"Everybody's frustrated with everybody right now," Rep. Jeremy Olson said on this episode of Plain Talk.

Olson is a Republican from Arnegard, and serves as the Majority Caucus Leader, and is well known as a "gentle giant" of North Dakota politics. Which is to say that his comment about fist fights was tongue-in-cheek, but he was expressing a real sense of frustration as lawmakers reach the hectic end of their session.

Lawmakers are locked in tough debates over things like property taxes, budget bills, and school choice, though the last of those bills failed earlier this week.

In particular, Olson spoke about the incessant division of complicated budget bills, such as the appropriation for the Commerce Department, which saw its amendments divided, and then the final bill amended, with most of that action being led by Rep. Ben Koppelman, a Republican from West Fargo.

"When some people get up or when some divisions happen, you can kind of hear an audible groan in the room," Olson told us. "I'll leave it at that."

Olson also spoke of legislation he's championed to incentivize oil exploration. Specifically, House Bill 1483 and Senate Bill 2397 which would lower tax burdens for oil exploration outside of the hottest areas of the Bakken and Three Forks formations.

"They could find the next big boom in the Williston Basin," he said. "So, in order to help them offset that cost, that risk, we're giving them a financial incentive."

Also on this episode, co-host Chad Oban and I talk about the bitter and surprising way this sessions debate over school choice bills ended, and analyze who has the strongest hand to play in the final fight over property tax reform.

This episode is presented by Bakken Backers. Bakken Backers is a coalition of businesses, leaders, workers, and citizens who support energy production from the Bakken formation and its many benefits for North Dakota. Learn more at www.BackTheBakken.org.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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Just before Gov. Kelly Armstrong appeared on this episode of Plain Talk, he issued two vetoes for two very controversial bills passed by the legislature.

The first was a rejection of Senate Bill 2307, a book ban bill sponsored by Sen. Keith Boehm. "I'm kind of a free speech absolutist," Armstrong said of his decision to spike the legislation, "because nobody's ever figured out who polices the policers."

Armstrong criticized the legislation for making librarians and educators subject to potential civil and criminal penalties based on complaints filed against books from anywhere in the country. "They don't have to be in North Dakota. It's any individual," he said, calling the process the legislation set up "untenable and unworkable."

Armstrong, who is a proponent of school choice policies, said he vetoed House Bill 1540, sponsored by Rep. Ben Koppelman, because it "is only for private school." What would a better school choice bill look like? One that "allows more parents more options to do more things and have more autonomy over their kids' education," he said. "And that includes a small rural school district that is 150 miles away from the closest private school."

The governor is urging support for Senate Bill 2400, backed by Sen. Michelle Axtman, which is still alive in the legislative session. That bill would make education savings accounts available for all students for approved education expenses beyond just private school tuition.

Also on this episode, singer and songwriter Chuck Suchy, new minted as North Dakota's official state troubadour, talked about that honor, and his musical career.

"I am very grateful," he said, adding that he's happy "the state community embraces music, and I hope art and humanity."

This episode is brought to you by the North Dakota Petroleum Foundation, providing education and outreach opportunities related to the petroleum industry, advancing quality of life initiatives, and promoting and enhancing the conservation heritage of North Dakota. Learn more at www.NDPetroleumFoundation.org.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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Dane DeKrey is a criminal defense attorney with the Moorhead-based lawfirm Ringstrom Dekrey. He recently signed onto an amicus brief in a legal fight over an executive order signed by President Donald Trump, which exacts retribution on a law firm Trump feels has wronged him. It does so by, among other punitive measures, revoking the firm's security clearances and prohibiting its personnel from entering government buildings.

In his order, Trump accused the law firm WilmerHale of engaging "in obvious partisan representations to achieve political ends" and "the obstruction of efforts to prevent illegal aliens from committing horrific crimes and trafficking deadly drugs within our borders." But from another perspective, that's just engaging in the political process and representing criminal defendants.

