• 0:00 – 0:23 – Small Cuts, Big Impact: Marcel explains how trimming small recurring expenses added up to $7K/month in potential savings.
• 1:32 – 2:44 – Market Uncertainty Hits Everyone: Carson highlights how client indecision is stalling agency pipelines across the industry.
• 3:04 – 3:23 – Opportunity in Unstable Times: Marcel frames uncertainty as a chance to optimize, streamline, and future-proof the business.
• 4:02 – 4:36 – Sales Slowdowns and Staffing Pressure: Agencies must balance shrinking pipelines with existing team and overhead costs.
• 5:02 – 5:25 – Avoiding Cost-Cutting Traps: Downsizing without strategy can hollow out delivery capacity and worsen long-term profitability.
• 6:02 – 6:36 – Overhead First, Not Production: Carson shares a personal lesson on the importance of reducing overhead over core delivery staff.
• 8:05 – 9:56 – Balancing Optimism and Cash Management: Founders must weigh hopeful projections against real cash reserves to avoid crisis.
• 12:04 – 13:19 – Trigger-Based Decision Rules: Carson suggests creating clear, data-driven thresholds for when to take action—before it’s too late.
• 17:03 – 17:22 – Austerity Exercise Yields Results: Marcel’s audit of seemingly small expenses uncovered significant monthly savings.
• 21:01 – 22:37 – Smooth Transitions Are Possible: Fears around losing key people are often overstated—teams adapt and grow stronger.
• 27:12 – 28:13 – Use a Payroll Grid for Clarity: Marcel introduces a framework for assessing roles, costs, and time allocation to guide decisions.
• 34:10 – 35:06 – Profitability Benchmarks to Follow: Aim for ≤50% of income to delivery, ≤30% to overhead, and utilization of at least 50–60%.

• Connect with Carson via LinkedIn
• Get access to this model tool in the toolkit
• Parakeeto Foundations Course
• Free access to our Model Platform
• Podcast on benchmarking

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• 01:01 – 01:46 – Meet Today’s Guest: Jason Peck: Jason, a certified financial planner at EverWise Wealth Management, joins the show to share how agency owners can build wealth, protect their families, and stop relying solely on their business for financial freedom.
• 05:00 – 06:10 – Unique Challenges for Agency Owners: Jason outlines what makes agency finances different—volatile income, illiquid equity, and a heavy reliance on the owner’s involvement in day-to-day operations.
• 08:56 – 10:21 – Why You Must Build Wealth Outside the Business: Jason explains the risks of having all your financial eggs in the agency basket and how diversifying can protect you from unexpected life events.
• 12:27 – 13:56 – The 9 Core Areas of Personal Financial Planning: From relationships to estate planning, Jason walks through the key components of a comprehensive financial plan tailored to agency owners.
• 21:57 – 22:46 – The Tax Efficiency Trap: Marcel and Jason discuss the downsides of over-optimizing for taxes, including poor business visibility, unnecessary complexity, and missed opportunities for growth.
• 27:03 – 29:12 – Estate Planning & Partner Protection: Jason shares how to safeguard your agency and your loved ones with wills, powers of attorney, insurance policies, and buy-sell agreements.
• 30:53 – 33:36 – Planning for a Smooth and Intentional Exit: Whether selling or passing the business on, Jason explains how to align exit planning with personal goals and financial security.

Connect with Jason:

• LinkedIn
• EverWise

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• 00:51 – 01:14 – Meet Today’s Guest: Carson Pierce: Carson, a fan favorite at Parakeeto, joins the show to discuss a key challenge for agency owners—transitioning from expert to CEO while managing financial complexities.
• 02:01 – 03:10 – The Common Agency Struggle: Many agency owners are incredible at their craft but struggle with the financial side of running a business, leading to inefficiencies and profit loss.
• 05:01 – 06:40 – The Knowledge Gap in the Agency World: Historically, there hasn’t been much comprehensive content available to help agency owners understand the financials of their business, making it difficult to navigate profitability challenges.
• 09:01 – 11:00 – Breaking Down Agency Finances: Marcel and Carson introduce a simple but effective model that helps agencies determine whether they are set up for financial success or destined to struggle.
• 11:01 – 13:30 – Understanding the Delivery Margin: Why agency profitability is largely determined by how efficiently they deliver client work and how much of every earned dollar is left after delivery costs.
• 16:01 – 18:40 – The Impact of Small Pricing Adjustments: A 10% drop in billable rates can significantly affect profitability—why agencies must be intentional about pricing and scope.
• 18:41 – 21:00 – The Payroll Grid: Your Agency’s Financial Roadmap: How to break down staff costs, expected billable hours, and rates to create a clear financial model for your agency.
• 21:01 – 24:00 – Expense Allocation & Overhead Costs: Understanding where your money is going and ensuring overhead stays in check without cutting the things that drive business growth.
• 24:01 – 27:30 – Profitability Benchmarks & The 50/30/20 Rule: The ideal breakdown for agency spending—50% on delivery, 30% on overhead, and 20%+ in profit—and why most agencies don’t hit these targets.
• 27:31 – 30:00 – The Dangers of Underpricing & Low Utilization: Why agencies that don’t charge enough or struggle to keep their teams busy end up running on razor-thin margins (or even losing money).
• 32:41 – 35:10 – Why Agency Owners Must Know Their Numbers: Financial clarity leads to better decisions—knowing what’s working and what’s not is the key to running a sustainable agency.

• Connect with Carson via LinkedIn
• Get access to this model tool in the toolkit
• Parakeeto Foundations Course
   
• Books Mentioned:
  • Digital Dollars and Cents
  • Financial Management of a Marketing Firm
  • Software as a Science

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• 01:09 – 01:46 – Meet Today’s Guest: Mari-Liis Vaher: Marketing pro, entrepreneur, and author of The Greatest Marketer in the World, Mari-Liis is here to help agencies prove their value and keep clients happy.
• 03:04 – 03:40 – The Big Marketing Trust Issue: Ever had a client drop you out of nowhere, even though you were hitting all their goals? Mari-Liis explains why so many agencies struggle to prove their worth.
• 07:10 – 07:57 – Marketing Is More Than Just Ads: Think marketing is just running social media and ad campaigns? Mari-Liis breaks down why it’s actually a full system that needs to align with sales and leadership.
• 11:51 – 12:36 – Scaling vs. Burning Out: Mari-Liis shares the hard lessons from running (and exiting) a seven-figure agency—why she left behind endless client work to build something more sustainable.
• 17:04 – 17:46 – The Power of the “MIP Hour”: Setting aside an hour of focused, distraction-free work time each day can be a total game-changer for your productivity and stress levels.
• 24:47 – 25:26 – Don’t Just Take Clients at Their Word: When a client asks for SEO, Facebook ads, or a website, do you ask why? Mari-Liis explains why digging deeper leads to better results.
• 28:24 – 29:06 – The #1 Killer of Good Marketing: Most marketing doesn’t fail because the ideas are bad—it fails because of bad communication. Here’s how to make sure everyone’s on the same page.
• 37:41 – 38:30 – Why Keeping Clients in the Loop Is Everything: If you’re not giving your clients updates, they’re making up their own (usually bad) stories about what’s happening. Avoid that trap!
• 42:42 – 43:07 – Freebies & Book Launch: Get Mari-Liis’ free productivity guide, take a DISC personality test, and get early access to The Greatest Marketer in the World!

