The Debrief with Jon Becker

Description

My guest today is Bob Koonce. Bob is the founder of High Reliability Group, which he created after serving 20 years in the United States Navy. Bob's distinguished naval career included serving on five different nuclear fast attack submarines and culminated with him being given command of the USS Key West, a $2 billion nuclear-powered Los Angeles-class fast attack submarine. Following his retirement from the Navy, Bob has worked in a variety of leadership roles, primarily in the energy industry, where he has led business development, project management, and consulting efforts for large and small companies. Bob is an expert in the leadership of high-reliability organizations and a co-author of the book, "'Extreme Operational Excellence,' which focuses on the culture of the United States nuclear submarine force. Our conversation today focuses on utilizing specific techniques he learned in the nuclear submarine community to drive the culture of high reliability organizations. 

Contact Info

Bob Koonce

President and Founder

High Reliability Group LLC

312-859-9311

www.hrghro.com

linkedin.com/in/bobkoonce

Books Recommended

Extreme Operational Excellence: Applying the US Nuclear Submarine Culture to Your Organization: DiGeronimo, Matt, Koonce, Bob: 9781478778127: Amazon.com: Books

Amazon.com: The High-Velocity Edge: How Market Leaders Leverage Operational Excellence to Beat the Competition: 9780071741415: Steven J. Spear: Books

Timestamps
Timestamps
00:01:55 Nuclear Submarine Culture

00:10:50 Methods of Developing Positive Culture

00:15:30 Authority and High-Risk Decision Making

00:22:40 Importance and Reinforcement of Lessons Learned

00:31:15 Bob’s Most Important Habit

00:31:50 The Most Important Element of Building an Effective Team

00:32:13 What Should Every Leader Know?

Starting next week The Debrief will be introducing a new series called Battle Proven Leadership (or BPL). In contrast to the long format and wide-ranging interviews of The Debrief, BPL episodes will be shorter and deeply explore a single topic in leadership with a goal of providing specific/actionable information that you can use to improve your leadership skills. My guests will be subject matter experts who operate in high stress environments both inside and outside the tactical community. Regardless of whether your battlefield is a military, law enforcement, or business operation, each episode will expose you to the viewpoints, techniques and tactics of leaders whose skills have been proven in high risk operations with zero margin for error.

My guest today is John Mattingly. John is a retired Sgt. from the Louisville Police Department who led the search warrant service at the home of Breonna Taylor on March 13, 2020 and was shot in the leg by her boyfriend Kenneth Walker before returning fire along with another officer resulting in the death of Ms. Taylor. This event, of course, became a huge catalytic event for protests, riots, lawsuits, death threats against the officers and, tragically, the shooting of two more officers in response to the multi-day civil unrest that followed. It has also led to three of the officers involved in obtaining the warrant as well as one of the officers involved in the raid being charged with federal crimes. John has recently written a book called 12 Seconds in the Dark that documents the facts of the case from his perspective and discusses numerous issues that have not been discussed in the media.

Timestamps

3:15 John’s Career History

6:40 Background Of The Warrant

13:40 John’s First Involvement In The Case

17:35 The Night of The Warrant, Ad Hoc Team & Training for Narcotics Units in LMPD

24:40 Arrival at the Scene, Initial Scouting & Apartment Layout

31:55 Search Warrant Service Begins 42:00 Initial Aftermath of the Shooting

52:40 John's Injuries and Medical Treatment

56:35 Press aftermath and inaccuracy of reporting 01:05:20 Initial Response of City

