• Horsley Bridge Partners: https://www.horsleybridge.com/

• David Swensen: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_F._Swensen

• Judith Elsea on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/judithelsea/

• 7 Powers: The Foundations of Business Strategy: https://www.amazon.com/7-Powers-Foundations-Business-Strategy/dp/0998116319

• Business strategy with Hamilton Helmer (author of 7 Powers): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/business-strategy-with-hamilton-helmer

• Lyft’s Focus on Community and the Story Behind the Pink Mustache: https://techcrunch.com/2012/09/17/lyfts-focus-on-community-and-the-story-behind-the-pink-mustache/

• Logan Green on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/logangreen/

• John Zimmer on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnzimmer11/

• Storytelling with Nancy Duarte: How to craft compelling presentations and tell a story that sticks: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/storytelling-with-nancy-duarte-how

• Steve Jobs Introducing the iPhone at MacWorld 2007: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7qPAY9JqE4

• Jonathan Livingston Seagull: https://www.amazon.com/Jonathan-Livingston-Seagull-Richard-Bach/dp/0743278909

• The paths to power: How to grow your influence and advance your career | Jeffrey Pfeffer (author of 7 Rules of Power, professor at Stanford GSB): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-paths-to-power-jeffrey-pfeffer

• Robin Roberts on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robin-roberts-393a934b/

• Skunkworks: https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/who-we-are/business-areas/aeronautics/skunkworks.html

• Vision, conviction, and hype: How to build 0 to 1 inside a company | Mihika Kapoor (Product at Figma): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/vision-conviction-hype-mihika-kapoor

• Hard-won lessons building 0 to 1 inside Atlassian | Tanguy Crusson (Head of Jira Product Discovery): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/building-0-to-1-inside-atlassian-tanguy-crusson

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Atlassian: https://www.atlassian.com/

• Vinod Khosla: https://www.khoslaventures.com/team/vinod-khosla/

• Top Five Regrets of the Dying: A Life Transformed by the Dearly Departing: https://www.amazon.com/Top-Five-Regrets-Dying-Transformed-ebook/dp/B07KNRLY1L

• Chase, Chance, and Creativity: The Lucky Art of Novelty: https://www.amazon.com/Chase-Chance-Creativity-Lucky-Novelty/dp/0262511355

• Clay Christensen’s books: https://www.amazon.com/stores/Clayton-M.-Christensen/author/B000APPD3Y

• Resonate: Present Visual Stories That Transform: https://www.amazon.com/Resonate-Present-Stories-Transform-Audiences/dp/0470632011

• Ferrari on Prime: https://www.amazon.com/Ferrari-Adam-Driver/dp/B0CNDBN672

• Montblanc fountain pens: https://www.montblanc.com/en-us

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Dylan Field is the co-founder and CEO of Figma, the collaborative design platform that has revolutionized how product teams work. In my first-ever live podcast, recorded at Figma Config, Dylan and I dig into:

• How intuition and product taste drive Dylan’s decision-making

• The challenge of keeping things simple

• Dylan’s thoughts on the future of product management

• Lessons from Figma’s early days

• How Figma built their initial user base

• Dylan’s journey from intern to CEO of a 1,000+-person company

• The future of design tools and AI

—

Brought to you by:

• WorkOS—Modern identity platform for B2B SaaS, free up to 1 million MAUs

• Anvil—The fastest way to build software for documents

• User Testing—Human understanding. Human experiences.

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/dylan-field-live-at-config

—

Where to find Dylan Field:

• X: https://x.com/zoink?lang=en

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dylanfield/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Introduction

(01:11) Welcoming Dylan Field

(02:36) Highlights and surprises from Config

(06:58) The philosophy of design

(08:01) Raccoon feet and muffin hands

(09:57) Building and refining intuition and product taste

(12:50) How to influence leadership

(16:14) The role of product managers

(21:12) The future of product management

(22:20) The importance of simplicity in design

(26:10) The long road to Figma’s launch

(27:44) Advice for aspiring entrepreneurs

(29:07) Knowing when it’s time to ship

(30:39) Early user acquisition strategies

(35:50) Spotting trends and future innovations

(39:20) Reflections on leadership and growth

(43:16) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Mihika Kapoor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mihikakapoor/

• Rick Rubin on the Creative Act—60 Minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sE1teB5bN-w

• Figma pages: https://help.figma.com/hc/en-us/articles/360038511293-Create-and-manage-pages