DeKrey says his support for the law firm isn't about politics. It's about principles. "I couldn't care less that this comes from Donald Trump," he said on this episode of Plain Talk. "I care that the rule of law is being questioned and as lawyers and as my law firm...we defend people who are not sympathetic the vast majority of the time. And if a person who is not sympathetic cannot call out for a lawyer and have someone answer, we are in a dangerous territory and I don't want to be there."

Also on this episode, Sen. Kyle Davis, a Republican from Fargo, took a break from his work on the Appropriations Committee to talk to us about the progress toward funding a new state hospital in Jamestown, the challenges the state faces in delivering mental health services, and the debates over school choice policies and property taxes.

He also commented on a last-minute amendment to the budget for the Office of Management and Budget to create a "life education committee" that would promote alternatives to abortion. The committee, which would be appointed by the governor and legislative leaders, would have $1.5 million in funding and would be tasked with contracting with a third party entity to provide pro-life education services.

"I've always pushed back on bills that get added in the last minute," Davison said of the amendment, adding that he has "a bit of frustration in regards to it not being a standalone bill."

"Those standalone bills that make it all the way through have had a minimum of four hearings, two of them in appropriations and they're better pieces of legislation because of it when they pass through like that," he said. "Especially when you're setting something up new and it's a new appropriation."

He also said that lawmakers are mindful of last year's state Supreme Court ruling, which struck down the OMB budget from the 2023 session for not complying with the state constitution's single-subject mandate.

"There is no question in my mind that we as a legislature are paying attention to that decision made by the Supreme Court in regards to the OMB budget," he said.

This episode is brought to you by the North Dakota Petroleum Foundation, providing education and outreach opportunities related to the petroleum industry, advancing quality of life initiatives, and promoting and enhancing the conservation heritage of North Dakota. Learn more at www.NDPetroleumFoundation.org.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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When former Lt. Gov. Brent Sanford accepted the job as interim chancellor of the North Dakota University System, he said a long time colleague contacted him to say he's "proven that you like dysfunction and you like to jump into that."

Sanford said he laughed it off.

"I hope it's not that I'm some kind of junkie for chaos for goodness sakes, but there's a lot in in in higher ed in general, especially with what's happening at the federal level," he said on this Plain Talk. "I mean, there's a lot of people that say, 'Why in the world would you want to go this direction?'"

Speaking of chaos at the federal level, North Dakota State University recently announced that a foreign student who was here legally on a work and education program was detained for deportation by ICE. Sanford said that's going to be a significant challenge for a university system that has many staff, faculty, and students who aren't citizens.

"Canadians are even nervous about this," he said. "I was just talking to a gentleman at breakfast that said down in Arizona the snowbirds that are Canadians are selling their house. They're not only offended but they're scared about this."

"I hope we get this under control and return to an environment where we're respecting legal immigration," Sanford added. It should be noted that, after serving as Lt. Governor, Sanford headed up a recruitment program operated by North Dakota's oil industry that sought to recruit workers from Ukraine.

Looking ahead, Sanford's initial focus as Chancellor will be on accountability, transparency, and conducting a "listening tour" across the state to understand the needs of stakeholders. He also said he was open to making his appointment as chancellor a permanent one. "I can say that pretty comfortably even though I haven't even started," he said.

Also on this episode, co-host Chad Oban and I discuss the latest twists and turns in the property tax debate, the likely fate of Sen. Keith Boehm's book ban bill should it be sent to Gov. Armstrong's desk, and Rep. Lori VanWinkle playing the victim card against criticism of her mid-session ski vacation.

This episode is presented by Bakken Backers. Bakken Backers is a coalition of businesses, leaders, workers, and citizens who support energy production from the Bakken formation and its many benefits for North Dakota. Learn more at www.BackTheBakken.org.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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"The way the current process is set up, it is ready for exploitation and weaponization," Rebecca Binstock said on this episode of Plain Talk.