01:12:10 Lessons Learned – Training

01:18:50 Lessons Learned – Knock & Notice, Culture & Complacency

01:29:00 Lessons Learned – Narco Teams v. SWAT Teams and Body Warn Cameras

01:32:30 Lessons Learned – Agency Response to These Types of Events

01:37:00 John’s Cautionary Advice To Young Cops Working Narco

01:40:50 The Need for Debriefs to Avoid Complacency

Links
City of Louisville Investigative Files
NY Times Investigation

My guests today are Thor Eells and Don Kester from the National Tactical Officers Association or NTOA which is the largest tactical organization in the United States. Thor is a retired commander from the Colorado Springs Colorado Police Department where he served for 30 years. The majority of which was in tactical response including serving as a swat operator, a swat team leader and a team commander. Thor is currently the Executive Director for NTOA after serving many years as a board member and a trainer. Don is retired from the Pima County Sheriff’s Department in Arizona where he served as a SWAT team operator, team leader, team sergeant, training director and SWAT team commander eventually retiring as a Division
Commander and Captain. Don is currently the training and education director for the NTOA after many years of service as a trainer and a board member.

Timestamps

02:00 – Thor’s background and law enforcement career

05:00 – Don’s background and law enforcement career

11:00 – The mission of the National Tactical Officers Association

15:30 – The relationship between state associations and the NTOA

20:30 – Police reform movements & the role of the NTOA as information provider

37:00 – National standards for special tactics teams

46:00 – Maintaining training standards with diverse team capabilities

55:00 – The NTOAs role in supporting teams with subject matter expertise

1:00:00 – The need to honest self-examination and debriefing

1:05:00 – The roots of bad legislation and need for law enforcement to oppose it

1:11:00 – No knock warrants, dynamic entries, and the NTOAs position paper

1:32:00 – The counter arguments for dynamic tactics and no-knock warrants

1:34:00 – Risk management and safety priorities

Contact Info
Thor Eells - [email protected]
Don Kester - [email protected]

Links
NTOA | National Tactical Officers Association

Description
This is a very special joint episode between the CATO Podcast and the Debrief hosted by CATO President Brent Stratton
and Jon Becker. Our guest today is Medal of Honor recipient Staff Sergeant Earl D. Plumlee. MSgt Plumlee received the
Medal of Honor for his actions on August 28, 2013 in Afghanistan. We were extremely lucky to sit down with MSgt
Plumlee after he spoke at the CATO Conference this year. In this episode we will hear the story of his amazing actions
that day, talk about training, preparation, and mindset and learn from a true American hero.

Timestamps
2:10 Earl’s Career History
6:35 Mission of Army Special Forces Units
17:00 Arrival at FOB Ghazni
20:00 Precursors of the Attack
28:40 Day of the Attack
33:00 Engagement Begins
55:00 Earl and Drew Regroup
66:00 Effects of Earl’s Training on His Response
77:00 Embracing Weakness to Elevate Performance
87:00 Stress Innoculation Lessons Learned
90:00 Attention to Detail and Unit Culture
98:00 The Meaning of the Medal of Honor to Earl
103:00 The Need for Family and Work Life Balance

Links
Medal of Honor Presentation - Remarks on Presenting the Medal of Honor to Master Sergeant Earl D. Plumlee and
Posthumously to Sergeant First Class Alwyn C. Cashe and Sergeant First Class Christopher A. Celiz | The American
Presidency Project (ucsb.edu)

My guest today is a legend in the US tactical community Chief Phil Hansen.  Phil recently retired after serving as the Chief of Police for the Santa Maria California Police Department.  But prior to Santa Maria Phil retired as a Captain from the Los Angeles Country Sherriff’s Department where he served for 36 years.  During his tenure at LASD he spent more than 24 years in full time tactical and emergency management positions, including nearly 20 years at the elite Special Enforcement Bureau (SEB). Phil has served as a board member of the National Tactical Officers Association since 1991 including serving as the Chairman of the Board. He is a member of the executive committee for the California POST SWAT guidelines, and has served as a board of inquiry member for LAPD and Oakland PD.  

