The Art of Selling Online Courses

Send us Fan Mail

Want to 2-10x your email list size quickly? Download our FREE Double Your Email List Guide 👉🏼 https://datadrivenmarketing.co/guide

There's a guitar teacher in Colombia who has nearly 600,000 YouTube subscribers, has taught over 70,000 students, and is personally answering WhatsApp messages from every new student himself. And that last part is completely intentional.

I sat down with Miguel Martinez, founder of ClasesDeGuitarra.com.co, to talk about what's actually happening to online course businesses right now, especially in the education space. Miguel has been doing this since 2012 and he's seen a lot change, but nothing like the last 12 months. YouTube reach for his channel has dropped to around 500 views in the first 48 hours of posting. The same video on Facebook? 20,000 to 30,000 views. So he adapted.

What I found really refreshing about Miguel is his philosophy around AI. Instead of trying to automate everything, he's doing the opposite. Weekly live classes, personal WhatsApp replies, a lean email list he cleans every three months so only engaged readers stay on it. He genuinely believes the answer to AI is to be more human, and he's building his entire business around that idea.

We also got into TikTok, which is working for him in ways most course creators never figure out, including a smart insight about why you won't see TikTok showing up in your referral analytics even when it's driving real traffic.

Miguel's market is Latin America, his courses top out at $79, and he's making this work on his own terms. It's a really different perspective from most guests we have on, and I think that's exactly why it's worth your time.

Hope you enjoy it.

Check out Miguel's work:
🌐 https://clasesdeguitarra.com.co/
📸 https://www.instagram.com/clasesdeguitarracomco/
▶️ https://www.youtube.com/clasesdeguitarracomco

Send us Fan Mail

Get your tripwire product ideas here: 👉🏼 https://datadrivenmarketing.co/tripwire

Natalia Rethmeyer had 80,000 YouTube subscribers and not a single person on her email list. No tripwire, no funnel, no strategy. Just videos going out every week into what felt like a void.

That's where Dominik sat down with her for this one, and what came out of it was one of the more honest conversations we've had on the show about what it actually takes to build something that lasts.

Natalia moved to Germany from Ukraine 12 years ago, couldn't speak the language despite three years of studying it, worked as a waitress while trying to get her masters, and eventually built Learn German Fast into a proper online course business with a team, a feedback system, and a list that grows by around 4,000 subscribers every month.

She doesn't chase trends. She hasn't launched a new product in years. And her revenue keeps growing anyway.

They get into how her email promotions actually work, why she sends around 20 emails in a two-week window and why it works, where her funnel has real gaps (Dominik is pretty direct about that), how she built a course with live teacher feedback that nobody else in her space was doing, and what she'd go back and tell herself if she could.

Her answer to that last one is not what you'd expect.

Dominik also pushes her on surveys, tripwires, order bumps, and the stuff most course creators avoid thinking about. She takes all of it in good spirit and it makes for a genuinely useful conversation.

I think you'll like this one.

Check out Natalia's work:
🌐  https://learngermanfast.de/
📸  https://www.instagram.com/learn.german.fast/
▶️  https://www.youtube.com/c/LearnGermanFast

Send us Fan Mail

2-10x your email list size in just 3 steps 📩 https://datadrivenmarketing.co/guide

Abbie Emmons built a YouTube channel closing in on 600,000 subscribers, 7,000 students across her courses, a Patreon membership she 10x'd in six months, and a traditionally published book on the way. And she teaches people how to write novels. 

In this episode, I sit down with Abbie to pull apart how she actually built and runs her business. We get into the move from Patreon to her own membership site, why she prices and sells courses both inside and outside the membership, and how she turned $3 templates into a surprisingly meaningful revenue stream by simply deciding to stop giving them away for free.

One moment that really stood out was Abbie describing how a single quiz video brought in around a THOUSAND new email subscribers. 

We also get honest about something a lot of creators struggle with. Abbie openly says her courses "kind of sit dormant" when she isn't actively promoting them, and the two of them dig into why that happens and what to do about it. I walk through the problem-agitation-solution email framework we use to give creators a real reason to talk about their courses, not just when something new launches.

If you're building a creator-led course business and you've ever felt weird about promoting what you've made, this one's for you.

Check out Abbie's work:
🌐 http://www.abbieemmonsauthor.com
📸 http://www.instagram.com/makeyourstorymatter
▶️ http://www.youtube.com/abbieemmons

Send us Fan Mail

Grow your course revenue up to 30% in 7 days - no paid ads, no sales calls 📈https://datadrivenmarketing.co/roadmap

Ross Rosenberg has 38 million YouTube views, over 200,000 books sold in 12 languages, and a podcast in the top 2% globally. 