• Leading through uncertainty: A design-led company—Brian Chesky (Config 2023): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dkfijg7s76o

• An inside look at how Figma builds product | Yuhki Yamashita (CPO of Figma): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/an-inside-look-at-how-figma-builds

• Vision, conviction, and hype: How to build 0 to 1 inside a company | Mihika Kapoor (Product at Figma): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/vision-conviction-hype-mihika-kapoor

• An inside look at Figma’s unique GTM motion | Claire Butler (first GTM hire): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/an-inside-look-at-figmas-unique-bottom

• Zigging vs. zagging: How HubSpot built a $30B company | Dharmesh Shah (co-founder/CTO): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/lessons-from-30-years-of-building

• Nadia Singer on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nadiasinger/

• Sho Kuwamoto on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shokuwamoto/

• FigJam: https://www.figma.com/figjam/

• Tim Van Damme on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tim-van-damme-maxvoltar/

• Coda: https://coda.io/

• Shishir Mehrotra on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shishirmehrotra/

• Websim: https://websim.ai/

• eToys.com commercial (from Dylan’s childhood acting career): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3Y92aCmmbU

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Jessica Livingston is a co-founder of Y Combinator, the first and most successful startup accelerator. Y Combinator has funded over 5,000 companies, 200 of which are now unicorns, including Airbnb, Dropbox, DoorDash, Stripe, Coinbase, and Reddit. Jessica played a crucial role in YC’s early success, when she was nicknamed the “social radar” because of her uncanny ability to quickly evaluate people—an essential skill when investing in early-stage startups. She’s also the host of the popular podcast The Social Radars, where she interviews billion-dollar-startup founders, and the author of the acclaimed book Founders at Work, which captures the origin stories of some of today’s most interesting companies. In our conversation, we discuss:

• How Jessica gained the affectionate title of the “social radar”

• Why defensive founders are a red flag

• How to develop your social radar

• What she looks for in founders during YC interviews

• How YC’s early inexperience in angel investing led to the batch model

• Her favorite stories from interviews with Airbnb, Rippling, and more

• Lessons learned from hosting her own podcast

• Much more

—

Brought to you by:

• Enterpret—Transform customer feedback into product growth

• Anvil—The fastest way to build software for documents

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-social-radar-jessica-livingston

—

Where to find Jessica Livingston:

• X: https://x.com/jesslivingston

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jessicalivingston1/

• Podcast: https://www.thesocialradars.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Jessica’s background

(02:42) Thoughts on being under-recognized

(07:52) Jessica’s superpower: the social radar

(15:11) Evaluating founders: key traits and red flags

(21:00) The Airbnb story: a lesson in hustle and determination

(25:57) A YC success story

(28:26) The importance of earnestness

(32:45) Confidence vs. defensiveness

(34:43) Commitment and co-founder disputes

(37:46) Relentless resourcefulness

(40:00) Jessica’s social radar: origins and insights

(43:24) Honing her social radar skills

(45:44) Conviction and scams: a Y Combinator story

(46:50) The interview process: challenges and insights

(48:20) Operationalizing founder evaluation

(49:38) Advice for building social radar skills

(52:08) The “Reading the Mind in the Eyes” quiz

(55:19) Jessica’s podcast: The Social Radars

(01:00:34) Lessons from podcasting and interviewing

(01:09:58) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Paul Graham’s post about Jessica: https://paulgraham.com/jessica.html

• Paul Graham on X: https://x.com/paulg

• Robert Tappan Morris: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Tappan_Morris

• Trevor Blackwell on X: https://x.com/tlbtlbtlb

• Y Combinator: https://www.ycombinator.com/

• “The Founders” examines the rise and legend of PayPal: https://www.economist.com/culture/2022/02/19/the-founders-examines-the-rise-and-legend-of-paypal

• Patrick Collison on X: https://x.com/patrickc

• John Collison on X: https://x.com/collision

• Brian Chesky on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brianchesky/

• Nate Blecharczyk on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/blecharczyk/

• Joe Gebbia on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jgebbia/

• Airbnb’s CEO says a $40 cereal box changed the course of the multibillion-dollar company: https://fortune.com/2023/04/19/airbnb-ceo-cereal-box-investors-changed-everything-billion-dollar-company/

• Parker Conrad on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkerconrad/