Timestamps
01:45 – Early Career and Start at LASD
04:30 – Arrival at SEB
06:00 – Evolution of Dynamic Entry & The War on Drugs
11:15 – The Menu of Options for Narcotics Warrants 
19:00 – Unit Culture, Constant Development, & Selection
25:15 – John Kolman and The Origins of the NTOA
35:00 – Development of California SWAT Standards. NTOA National Standards & Current Legal Attacks on SWAT
51:30 – The Need for Effective Downward Information Flow and Information Sharing
59:00 – Phil’s Time at Emergency Operations Bureau
1:02:00 – Navigating Career Adversity
1:08:00 – Santa Maria PD Career
1:10:00 – Modern Issues in Special Tactics – Interagency Relationships 
1:22:00 – Justifications & Reasons for Special Tactics Teams
1:30:00 – Rapid Fire Questions

Contact Info 
Cell # (805) 994-9051
Email: [email protected]

Books Recommended
Contrarians Guide to Leadership - Steven B. Sample and Warren Bennis – ISBN: 978-0787967079
Going Pro, The Deliberate Practice of Professionalism - Tony Kern, Pygmy Books Publishing – ISBN: 978-0984206315
Leading Change: The Argument for Values-Based Leadership – James O’Toole – ISBN: 978-0345402547
Passion of Command: The Moral Imperative of Leadership – Col. Bryan McCoy – ISBN: 978-0940328372

Description
On November 13, 2015, Paris experienced a series of coordinated Islamist terrorist attacks. These attacks took place
over three separate areas of the city and were carried out by multiple teams of attackers. Almost four hours after they
began the events ended with a dramatic and successful hostage rescue that will be the topic for today’s discussion.
This episode of the debrief will have a slightly different format. My guest today is an active member of France’s elite
Brigade for Research and Intervention or BRI. Because of the nature of his current assignment and the nature of their
work, it is critical that we maintain his anonymity. As a result, we will not be showing this episode on video or using our
guest’s real name.

Timestamps
2:00 – Policing in France – Structure and agencies
5:15 – Origins, History, and Mission of BRI
11:15 – Overview of the November 13 attacks on Paris
12:52 – Location 1 - Stadt D’ France suicide bombers
16:30 – Location 2 – Café and bar attacks in 10th arrondissement
19:30 – BRI activation and staging
22:35 – Location 3 – Bataclan theater attack begins
27:45 – Street police arrival and entry
31:30 – BRI arrival on scene and initial entry
39:50 – First engagement with terrorists
46:09 – Negotiations
50:00 – Description of the HRT area
52:30 – Assault
1:05:00 – Clearing remainder of corridor
1:09:00 – Effects of the event on team
1:21:30 – Lessons learned from the Bataclan HRT

Links
Netflix special on the Paris Attacks: Watch November 13: Attack on Paris | Netflix Official Site
Timeline and overview by France24 - Paris attacks: The investigation continues (france24.com)
HSAC whitepaper on events - hsac-paris-lessons-learned_whitepaper.pdf (pepperdine.edu)

Description

Kevin Cyr is an Inspector with the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and is the current commander of the RCMP Emergency Response Team in British Columbia, which is the second largest tactical unit in Canada. Kevin has been with the RCMP for 22 years and has been with the team for 7 years. He has a master’s in law from Osgoode Hall Law School and is published internationally in law and criminology journals. He also teaches incident command at the Canadian Police College. 

Timestamps

1:00 - His personal history and career path

2:25 – Structure and functioning of the RCMP

5:45 – Advantages and disadvantages of the Canadian policing model

7:30 – Origins of RCMP SERT and ERT teams

13:00 – The role of modern tactical teams

14:30 – 2010 Olympics and ERTs transition to full-time teams

17:15 – Current ERT team configuration

21:00 – Decision-making and the trap of risk mitigation

27:00 – Understanding the difference between cheap and expensive and effective and efficient in preparation

33:15 – Weighing when to spend money vs. improving skills – understanding requirements

38:00 – Tactical decision-making & analysis paralysis

42:00 – Militarization of law enforcement

45:45 – How overly aggressive law and policy can lead to tactical indecisiveness

50:15 – How the standards we hold police to are unreasonable

55:00 – How the origin stories for SWAT are complicating modern tactical response

57:00 – Delegation of authority and decision making

1:01:00 – Who should make tactical decisions?