• Free Productivity Guide for Overwhelmed Marketers - Learn how to work smarter, not harder: Download Here 
• Free DISC Personality Type Test to Boost Your Impact in Communication – Understand how to communicate effectively in sales and marketing: Get It Free With Code MARCEL (this is a paid tool but with the coupon MARCEL, it is possible to download it for free.)
• Book Coming Soon: TheGreatestMarketer.com
• Connect with Mari-Liis:
  • Website
  • LinkedIn
  • Instagram
  • Facebook
  • TikTok

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• 00:55 – 01:14 – Meet Today’s Guest: Carson Pierce: Carson, a fan favorite at Parakeeto, joins the show to chat about a big shift in the agency world—why more agencies are ditching big teams in favor of lean, contractor-driven models.
• 01:34 – 02:29 – Agencies Are Shrinking Their Core Teams: Carson talks about a growing trend—agencies are keeping their leadership and strategy teams small while outsourcing most of the production work to contractors, freelancers, and offshore talent.
• 03:08 – 05:05 – Why Agencies Are Outsourcing More Work: Marcel breaks down the big reasons behind this shift, including rising salaries, AI shaking things up, a tough economy, and the fact that clients no longer care if their agency is local.
• 06:04 – 07:26 – Why Old-School Utilization Metrics Don’t Work Anymore: Carson explains how traditional utilization numbers can be misleading for agencies using more contractors, and why focusing on average billable rate (ABR) is a better approach.
• 08:03 – 10:44 – The Next Big Agency Trend: Internal Specialization: Marcel introduces the idea that agencies should focus on what they do best and outsource everything else—just like other industries have done to stay profitable.
• 12:02 – 14:04 – What Should You Keep In-House vs. Outsource?: Marcel shares a simple way to decide—play to your team’s strengths, keep control of the most critical parts of your client experience, and let experts handle everything else.
• 18:02 – 21:08 – Pricing Without Overcomplicating It: Marcel simplifies pricing strategy, explaining why agencies should stop obsessing over markup and hourly rates and instead focus on three things: revenue, pass-through costs, and delivery costs.
• 25:08 – 28:26 – Offshoring: The Good, The Bad, and The Smart Way to Do It: More agencies are hiring offshore talent to save money, but success depends on having solid processes and clear communication—Marcel and Carson share tips on how to do it right.
• 30:51 – 32:44 – The Future of Agencies: Smaller, Leaner, and More Specialized: Marcel predicts that agencies will continue breaking down into specialized teams, just like airlines and grocery chains have done, to survive in a market with shrinking margins.
• 34:22 – 35:04 – Final Takeaways: Marcel and Carson wrap up with a big reminder—profitability isn’t just about working harder; it’s about working smarter. Agencies that embrace internal specialization and strategic outsourcing will win in the long run.

• Connect with Carson via LinkedIn
• Get access to this model tool in the toolkit
• Link to Pie Chart Visualization
• Parakeeto Foundations Course
• Books
  • Digital Dollars and Cents by Jody Grunden
  • Financial Management of a Marketing Firm by David C. Baker
  • Software as a Science by Marcel, Dan Martell, Johnny Page & Matt Verlaque