• Zenefits: https://connect.trinet.com/hr-platform

• Goat: https://www.goat.com/

• Eddy Lu on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eddylu/

• Drew Houston on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drewhouston/

• Arash Ferdowsi on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/arashferdowsi/

• Lessons from 1,000+ YC startups: Resilience, tar pit ideas, pivoting, more | Dalton Caldwell (Y Combinator, Managing Director): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/lessons-from-1000-yc-startups

•Bitcoin launderer pleads guilty, admits to massive Bitfinex hack: https://www.cnbc.com/2023/08/03/new-york-man-admits-being-original-bitfinex-hacker-during-guilty-plea-in-dc-to-bitcoin-money-laundering.html

• Paul Graham’s tweet with the facial recognition test: https://x.com/paulg/status/1782875262855663691

• SmartLess podcast: https://www.smartless.com

• Jason Bateman on X: https://x.com/batemanjason

• Will Arnett on X: https://x.com/arnettwill

• Sean Hayes on X: https://x.com/seanhayes

• The Social Radars with Tony Xu, Co-Founder & CEO of DoorDash: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/Ja-tony-xu-co-founder-ceo-of-doordash

• The Social Radars with Brian Chesky: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/JW-brian-chesky-co-founder-ceo-of-airbnb

• The Social Radars with Patrick and John Collison: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/Kx-patrick-john-collison-co-founders-of-stripe

• The Social Radars with Brian Armstrong: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/K3-brian-armstrong-co-founder-and-ceo-of-coinbase

• The Social Radars with Emmett Shear: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/KM-emmett-shear-co-founder-of-twitch

• The Social Radars with Paul Graham: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/JV-paul-graham-co-founder-of-y-combinator-and-viaweb

• The Social Radars with Adora Cheung: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/L0-adora-cheung-co-founder-of-homejoy-instalab

• Founders at Work: Stories of Startups’ Early Days: https://www.amazon.com/Founders-Work-Stories-Startups-Early/dp/1430210788

• Startup School: https://www.startupschool.org/

• The Social Radars with Parker Conrad: https://www.ycombinator.com/library/Ky-parker-conrad-founder-of-zenefits-rippling

• Rippling: https://www.rippling.com/

• Carry on, Jeeves: https://www.amazon.com/Carry-Jeeves-Dover-Thrift-Editions/dp/0486848957

• Very Good, Jeeves: https://www.amazon.com/Very-Good-Jeeves-Wooster-Book-ebook/dp/B0051GST06

• Right Ho, Jeeves: https://www.amazon.com/Right-Ho-Jeeves-P-Wodehouse-ebook/dp/B083FFDNHN/

• Life: https://www.amazon.com/Life-Keith-Richards-ebook/dp/B003UBTX72/

• My Name Is Barbra: https://www.amazon.com/My-Name-Barbra-Streisand/dp/0525429522

• Clarkson’s Farm on Prime: https://www.amazon.com/Clarksons-Farm-Season-1/dp/B095RHJ52R

• Schitt’s Creek on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/series/schitts-creek-a2e7a946-9652-48a8-884b-3ea7ea4de273

• Yellowstone on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/stream-tv/yellowstone

• Sam Altman on X: https://x.com/sama

• Justin Kan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/justinkan/

• Alexis Ohanian on X: https://x.com/alexisohanian

• Steve Huffman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shuffman56/

• Breaking News: Condé Nast/Wired Acquires Reddit: https://techcrunch.com/2006/10/31/breaking-news-conde-nastwired-acquires-reddit/

• Charles River Venture: https://www.crv.com/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Ami Vora is the Chief Product Officer of Faire, which connects independent retailers and brands around the world. Before Faire, Ami spent over 15 years at Meta, including as VP of Product and Design for WhatsApp (2B+ users), VP of Product for Facebook’s ads system (now $130B of annual revenue), and director at Instagram. She began her career working on developer tools at Microsoft. In our conversation, we discuss:

• Why execution eats strategy for breakfast

• Using metaphor to rally teams around one shared goal

• How to build cross-functional relationships

• “Dinosaur brain,” “Toddler soccer,” and the “hill climbing” metaphors

• A tactic for handling disagreement

• Tips for working well with product-minded founders as a product leader

• The story of Ami’s incredible 15-year journey from temp to VP at Meta

• Much more

—

Brought to you by:

• Sidebar—Accelerate your career by surrounding yourself with extraordinary peers.

• Anvil—The fastest way to build software for documents.