1:03:00 – How we should be training our future tactical leaders 

1:09:45 – Rapid fire questions

Contact Info: 

Kevin Cyr - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevin-cyr-ll-m-b78206133 

Books Recommended:  

Extreme Ownership - Jocko Willink and Leif Babin – ISBN# 250067057

Description

My guest today Is Buddy Brown. Buddy works for the York County Sherriff’s Office in South Carolina. Buddy has worked patrol, narcotics and training and spent more than 18 years on the York County regional SWAT team. On January 16, 2018, York County responded to a domestic violence call that led a suspect on the run in the woods behind a residential area. By the time the night was over Det. Mike Doty would be murdered by the suspect and three other members of the agency would be shot and seriously wounded, including Buddy. In this Critical Incident Review Buddy will take us through the timeline and events of the night as well as discuss their lessons learned and his recovery from catastrophic injuries.

Timestamps

2:20 - His history and career path

3:20  – Configuration of York County Sheriff’s Office Agency and the SWAT team

5:10 – Initial call for service and search for suspect

9:00 – Ambush of dog team and Shooting of K9 Sgt. Randy Clinton

15:40 – Initial SWAT response and search

24:15 – Response to 1475 Paraham Road

30:45 – Ambush of team by suspects and shooting of three team members

35:20 – Shooting stops and suspect surrenders

39:10 – Initial medical response for injured operators

45:40 – Buddy’s Injuries

47:30 – Arrest of suspect

56:30 – Initial effects on the families

58:50 – Arrival at the hospital & treatment

1:03:00 – Buddy’s recovery

1:05:45 – Personal lessons learned

1:08:00 – Team lessons learned

1:18:50 – Aftermath and healing from the trauma of the event

Important Links

York County SO Documentary – The Many Heroes: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLK7N8kvFjVfs8fzsyDgmTg6ZtbN2UpXPG 

Contact Info: 

Phone 803-230-2106

Email [email protected]

Book Recommendations: 

Dave Grossman - On Killing – ISBN 978-0316040938

Dave Grossman - On Combat – ISBN 978-0964920545

Paul Howe - Leadership and Training for the Fight – ISBN 978-1420889505

Jocko Willink - Discipline Equals Freedom – ISBN 978-1250156945

Description

My guest today is Kris Allshouse.  Kris is the Executive Director of The Regional Training Center (formerly LA County Regional Training Center), a nonprofit organization that provides advanced training to Federal, State and Local Law Enforcement and other first responders as well as military units and international agencies.  Kris is a former tactical operator for a large Southern California agency with extensive operational experience.  Under his guidance, RTC/LACRTC has emerged as one of the top thought leaders and training providers for tactical use of Small Unmanned Aircraft Systems (sUAS) in the world.

Timestamps

1:00 - His Career Path

2:50 – The Evolution of sUAS for law enforcement

4:30 – Categories and types of sUAS and their missions

7:25 – Tactical Use of sUAS & Deescalation

11:15 – Crowd and Riot Control 

13:00 – Drones and Robots and the new non-dynamic entry approach

16:34 – Regulatory challenges to sUAS

22:00 – Privacy rights, the Constitution and sUAS

26:15 – The 4th Amendment Consequences of sUAS

27:03 – Weaponizing drones

29:30 – The terrorism threat posed by sUAS

32:30 –Concerns that we are building a dystopian future with sUAS

Books Recommended

Sound Doctrine – Charles Sid Heal – ISBN 9781930051119

Seven Habits of Highly Effective People - Stephen Covey - 9780671708634

Contact Info

Kris Allshouse

[email protected]

17595 Mt Herrmann St.

Fountain Valley, CA 92708

Main Office: (888) 782-4969

Direct: (760) 990-1441

Cell: (816) 721-8440