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• 0:00 – 0:32 – Show Introduction & Guest Introduction: Marcel introduces Tim Thompson, Owner and Chief Revolution Thinker at RevThink. He shares how they met at the MYOB conference, where they bonded over deep discussions on agency profitability and creative business management.
• 0:33 – 2:25 – Tim’s Background & The Journey to RevThink: Tim shares his career transition from Hollywood production, where he worked with legends like Ridley Scott and Steven Spielberg, to consulting creative studios. His firm, RevThink, now supports 750+ creative agency owners worldwide in building financially stable businesses.
• 2:26 – 5:00 – The Challenge of Balancing Creativity & Profitability: Tim explains how many creative entrepreneurs struggle to balance financial discipline with artistic freedom. The industry often pushes efficiency metrics like utilization rates, but creative businesses need a different approach to pricing, budgeting, and decision-making.
• 5:01 – 7:32 – The Shift from Cost-Plus Pricing to Value-Based Models: Marcel and Tim discuss the shift from hourly billing and cost-plus pricing to value-based models. Agencies that fail to adapt often undercharge and overdeliver, leading to profitability struggles.
• 7:33 – 10:55 – How Agencies Can Ensure They’re Charging Enough: Tim introduces The Splits Method, a framework that separates costs into direct (project-related) and indirect (overhead). This helps agencies better understand where their money is going and ensures that profit is baked into pricing from the start.
• 10:56 – 14:25 – The Power of Profit as an Expense: Tim challenges agencies to treat profit as an expense, meaning it should be allocated first before deciding how much to spend on project costs. This ensures business sustainability and long-term financial stability.
• 14:26 – 17:00 – The Seven Ingredients for a Thriving Agency: Tim introduces RevThink’s Seven Ingredients framework—Creative, Production, Sales, Marketing, Operations, Finance, and Entrepreneurship—which helps agency owners optimize their business holistically as they scale.
• 17:01 – 19:50 – Overcoming the Fear of Raising Prices: Many agencies negotiate against themselves, fearing clients won’t pay more. Tim explains how agencies can increase their rates or adjust project scope to maintain profitability without sacrificing client relationships.
• 19:51 – 23:30 – The Production Roll-Up: A Simple Meeting to Keep Projects on Track: Tim shares his method for a weekly production roll-up meeting, where agency teams quickly review: Creative quality, Client relationships, and Profitability.
• 23:31 – 26:55 – The Importance of Profitability for Business & Personal Freedom: Marcel and Tim discuss why profitability isn’t just about numbers—it’s about freedom, growth, and legacy. Many agency owners unknowingly sacrifice their financial future because they aren’t pricing or managing projects correctly.
• 26:56 – 29:30 – Why Business Owners Must Stop Negotiating Against Themselves: Many agency owners undercharge out of fear that clients won’t pay more. Tim encourages owners to ask for what their work is truly worth and, if needed, target better clients who understand the value they provide.
• 29:31 – 32:10 – The Role of Entrepreneurship in Agency Growth: Tim discusses the entrepreneurial mindset required to scale a creative agency while managing financial risks. He explains how business growth, personal wealth, and legacy planning must be aligned.
• 32:11 – 35:50 – How Agencies Can Adapt to Industry Changes & Maintain Profitability: Marcel and Tim analyze industry shifts, including advances in technology, changing client expectations, and pricing pressures. They discuss how agencies can innovate and stay competitive in a rapidly evolving market.
• 35:51 – 38:20 – The Moral Argument for Running a Profitable Business: Marcel and Tim discuss why being profitable is a responsibility, not just a goal. A profitable agency provides stability for employees, fosters innovation, and allows owners to reinvest in their vision.

• Revthink.com
  • Revthinking Podcast
• Community
• 1-1 consulting
• Accelerators

• 0:24 – 0:54 – Show Introduction & Guest Introduction: Marcel introduces Kristen Kelly, highlighting her expertise in operations and agency profitability management.
• 1:01 – 1:45 – The Three-Part Profitability Management System Overview: Kristen recaps the framework discussed in previous episodes: the right data, ensuring financial, delivery, and sales data are clean; the right framework, having clear metrics and understanding relationships; and the right process, implementing structured cadences for decision-making.
• 1:46 – 3:07 – Why Process is Often the Missing Piece in Profitability Management: Marcel explains that many agencies mistakenly view profitability management as an event rather than an ongoing process. He highlights common pitfalls, such as assuming data will always be clean or that a one-time setup will be sufficient.
• 4:59 – 7:46 – Data Hygiene: Managing Messy Data in Agencies: Kristen and Marcel dive into the first major component of process—data hygiene. They discuss common data inconsistencies, such as naming conventions, incorrect project tracking, and human input errors. Marcel emphasizes the importance of an ETL (Extract, Transform, Load) process to clean and normalize data.
• 10:03 – 13:26 – Managing Change in Agency Operations: Kristen and Marcel discuss the second key aspect of process: change management. Changes in sales strategies, CRM systems, or project management tools can disrupt data reporting. A structured process ensures smooth transitions and prevents disruptions in decision-making.
• 17:01 – 20:52 – Cadence: Aligning Stakeholders for Operational Success: Establishing consistent meeting cadences ensures alignment between sales, operations, and finance teams. The right frequency depends on agency size and project nature. Monthly executive meetings should focus on key business objectives and resourcing decisions. Regular check-ins help prevent last-minute hiring crises and pricing inefficiencies.
• 28:51 – 33:07 – How Operators Can Manage Up and Set Expectations: Operators should proactively align reporting with leadership goals. Stakeholder management is crucial—Ops leaders should ensure data supports executive decision-making without overwhelming them with details. Simplification and consistency are key to maintaining executive buy-in.
• 33:08 – 36:56 – Fighting Unnecessary Complexity in Reporting: Marcel shares a common mistake: leaders often want overly detailed reporting, which adds unnecessary complexity and friction. The key is balancing detail with usability to avoid overwhelming decision-makers. Simple, actionable reports are more effective than highly detailed but impractical ones.
• 36:57 – 40:26 – The Real Value of Efficient Reporting: Shorter, More Productive Meetings: The success of a reporting system is measured by how quickly teams can align and take action—not by how long they spend looking at data. The less time spent in meetings discussing reports, the more time can be spent executing on insights.
• 40:27 – 42:40 – Final Takeaways: How to Get Started with Process Implementation: Start by identifying the key business decisions that require data support. Work backward from business objectives to define the right data and process framework. Establish clear cadences and responsibilities for maintaining data hygiene and managing change. Prioritize alignment and simplicity over excessive detail.