• User Testing—Human understanding. Human experiences.

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/authenticity-and-curiosity-ami-vora

—

Where to find Ami Vora:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amvora/

• Substack: https://amivora.substack.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Ami’s background

(02:00) The myth of perfection in success

(07:55) Emotionally connecting with the job

(09:55) Embracing curiosity in moments of challenge

(13:16) Thinking in feedback loops

(17:17) The “dinosaur brain” metaphor in product reviews

(20:20) Strategies for conducting effective product reviews

(26:33) Using metaphors and imagery to communicate your vision

(29:35) The power of having a shared narrative

(31:55) WhatsApp: an example of metaphor in action

(34:44) Emulating people that inspire you

(36:19) WhatsApp video calling

(37:35) Why execution is greater than strategy

(41:36) Time allotment for strategy vs. execution

(45:10) How to become a better strategic thinker

(47:59) The intricacies of implementing feedback

(51:53) Being a female leader in tech

(55:13) Advice for young women in tech

(56:07) Setting goals and aligning incentives

(01:01:40) Acknowledging hard truths

(01:05:46) Lessons from transitioning to Faire

(01:08:40) The importance of a good CPO/CEO relationship

(01:11:17) Vetting heads of product and maintaining customer focus

(01:12:40) How Ami went from intern to leading major products at Meta

(01:14:53) The one thing you should do to be successful in product

(01:17:25) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Faire: https://www.faire.com/

• Making Meta | Andrew “Boz” Bosworth (CTO): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/making-meta-andrew-boz-bosworth-cto

•  Community Wisdom: AMA with Dan Hockenmaier + Facilitating a roadmap session, structuring product teams, navigating an acquisition, companies not needing PMs anymore, and much more: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/making-meta-andrew-boz-bosworth-cto

• Developing a growth model + marketplace growth strategy | Dan Hockenmaier (Faire, Thumbtack, Reforge): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/developing-a-growth-model-marketplace

• Dan Hockenmaier’s website: https://www.danhock.com/

• On Reviews: https://boz.com/articles/reviews

• Finding a global optimum always feels like a hill climb: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/amvora_finding-a-global-optimum-always-feels-like-activity-7074776143882588161-jhyy/

• Dolores Park: https://sfrecpark.org/892/Mission-Dolores-Park

• Rob Goldman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robgoldman/

• Execution eats strategy for breakfast, but execution without strategy leads to burnout: https://rationalpm.substack.com/p/execution-eats-strategy-for-breakfast

• The goal of a “strategy” is to change our own team’s behavior: https://amivora.substack.com/p/the-goal-of-a-strategy-is-to-change

• The paths to power: How to grow your influence and advance your career | Jeffrey Pfeffer (author of 7 Rules of Power, professor at Stanford GSB): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-paths-to-power-jeffrey-pfeffer

• Path to Power course outline: https://jeffreypfeffer.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Pfeffer-OB377-Course-Outline-2018.pdf

• Management Time: Who’s Got the Monkey?: https://hbr.org/1999/11/management-time-whos-got-the-monkey

• Max Rhodes on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/max-rhodes/

• Coupa Coffee: https://www.coupacafe.com/

• Brandee Barker on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandeedbarker/

• Year of Yes: How to Dance It Out, Stand In the Sun and Be Your Own Person: https://www.amazon.com/Year-Yes-Dance-Stand-Person/dp/1476777128 

• How to tell better stories | Matthew Dicks (Storyworthy): https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-tell-better-stories-matthew-dicks-storyworthy/

• A life of yes: Matthew Dicks at TEDxSomerville: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3TaQFcaMk4

• The Office on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/stream-tv/the-office

• 30 Rock on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/watch-online/tv/30-rock/6240863759978157112

• Dall-E-2: https://openai.com/index/dall-e-2/

• ChatGPT: https://chatgpt.com

• Fellow kettles: https://fellowproducts.com/products/stagg-ekg-electric-pour-over-kettle

• TikTok’s “Roman Empire” Meme, Explained: https://www.forbes.com/sites/danidiplacido/2023/09/21/tiktoks-roman-empire-meme-explained/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Tanguy Crusson is the product lead for Jira Product Discovery at Atlassian. In his more than 10 years at the company, he has been instrumental in taking several new products from zero to one, including HipChat, Statuspage, and Jira Product Discovery. In this episode, we dive deep into the struggles of innovating and building new products inside a large company. Tanguy shares candid stories about what worked, what didn’t, and his many hard-won lessons learned about how to successfully build 0 to 1. We cover:

• Why large companies with so many advantages still fail at creating new products

• Lessons learned from building HipChat

• How to avoid common pitfalls like competitive myopia and premature scaling

• Lessons learned from the acquisition and integration of Statuspage

• Insights from the success of Jira Product Discovery

• Tactics for protecting your “ugly babies”

• The power of “lighthouse users”

• The importance of having a “why now”

• Much more

—

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• Coda—The all-in-one collaborative workspace

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/building-0-to-1-inside-atlassian-tanguy-crusson

—

Where to find Tanguy Crusson:

• X: https://x.com/tanguycrusson

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanguy-crusson-99832a

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Tanguy’s background

(02:30) Tanguy’s journey at Atlassian

(07:03) The challenges of innovating in large companies

(10:42) Atlassian's high bar for excellence 

(12:58) The HipChat story: successes, failures, and lessons learned

(20:47) Lessons learned from building HipChat

(33:49) Statuspage: a journey of perseverance

(39:48) Acquisition challenges and lessons

(47:22) Strategic decisions: build, buy, or partner?

(48:17) Learning to articulate "why now"

(54:08) A quick summary of lessons in this episode

(55:40) The success and pain of launching Jira Product Discovery 

(58:10) Incubating new products: the Point A program

(01:00:13) Failure is the most likely outcome

(01:04:15) Atlassian's four-phase approach to launching new products

(01:09:20) Breaking rules without breaking trust

(01:16:16) Early success and team autonomy

(01:17:22) Innovating without disrupting existing customers

(01:23:17) The Lighthouse Users program

(01:30:00) Protecting and nurturing new ideas

(01:36:14) Balancing innovation with personal well-being

(01:38:17) A reminder to look after yourself

(01:42:06) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Atlassian: https://www.atlassian.com/

• HipChat: https://community.atlassian.com/t5/Hipchat/ct-p/hipchat

• Stride: https://community.atlassian.com/t5/Stride/ct-p/stride

• Statuspage: https://www.atlassian.com/software/statuspage

• Opsgenie: https://www.atlassian.com/software/opsgenie

• Jira Product Discovery: https://www.atlassian.com/software/jira/product-discovery

• HipChat billboard: https://x.com/HubSpot/status/654696998126272512

• Announcing our new partnership with Slack: https://www.atlassian.com/blog/announcements/new-atlassian-slack-partnership

• Slack shows it’s worried about Microsoft Teams with a full-page newspaper ad: https://www.theverge.com/2016/11/2/13497766/slack-microsoft-teams-new-york-times-ad

• What Is ‘Dogfooding’?: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/14/business/dogfooding.html

• Jira: https://www.atlassian.com/software/jira

• Confluence: https://www.atlassian.com/software/confluence

• PagerDuty: https://www.pagerduty.com/

• New Relic: https://newrelic.com/

• BigPanda: https://www.bigpanda.io/

• Transparent Uptime: http://www.transparentuptime.com/

• Vision, conviction, and hype: How to build 0 to 1 inside a company | Mihika Kapoor (Product at Figma): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/vision-conviction-hype-mihika-kapoor

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Lessons from Atlassian: Launching new products, getting buy-in, and staying ahead of the competition | Megan Cook (head of product, Jira): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/lessons-from-atlassian-launching

• Noah Weiss on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/noahw/

• Tanguy’s LinkedIn post about “lighthouse users”: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/tanguy-crusson-99832a_lighthouse-users-one-of-the-pm-techniques-activity-7176654510801502210-hWNi/

• Pixar Chief: Protect Your ‘Ugly Babies’ (Your Unsightly Ideas): https://www.forbes.com/sites/andyboynton/2014/03/17/pixar-chief-protect-your-ugly-babies-your-unsightly-ideas/

• Atlas: https://www.atlassian.com/software/atlas

• Point A: https://www.atlassian.com/point-a

• Scott Farquhar on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottfarquhar

• Who: A Method for Hiring: https://www.amazon.com/Who-Method-Hiring-HC-2008/dp/B004C79SRS/

• Hakim’s Odyssey: Book 1: From Syria to Turkey: https://www.amazon.com/Hakims-Odyssey-Book-Syria-Turkey/dp/1637790007