Binstock is the executive director of the North Dakota Ethics Commission, and she admits that there are problems with the status quo. For instance, public servants who have a complaint filed against them are prohibited, under threat of criminal penalty, from talking about it, even though the person who filed the complaint is free to say whatever they want. She also says that complaints take too long to process because they require the commission to host what can be a lengthy and often fruitless mediation between the complainant and the respondent.

But rather than fix these issues, Binstock says lawmakers seem more interested in making the commission's job harder. Recently, a House committee that is considering the commission's budget cut funding for a new staffer-- currently the staff consists of just Binstock and two others--and imposed a 180 day time limit for a complaint.

While Binstock said a deadline might make sense in some circumstances, in this context, it may make their jobs next to impossible.

In response to the committee's actions, the Ethics Commission put out a statement saying the changes are "a roadblock intended to hamper the commission’s work.” That language--specifically the use of the word "hamper"--is interesting because the ethics amendment to the state constitution states, "Laws may be enacted to facilitate, safeguard, or expand, but not to hamper, restrict, or impair" the ethics commission.

Does the commission consider the committee's actions a potential constitutional violation?

"It certainly has been a discussion," Binstock said, when asked.

"I think the commission statement kind of speaks for itself," she added.

Also on this episode, Sen. Jeff Barta, a Republican from Grand Forks, responds to the defeat of a so-called "parental rights" bill, the passage of a new legislation governing genders in bathrooms,  and his work to create a collaborative process between the U.S. military and state/local interests when it comes to the impact of development and industrialization about military installations in our state.

This episode is brought to you by the North Dakota Petroleum Foundation, providing education and outreach opportunities related to the petroleum industry, advancing quality of life initiatives, and promoting and enhancing the conservation heritage of North Dakota. Learn more at www.NDPetroleumFoundation.org.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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If you're a Republican on the ballot in North Dakota you're probably going to win.

It wasn't always that way, and it won't always be that way, but it is that way now, and it makes a problem within the NDGOP, where a certain faction is playing games with the rules to control which candidates appear on the ballot as Republicans, all the more acute.

"What's going on is we have some gamesmanship at the district level where the districts are basically telling the state party that they are autonomous and they can do their own thing and they don't have to answer to the state committee or the state Republican party," Robert Harms said on this episode of Plain Talk.

What this means, as a practical matter, is that if you want to get involved in local politics, as a candidate or a district-level leader, or even as a just a rank-and-file party member, you may get locked out by political shenanigans.

Harms is a former NDGOP chairman, who as served as legal counsel to multiple governors, and he is trying to get a law changed that prohibits political parties from setting uniform rules for their constituent districts.

He said the status quo, which sees some district leaders trying to keep meetings and rules a secret, is alienating people.

"I mean, we have former elected officials, statewide elected officials, long-time, lifelong Republicans saying, 'I'm done. I've had it. I'm not going to any more conventions, whether it's at the state level or the endorsing convention,'" Harms said. "I've had friends tell me, 'Harms, there is no way I'm going to engage with the Republican party any longer because of all the nonsense that's going on.'"

Also on this episode, co-host Chad Oban and I talk about the status of property tax reform in Bismarck, the local impact of the Department of Government Efficiency's (DOGE) cuts, and what the last weeks of the legislative session may look like.

This episode is presented by Bakken Backers. Bakken Backers is a coalition of businesses, leaders, workers, and citizens who support energy production from the Bakken formation and its many benefits for North Dakota. Learn more at BackTheBakken.org.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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"I think we are for certain going to see another property tax measure if that's the version that we kick out."

That's what Minot Republican Rep. Matt Ruby said of the watered-down version of Gov. Kelly Armstrong's property tax plan that the state Senate is currently backing.

"I don't think that that measure failing by that amount was because people love paying property taxes," Ruby continued, referring to the Measure 4 proposal to abolish property taxes, which more than 60% of voters voted against last year. "If we don't have a stepped plan where eventually we get to the point where it's zeroed out as best as possible...we're going to be right back in this position fighting."

Ruby also took questions about the failure of Attorney General Drew Wrigley's truth-in-sentencing legislation, and his decision to repudiate his vote in favor of a resolution opposing same-sex marriage.