• Connect with Kristen via LinkedIn
• Free Toolkit
• Parakeeto Foundations Course

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• 01:04 – 01:35 – Guest Introduction – Mikael Dia of Funnelytics: Mikael Dia, former agency owner turned SaaS entrepreneur, shares his journey from running an agency to founding Funnelytics, a tool designed to visually map and analyze digital marketing funnels.
• 06:24 – 08:20 – How Funnelytics Was Born: Funnelytics emerged from the need to overlay real marketing data on top of strategic visualizations, allowing agencies and marketers to prove and optimize their funnel strategies effectively.
• 08:25 – 10:05 – The Importance of Visual Communication in Business: Marcel and Mikael discuss how visual communication aids in client understanding, enhances learning, and fosters trust, a principle rooted in adult learning theory.
• 10:42 – 12:13 – Impact of Visual Strategies on Agency Sales & Retention: Using visual models in sales processes helped Mikael’s agency close deals faster and at higher prices by positioning services as strategic solutions rather than commodity offerings.
• 12:24 – 14:06 – Enhancing Client Retention with Visual Reporting: By consistently tying marketing efforts back to a visualized strategy, agencies can effectively communicate progress, highlight bottlenecks, and demonstrate value to clients.
• 15:02 – 17:08 – Clients Need a Clear Path, Not Just Services: Clients struggle to see how individual marketing services fit into a bigger strategy. Mapping out a clear pathway from initial engagement to desired outcomes transforms how clients perceive agency value.
• 20:56 – 24:06 – Transitioning from an Agency to a SaaS Business: Mikael shares key lessons from shifting from an agency to SaaS, emphasizing the importance of knowing one’s strengths, finding a technical co-founder, and solving real customer problems.
• 27:19 – 32:24 – Common Pitfalls in SaaS Development: Mikael and Marcel discuss the challenges of product development, the need for technical expertise, and the mistake of building features based on assumptions rather than market feedback.
• 32:42 – 36:12 – The Reality of Finding Product-Market Fit: The conversation highlights the challenge of achieving product-market fit, the importance of iterating quickly, and the value of starting with a service-first approach before building software.
• 37:03 – 39:00 – Shifting Mindsets: From Proving Yourself Right to Proving Yourself Wrong: Marcel shares a key insight: the biggest shift in product development success comes when founders move from trying to validate their own ideas to actively seeking to disprove them as quickly as possible.