• Living with the Earth, Volume 1: Permaculture, Ecoculture: Inspired by Nature: https://www.amazon.com/Living-Earth-Gardeners-Permaculture-Ecoculture/dp/1856232603/

• INRIA: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Institute_for_Research_in_Computer_Science_and_Automation

• How a Hydrofoil Works: https://web.mit.edu/2.972/www/reports/hydrofoil/hydrofoil.html

• What Is Kitefoil or Foilboarding?: https://www.whenitswindy.com/wp/?page_id=534

• Freediving: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freediving

• Tanguy’s freediving stats: https://www.aidainternational.org/Athletes/Profile-00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000a45

• Perplexity: https://www.perplexity.com/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Jeffrey Pfeffer teaches the single most popular (and somewhat controversial) class at Stanford’s Graduate School of Business: The Paths to Power. He’s also the author of 16 books, including 7 Rules of Power: Surprising—But True—Advice on How to Get Things Done and Advance Your Career. He has taught at Harvard, the London Business School, and IESE and has written for publications like Fortune and the Washington Post. Recognized by the Academy of Management and listed in the Thinkers50 Hall of Fame, Jeffrey also serves on several corporate and nonprofit boards, bringing his expertise to global audiences through seminars and executive education. In our conversation, we discuss:

• Jeffrey’s seven rules of power

• How individuals can acquire and use power in business

• Networking, and how to do it effectively

• How to build a non-cringe personal brand

• How to increase your influence to amplify your impact

• Examples and stories of people building power

• Tradeoffs and challenges that come with power

—

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• Heap—Cross-platform product analytics that converts, engages, and retains customers

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-paths-to-power-jeffrey-pfeffer

—

Where to find Jeffrey Pfeffer:

• X: https://x.com/JeffreyPfeffer

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffrey-pfeffer-57a01b6/

• Website: https://jeffreypfeffer.com/

• Podcast: https://jeffreypfeffer.com/pfeffer-on-power/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Jeffrey’s background 

(02:54) Understanding discomfort with power

(04:56) Power skills for underrepresented groups

(07:51) The popularity and challenges of Jeffrey’s class at Stanford

(12:21) The seven rules of power

(13:03) Success stories from his course

(15:43) Building a personal brand

(21:11) Getting out of your own way

(26:04) Breaking the rules to gain power

(30:34) Networking relentlessly

(40:10) Why Jeffrey says to “pursue weak ties”

(42:00) Using your power to build more power

(44:34) The importance of appearance and body language

(47:15) Mastering the art of presentation

(55:12) Examples of homework assignments that Jeffrey gives students

(59:11) People will forget how you acquired power

(01:03:58) More good people need to have power

(01:10:49) The price of power and autonomy

(01:17:13) A homework assignment for you

—

Referenced:

• Gerald Ferris on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gerald-r-ferris-5816b1b5/

• Political Skill at Work: https://tarjomefa.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/4173-engilish.pdf

• Laura Esserman, MD: https://cancer.ucsf.edu/people/esserman.laura

• Taylor Swift’s website: https://www.taylorswift.com/

• Matthew 7: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%207&version=NIV

• Mother Teresa quote: https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/2887-if-you-judge-people-you-have-no-time-to-love

• Paths to Power course description: https://jeffreypfeffer.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Pfeffer-OB377-Course-Outline-2018.pdf

• 7 Rules of Power: https://jeffreypfeffer.com/books/7-rules-of-power/

• The Knowing-Doing Gap: https://jeffreypfeffer.com/books/the-knowing-doing-gap/

• Derek Kan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/derekkan/

• Mitt Romney on X: https://x.com/mittromney

• Elaine Chao’s website: https://www.elainechao.com/

• Tony Hsieh: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Hsieh

• Zappos: https://www.zappos.com/

• How I Did It: Zappos’s CEO on Going to Extremes for Customers: https://hbr.org/2010/07/how-i-did-it-zapposs-ceo-on-going-to-extremes-for-customers

• McKinsey & Company: https://www.mckinsey.com/

• Bain & Company: https://www.bain.com/

• BCG: https://www.bcg.com/

• Keith Ferrazzi’s website: https://www.keithferrazzi.com/

• Deloitte: https://www2.deloitte.com/

• Tristan Walker: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tristanwalker/