Ross is one of the world's leading voices on codependency and narcissistic abuse. He founded the Self-Love Recovery Institute back in 2013 and has been building his audience online ever since, mostly by figuring things out as he went, which is both the charm and the challenge of his story.

We talked about how a throwaway tip at a dinner party got him onto YouTube before almost anyone else in his field. We got into why the shift from long-form to short-form content nearly crushed his business model, and what he's doing differently now to rebuild. He was refreshingly candid about a marketing company he hired that sent him clickbait scripts he flatly refused to follow, why his curated 10,000-person email list carries a 30 to 40 percent open rate, and what he's trying to get in place before he steps back at 67.

Ross isn't your typical "here's the funnel that made me a million dollars" guest. He's someone who built something genuinely significant, navigated a slowdown with honesty, and is still pushing forward on his own terms. I found his perspective really refreshing.

Hope you enjoy it as much as I did.

Check out Ross's work:
🌐 https://www.selfloverecovery.com
📸 https://www.instagram.com/rossrosenberg_slri/
▶️  https://www.youtube.com/rossrosenberg

Send us Fan Mail

Eddie van Dongen spent years doing what most musicians dream of. Touring Europe, playing 200-show theater runs, recording, performing. And then COVID hit, and overnight there was nothing. No gigs, no income, no plan.

That moment forced him to ask a question he'd never had to ask before: what would it look like to actually build a business, not just be a freelancer hoping the phone rings?

Eddie is a professional drummer from Rotterdam, endorsed by major brands and featured on Dutch national TV. But what makes his story genuinely interesting is how he got from that COVID wake-up call to running Eddie's Drum Academy, an online platform built around a completely different way of teaching drums. Not fill packs, not lick libraries, but a creative framework that teaches drummers how to think.

In this conversation, Eddie and I got into a lot. His burnout at music college and how studying meditation changed not just his playing but his whole approach to business. Why he believes you have to be okay with being ignored if you're building something real. His Meta ads funnel selling a 37-euro ebook with a 2.5 to 3.5 ROAS. How his order bumps are converting around 40%. And what he's working toward next.

He's honest, thoughtful, and clearly someone who built this from scratch with no marketing background. I think you'll really enjoy this one.

Check out Eddie's work:
🌐 https://eddiesdrumacademy.com/
📸  https://www.instagram.com/eddievandongendrums/
▶️ https://www.youtube.com/ ⁨@eddievandongendrums⁩  

Send us Fan Mail

Gillian Perkins runs a multi-six-figure online business, has over 700,000 YouTube subscribers, and works fewer than 20 hours a week. She's also a homeschool mum of six. If you've ever wondered whether that kind of setup is actually possible, this episode is a pretty good answer.

John sat down with Gillian to talk through how she structures her courses and cohorts, why she's stopped running tripwire funnels with her organic audience, and why she actually leads with her most expensive product first. That last one goes against most funnel advice you'll hear, and her reasoning for it is worth listening to carefully.

They also get into webinars, which Gillian is pretty blunt about. She says 10% conversion is her standard, and anything under that feels like a flop to her. She breaks down exactly which price points make sense for webinars and which ones don't, which is genuinely useful if you're trying to figure out where they fit in your own business.

There's also a great section on how she found and hired her integrator, how she thinks about building a small team without losing her lifestyle, and why shrinking her team actually made the business more enjoyable and sometimes more profitable.

Gillian has been making videos about online business since 2017 and has clearly thought carefully about how to build something sustainable. A lot of what she shares here is quietly counterintuitive. I think you'll get a lot out of this one.

Check out Gillian's work:
🌐 https://gillianperkins.com
🌐 https://creatorfasttrack.com
🌐 https://startupsociety.com 
📸 https://instagram.com/gillianperkinsonline/
▶️ https://youtube.com/gillianperkinsonline/

Send us Fan Mail

Kim Foster spent 20 years as a family doctor before walking away to build a global platform around identity transformation. She now has over 250,000 YouTube subscribers, a TEDx talk under her belt, and a book coming out in 2026. But what made this conversation really interesting wasn't the credentials — it was how honest she was about what's working, what isn't, and where she's still figuring things out.

We got into her YouTube content strategy, specifically this idea of bringing people in with what they think they want, but giving them what they actually need. She talked about how she found her real niche through trial and error, not planning, and what the analytics told her that she never would have guessed on her own.

Then things got practical. John pulled up Kim's funnel live on screen and they walked through her opt-in rates, her confirmation page, her tripwire offers, and where the gaps are. It's a rare moment where you get to watch a real funnel audit happen in real time, with someone who's genuinely open about where she's leaving money on the table.