Also on this episode, Sen. John Hoeven talked about tariffs, trade, the Department of Government Efficiency, and impeaching judges.

On that last, Hoeven called the push to impeach judges "concerning," saying it could threaten the independence of the judiciary, though he also said that there are things Congress can do to address practices such as judge shopping, or judges delaying infrastructure projects for years by allowing endless litigation.

Hoeven also took questions about whether he'd hold town halls. "I do public meetings all over the state and people can come. I mean, everybody's got their own style in terms of a town hall, but these are public meetings and I've always done many of them all over the state and I'll continue to do them," he said. "I also come on and talk to guys like you. I answer questions to the press, to the radio. People can come in and see me. I have meetings. I work pretty hard on staying connected with uh North Dakotans, and I respect them, and it's an honor and a privilege to serve him."

This episode is presented by North Dakotans for Public Schools. North Dakotans for Public Schools is dedicated to protecting and strengthening public education in North Dakota. United by the belief that public schools are the cornerstone of our communities; North Dakotans for Public Schools fights against harmful policies like voucher schemes that divert resources away from public schools. By bringing together educators, parents, school boards, and citizens; North Dakotans for Public Schools amplifies the voices of those who understand the critical role public schools play in shaping the future of North Dakota’s children and communities. Learn more and get involved at www.NDforPublicSchools.com.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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Gov. Kelly Armstrong is pushing a "bell to bell" ban on cell phones in schools, and his inspiration is a book called the Anxious Generation, which was written by Jonathan Haidt. But it's more than a book. It's also a movement. Casey Mock, the senior policy manager for Anxious Generation, joined this episode of Plain Talk to discuss their initiative.

Some are condemning this effort as another teen panic, but Mock says that's not so.

"You know what makes it different from a moral panic like the satanic panic or even going back to Salem witch trials type witch hunts is that we actually have pretty clear data that demonstrates the impact that not just phones but also social media is having on kids mental health on their educational," Mock said. "There's just pretty clear data that's been assembled over the last decade, decade and a half since these things have become mainstream which makes it materially different from some of these earlier moral panics."

He said the goal of the legislation is to make state government the"bad cop" and taking pressure off educators to police phone use.

Also on this episode, Coiya Tompkins, president of Grand Forks-based Community Violence Intervention Center, and Seth O'Neill, executive director of the North Dakota Domestic and Sexual Violence Coalition, talked about the uncertainties chaos in the federal government is creating for their work.

O'Neill said that getting answers on their current funding, and future appropriations, has proven hugely difficult among cuts implemented by top Trump administration adviser Elon Musk and his Department of Government Efficiency team. "So we just heard recently that the CDC, which funds rape prevention and education,they basically decimated that division. Cut people. We don't even know who we're supposed to supposed to call or who is our a grant manager there because they just pretty much cut everyone," he said.

"What I've been telling both federal people at the federal congressional level as well as our state folks is that we do not believe that what we are proposing is a want. It's a need," Tompkins added.

Both argued that while cuts to their programs may save money in the short term, over a longer period of time costs will accumulate if their services, which often help prevent crime and violence and ease burdens on the criminal justice system, become less accessible.

This episode is presented by Bakken Backers. Bakken Backers is a coalition of businesses, leaders, workers, and citizens who support energy production from the Bakken formation and its many benefits for North Dakota. Learn more at BackTheBakken.org.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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It's an annual tradition to have Gov. Kelly Armstrong on Plain Talk for a baseball-only episode contemporaneous to MLB's opening day. Unfortunately, we didn't keep our promise this time, since we're in the closing weeks of the legislative session in Bismarck, and there's a lot going on.

When you have the governor on in that context, you have to ask some political questions.

We asked Armstrong about amendments made to the property tax plan he's backing by the Senate Appropriations Committee at the behest of Senate Majority Leader David Houge.

"I spent six years in D.C. where a lot of times Republicans would walk in and step on a rake before we go vote," the former congressman said. "I think this is an unforced error," he added, "and I think this is what happens when you have a small group of people decide they're going to put amendments onto a bill without vetting it publicly."