• Foursquare: https://foursquare.com/

• Laura Chau on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laura-chau/

• Canaan Partners: https://www.canaan.com/

• Andreessen Horowitz: https://a16z.com/

• Sequoia Capital: https://www.sequoiacap.com/

• Greylock: https://greylock.com/

• The Women Who Venture (WoVen) Podcast: https://www.canaan.com/woven/podcasts

• Imposter syndrome: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/imposter-syndrome

• Gary Loveman and Harrah’s Entertainment: https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/faculty-research/case-studies/gary-loveman-harrahs-entertainment

• “If you need help, just ask”: Underestimating compliance with direct requests for help: https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/faculty-research/publications/if-you-need-help-just-ask-underestimating-compliance-direct-requests

• Life story of Kathleen Frances Fowler: https://www.forevermissed.com/kathleenfowler/lifestory

• Jason Calacanis on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasoncalacanis/

• Jason Calacanis: A Case Study in Creating Resources: https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/faculty-research/case-studies/jason-calacanis-case-study-creating-resources

• You’re Invited: The Art and Science of Connection, Trust, and Belonging: https://www.amazon.com/Youre-Invited-Science-Cultivating-Influence/dp/0063030977

• View from the Top: https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/experience/learning/guest-speakers/view-top

• Omid Kordestani on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/omid-kordestani-46515151/

• Netscape: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netscape

•  Esther Wojcicki on LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/estherwojcicki/

• Leanne Williams: https://med.stanford.edu/profiles/leanne-williams

• Precision Psychiatry: Using Neuroscience Insights to Inform Personally Tailored, Measurement-Based Care: https://www.amazon.com/Precision-Psychiatry-Neuroscience-Personally-Measurement-Based/dp/1615371583

• Mark Granovetter on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-granovetter-8161704/

• The Strength of Weak Ties: https://snap.stanford.edu/class/cs224w-readings/granovetter73weakties.pdf

• Getting a Job: https://www.amazon.com/Getting-Job-Study-Contacts-Careers/dp/0226305813

• Acting with Power: https://www.amazon.com/Acting-Power-More-Powerful-Believe/dp/110190397X

• Articles by Herminia Ibarra: https://herminiaibarra.com/articles/

• Kingdom of the Planet of the Ape: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11389872/

• Jim Collins’s website: https://www.jimcollins.com/

• Dana Carney on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/danarosecarney/

• Baba Shiv: https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/faculty-research/faculty/baba-shiv

• Tony Hayward: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Hayward

• Lloyd Blankfein: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lloyd_Blankfein

• Regis McKenna: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regis_McKenna

• Jack Valenti: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Valenti

• Salman Rushdie quote: https://www.pinterest.com/pin/434175220328596286/

• How to build deeper, more robust relationships | Carole Robin (Stanford GSB professor, “Touchy Feely”): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/build-robust-relationships-carole-robin

• Carole Robin’s 15% rule: https://pen-name.notion.site/Carole-Robin-on-Lenny-s-Podcast-dc7159208e4242428f4b11ebc92285eb

• Karlie Kloss on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/karliekloss

• Lindsey Graham’s website: https://www.lindseygraham.com/

• Was Microsoft’s Empire Built on Stolen Code? We May Never Know: https://www.wired.com/2012/08/ms-dos-examined-for-thef/

• Who’s who of Jeffrey Epstein’s powerful friends, associates and possible co-conspirators: https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/12/us/jeffrey-epstein-associates-possible-accomplices/index.html

• Why Did Martha Stewart Go to Prison? A Look Back at Her 2004 Fraud Case: https://people.com/martha-stewart-fraud-case-prison-sentence-look-back-8550277

• Dianne Feinstein: https://www.congress.gov/member/dianne-feinstein/F000062

• Richard Blum: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_C._Blum

• Athena Care Network: https://www.athenacarenetwork.org

• James G. March: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_G._March

• Satya Nadella on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/satyanadella/

• Trump Organization fined $1.6 million for tax fraud: https://apnews.com/article/politics-legal-proceedings-new-york-city-donald-trump-manhattan-e2f1d01525dafb64be8738c8b4f32085

• Rudy Giuliani: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudy_Giuliani

• Harvard president resigns amid claims of plagiarism and antisemitism backlash: https://www.theguardian.com/education/2024/jan/02/harvard-president-claudine-gay-resigns

• Stanford president resigns after fallout from falsified data in his research: https://www.npr.org/2023/07/19/1188828810/stanford-university-president-resigns

• Rudy Crew: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudy_Crew

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.