They also talked about her push into in-person speaking, the challenge of getting booked when you're known as a YouTuber, and why she's on the hunt for an integrator to help rein in her visionary side.

Warm, specific, and genuinely useful. I think you'll enjoy this one.

Check out Kim's work:
🌐 https://drkimfoster.com/
📸 https://www.instagram.com/drkimfoster/
▶️ https://www.youtube.com/KimFosterMD

Send us Fan Mail

Grow your course revenue up to 30% in 7 days - no paid ads, no sales calls 📈https://datadrivenmarketing.co/roadmap

Most course creators build a course, put it online, and hope people stick around. Adam Morgan did something completely different.

Adam is a UK-based architect with over a decade of real practice experience, and the founder of Arcademia, a platform that's grown to over 4,500 members globally. Dominik sat down with him to find out how he got there, and honestly, the story is not what you'd expect.

It started with a small set of screen-recorded training videos made for new staff at his architecture practice. No grand plan, just a way to stop repeating himself. Then Brexit hit, the practice started struggling, and Adam picked the project back up with a lot more intention. He renamed it, rebranded it, and started building something much bigger.

When a provider quoted him £120,000 to build a custom platform, he learned Claude Code and built it himself over three to four months. What he ended up with is not just a course library. It's got gamification, a leaderboard, AI-generated contracts, portfolio hosting, CV builders, project trackers, and an AI assistant. All built by an architect who had never coded before.

He also talks about why his most valuable members never cancel, how he grew to over 150,000 Instagram followers starting with £10–15 boosts per post, and what he tells course creators whose revenue has flatlined.

Adam is a genuinely straight-talking guy and this one had a lot of good stuff in it. 

Check out Adam's work:
🌐 https://www.archademia.com
📸 https://www.instagram.com/archademia_/
▶️ https://www.youtube.com/c/archademia

Send us Fan Mail

Want to 2-10x your email list size quickly? Download our FREE Lead Magnet Guide and increase your email list size by 2-10x, simply by following our proven step-by-step guide 👉🏼 https://funnels.datadrivenmarketing.co/the-complete-lead-magnet-guide

David Duffy is an Irish musician and bassist who co-founded Secrets of Solo, the biggest online school for solo swing dancing, with his wife Ksenia, a dance artist with over 200 million views online. One of their videos alone has 14 million views on YouTube. And yet, when those viral moments happen, the sales spike they expect... doesn't really come.

That's where this conversation gets really interesting.

John sat down with David to dig into the gap between attention and revenue, something a lot of creators feel but rarely talk about this honestly. David runs the marketing and business side of the school while Ksenia teaches, and he's refreshingly open about what's working, what isn't, and where they've been getting in their own way.

They get into the tension between being an artist and running a business, why Ksenia only wants one sale a year and what that's costing them, the €12 choreography challenge that brought in 70 new members at Christmas, and how to use analytics to figure out which part of your funnel actually needs fixing.

John also walks David through how to think about conversion benchmarks, monthly promotions, and why urgency works even when it doesn't feel like "you."

If you've ever felt like you're creating great content but not seeing it turn into consistent revenue, this one will resonate.

Hope you enjoy it as much as I did.

Check out David's work:
🌐 https://kseniaparkhatskaya.com/
🌐 https://secretsofsolo.com/
📸 https://www.instagram.com/ksenia_parkhatskaya/
▶️ https://www.youtube.com/ ⁨@secretsofsolo⁩  

Send us Fan Mail

Jayne Havens never planned to build a business. She just wanted to help her kids sleep.

But after one year of running a sleep consulting practice and feeling maxed out, she made a decision that changed everything. She stopped taking more clients and started teaching other people to do what she did. That was 2019. Today, roughly 75% of her income comes from a single $2,700 certification course, and she's still running it all from her kitchen table.

Dominik sat down with Jayne to dig into exactly how she built this, and honestly, it's one of the more refreshing conversations we've had on the show. No complicated funnels, no big ad spend, no content machine. Just Jayne showing up in Facebook groups, having real conversations, and being, as she puts it, the most helpful person in the room.

She also talks about how she uses her podcast not to attract new leads, but to close them. How she keeps a personal list of warm prospects on her phone. Why her affiliate partners outperform paid ads by a wide margin. And why she thinks copying someone else's funnel is a trap most course creators fall into.

If you're building something in a specific niche and wondering whether you really need ads or a massive audience to make it work, Jayne's answer is pretty clear.

I think you'll find this one genuinely useful.

Check out Jayne's work:
🌐 https://thecpsm.com/
📸 https://www.instagram.com/snoozefestbyjaynehavens/
▶️ https://www.youtube.com/@Becomingasleepconsultant