Armstrong says he objects to lowering the tax credit homeowners would receive from $1,450 to $1,250, as well as the 75% cap on how much of a property tax bill that credit could offset. He also pushed back on intent language which aims to use Legacy Fund dollars to pay for non-primary residence properties which in many cases are owned by people who live out of state.

Armstrong also commented on amendments he's backing to ban cell phones in schools, saying it's not making him that popular with his own children. "I have two teenagers at home," he said. "You can about imagine how it's going."

Also on this episode, Rep. Dawson Holle, a Republican, and Rep. Jayme Davis, a Democrat, talk about their new Future Caucus, which seeks to bring together a bipartisan group of younger lawmakers so that they can find ways to work together.

Holle said it's helpful to coordinate these efforts, especially since older lawmakers don't necessarily understand modern issues. He described one older lawmaker who was confused about artificial intelligence issues. "AI, is that artificial insemination for cows?" Holle says he was asked. "Oh my goodness, no, that is artificial intelligence," he replied.

This episode is presented by Lignite Energy Council, an organization dedicated to protecting and enhancing the development of North Dakota’s abundant lignite resources. Their goal is to maintain a viable lignite coal industry and support the generation of electricity, synthetic natural gas, and valuable byproducts. Visit www.Lignite.com/Podcast to connect and learn more.

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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There is a big debate over criminal justice reform at the legislative session in Bismarck.

Attorney General Drew Wrigley suggests the state has been soft on crime, and that's resulted in higher crime rates. He's pushing a bill to keep people convicted of many crimes locked up for longer.

But Jonathan Holth, Gov. Kelly Armstrong's Commissioner of Recovery and Re-entry, pointed out on this episode of Plain Talk that, far from being soft on crime, North Dakota's incarceration rates have been climbing. According to state Department of Corrections data, he's right. The population in North Dakota's state prisons (not counting local jails) is up more than 15% over the last five years, and more than 47% in the previous 20.

There is friction between Wrigley and Armstrong's administration over Wrigley's sentencing bill, but Holth joined Plain Talk to talk about another set of bills lawmakers are considering.

House Bill 1425, 1417, and 1549, seek to create new tools to help those with addiction and mental health challenges navigate the criminal justice system and find peace and prosperity again.

HB1425 addresses diversion and deflection programs, which gives law enforcement, prosecutors, and judges some flexibility to get a person help instead of arresting, charging, and incarcerating them; HB1417 seeks to reform the probation and parole process, addressing things like paperwork and fees that could land people back in jail on minor technicalities; HB1549 deals with helping people re-entering society have the the things they need, like up-to-date ID, to find housing and jobs.

Holth says these three bills together provide "a comprehensive look at sort of the front end, the middle, and the back end" of the criminal justice system.

Also on this episode, Minot-area librarian Randi Monley, a co-chair of Right to Read ND, gave an update on the progress of Senate Bill 2307, which is book ban legislation introduced by Sen. Keith Boehm, who argues that North Dakota's libraries and schools are showing children pornography.

The legislation requires libraries to move supposedly offensive materials to places where children aren't allowed. "So in a K-12 library, what are you going to do? Are you going to have to have a separate space for just high school kids?" she asked. "I doubt many schools are going to do that.  Or does everything in the library need to be at the level for a kindergartener?"

Also on this episode, co-host Chad Oban and I discussed a hearing on Wrigley's legislation, Senate Bill 2128, which saw some less than truthful testimony.

This episode is presented by Bakken Backers. Bakken Backers is a coalition of businesses, leaders, workers, and citizens who support energy production from the Bakken formation and its many benefits for North Dakota. Learn more at BackTheBakken.org. 

If you want to participate in Plain Talk, just give us a call or text at 701-587-3141. It’s super easy — leave your message, tell us your name and where you’re from, and we might feature it on an upcoming episode. To subscribe to Plain Talk, search for the show wherever you get your podcasts or use one of the links below.

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