Connect with Mikael

• LinkedIn
• Facebook
• Facebook Group
• Funnelytics

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• 01:00 – 01:45 – Guest Introduction: Marcel welcomes back his co-founder, Ben Zittlau, highlighting his expertise in data operations and agency growth strategies.
• 03:35 – 05:50 – Scaling Data Operations: Lessons from Jobber: Ben shares insights from his experience at Jobber, detailing the challenges of building and scaling a data operations team in a fast-growing company.
• 08:43 – 13:14 – Why Agencies Struggle to Get Insights from Their Data: Discussion on how agencies collect vast amounts of data across multiple tools but fail to derive meaningful insights due to fragmentation and inconsistency.
• 13:15 – 16:05 – The Myth of a “Single Source of Truth: Marcel and Ben challenge the common belief that pushing all data into a single platform solves reporting issues, highlighting the reality of messy operational data.
• 19:26 – 21:48 – The Limitations of All-in-One Software Solutions: Exploring why all-in-one agency management tools often fail to deliver on their promise of seamless reporting and data integration.
• 24:43 – 27:44 – The Hidden Costs of Locking into a Single Platform: Discussion on how agencies become “trapped” by software providers, making it difficult to switch tools without major operational disruptions.
• 30:29 – 35:53 – How to Integrate Data Without Sacrificing Flexibility: A deep dive into the challenges of stitching data from various tools while maintaining adaptability and historical accuracy.
• 35:54 – 41:14 – Accuracy vs. Precision: Why Clean Data is a Myth: Why agencies should focus on broader trends instead of pursuing impossible data perfection, and how to handle data inconsistencies effectively.
• 41:15 – 44:15 – A Modern Data Approach: Extract, Transform, Load (ETL): Introduction to the ETL process, which allows agencies to clean and transform data before reporting, improving reliability and flexibility.
• 50:14 – 52:00 – Lessons from Finance: What Agencies Can Learn from Accounting: Marcel compares data operations to bookkeeping, explaining how structured financial workflows can serve as a model for better agency data management.

• Connect with Ben via LinkedIn
• Free Toolkit
• Parakeeto Foundations Course

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• 01:02 – 01:28 – Introduction to Manish Dudharejia: Manish Dudharejia, founder of E2M, is introduced as a leader in white label agency services, serving over 300 agencies globally with a focus on profitability and scalability.
• 01:34 – 02:45 – Manish’s Journey and E2M’s Growth: Manish shares how E2M evolved from serving diverse clients to specializing in white label services for agencies, growing to a 270+ member team over 12 years.
• 03:04 – 04:36 – Building a Culture of Excellence: Manish credits E2M’s success to a strong team and culture, emphasizing the importance of effective communication, realistic expectations, and timely delivery of high-quality services.
• 07:01 – 08:15 – Shifts in the White Label Industry: Manish identifies two major trends shaping the industry: combining local account management with offshore execution and leveraging AI to enhance efficiency and reduce costs.
• 10:55 – 12:01 – Problem-Solving as the New Specialization: Marcel explains how agencies are shifting from service-specific specialization to solving broader problems, requiring partnerships with white label providers to expand their capabilities.
• 15:14 – 17:11 – Hybrid Models for Scalable Agencies: Manish discusses the benefits of a hybrid model, where agencies maintain in-house teams for client-facing roles like sales and account management while outsourcing execution to white label partners.
• 17:11 – 18:47 – Profitability through White Label Partnerships: Marcel highlights how white label partnerships allow agencies to focus on high-margin activities, scale efficiently, and achieve better profitability by outsourcing execution.
• 22:43 – 24:02 – Flexibility and Scalability with White Label Models: Manish emphasizes the flexibility white label partners offer, allowing agencies to scale resources up or down based on demand while minimizing operational risks.
• 31:02 – 32:43 – Specialization and Delegation: Marcel and Manish discuss the importance of focusing on core competencies and outsourcing non-core tasks to partners who excel in those areas, enabling agencies to scale effectively.
• 34:28 – 36:07 – Outsourcing What You Don’t Enjoy: Manish shares two key frameworks for agency owners:
  • Outsource tasks that cost less than your billable rate.
  • Delegate tasks you dislike to partners who excel in those areas, creating win-win scenarios.

• Connect with Manish
  • LinkedIn
  • Twitter
  • E2M Solutions

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