The Special Lists

Andrew Skasko spent a full year working shoulder-to-shoulder with his associate on every procedure, paying him the whole time, before they opened a second location together. That associate is now his partner across multiple practices, with three to four more sites in the pipeline.

Skasko is a restorative dentist in New Albany, Ohio, a clinical assistant professor at Ohio State, and a two-decade Seattle Study Club member who's competed on the mainstage at the annual symposium. He joins Cameron, Souyias, and Seda to lay out how he built a restorative-only practice in a profession that pushes every clinician to do everything.

The throughline is what Skasko calls the "super dentist trap": clinicians who haven't mastered the basics taking on endo, ortho, and implants because the procedures are sexy and the margins are good. He explains how he built his brand on the opposite premise — stay out of network with insurance, refuse procedures he can't master, and earn the referral network's trust by handing teed-up cases back to the specialists instead of trying to keep them in-house.

Mentorship runs through every part of the story. Skasko names the dentists who shaped him (Michael Cohen, Tal Moore, Greg Kinzer, Pat Allen, Ward Smalley) and explains how Seattle Study Club, the American Academy of Esthetic Dentistry, the American Academy of Restorative Dentistry, and Pat Allen's IIDC each pushed him to a different level. He's also direct about what he thinks is broken: academies and corporate models that mentor for bonuses and daily numbers instead of for the patient and the profession.

The practice-development thread is where the model gets concrete. Skasko walks through how he turned Dr. Nick Molnar (left-handed, like him) into a clinical partner over a year of supervised reps, then bought into Molnar's father's oral surgery practice and partnered with Dr. Lee, his former assistant turned oral surgeon. The group is now eyeing three to four more sites built on the same template.

Plus the closing story about a high-school classmate who thought he was a jerk in math class, then 30 years later came in to have him restore her smile.

Guest

Dr. Andrew Skasko is the founder of Elite Dental and Skasko Smile Design Studio in New Albany, Ohio. He earned his DDS from The Ohio State University College of Dentistry in 2004, opened his comprehensive interdisciplinary practice the following year, and currently serves as a clinical assistant professor in the restorative and prosthodontics division at Ohio State. He is a member of the American Academy of Esthetic Dentistry, the American Academy of Restorative Dentistry, and the American Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry, and has been a member of Seattle Study Club for over 20 years. In January 2023, he was named team lead for Team North America in a treatment planning square-off against Spain at the Seattle Study Club Symposium. Through his mentorship work, he co-founded Molnar and Skasko Family and Cosmetic Dentistry to bring advanced interdisciplinary care to underserved communities.

Learn more about Elite Dental and Skasko Smile Design Studio: newalbanyelitedental.com.

Follow Andrew on Instagram @drandrewskasko

Questions answered by this episode:
1. How do I build a restorative-only dental practice without taking on endo, ortho, and implants?
2. Why should a dental practice stay out of network with insurance?
3. How do I turn an associate dentist into a partner?
4. What is the role of the restorative dentist in interdisciplinary treatment planning?
5. How do I find the right mentors as a dentist?
6. What is Seattle Study Club and is it worth joining?
7. How do I get into the American Academy of Esthetic Dentistry or the American Academy of Restorative Dentistry?
8. Should a general dentist place implants or refer them out?
9. How do I quarterback a complex restorative case across multiple specialists?
10. How do I build a multi-practice dental group through mentorship?

About The Special Lists

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists. Running a dental practice isn't easy, and if you're in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you're on an island. That's why finding your people—those who've been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It's about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com (with two L's)

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io

Hosts

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area. Dr. Seda's education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master's degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producer: Mary Ellen Clarkson
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis.

AACD taught Dr. Tracey Nguyen to be good with her hands. The mouth–body connection taught her how to keep that work intact for years.

Tracey is a restorative dentist, scientific advisor at the Kois Center, AACD Accredited Member, and co-founder of ASAP Pathway — the first comprehensive online education platform for pediatric airway and sleep dentistry. She joins Cameron, Dr. Seda, and Dr. Souyias to talk about why a beautiful smile won't hold up if you aren't also looking at how the person breathes — and what it takes to shift a profession that's been told for decades that "if you want to be a doctor, go to med school."

Tracey shares how she reads ENT and pulmonology journals to inform her restorative work, why she calls the airway conversation "a movement" even though her sleep-physician colleagues think it should be obvious, and what the cosmetic-to-airway pipeline looks like in real practice — from skeletal expansion in adults to airway-driven smile design.

AI as a clinical tool gets its own thread: Cameron's Google Scholar Alerts trick for tracking new published research, Dr. Seda using ChatGPT to prep for an orthopedic surgery consult, the patient who used ChatGPT to take a dentist to the board over a denied scaling and root planing claim, and the parent who showed up with an AI-drafted medical-necessity letter Tracey said was so good she'd be using it as a template.

Plus the ASAP Pathway origin story: launching in January 2020 with no product, selling 70 seats at $8,000 each, and scrambling to record forty hours of curriculum during lockdown. And LEAD — a women's mastermind in dentistry — and why "men battle to bond, women bond before they battle."

Guest

Dr. Tracey Nguyen runs a private restorative practice in Lansdowne, Virginia, 30 minutes outside Washington, DC. She is an Accredited Member of the American Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry — one of only five accredited dentists in the state — a Fellow of the Academy of General Dentistry, and a Diplomate of the American Board of Dental Sleep Medicine. In 2016, Dental Products Magazine named her one of the Top 25 Women in Dentistry, the same year she completed her training at the Kois Center, where she now serves as Scientific Advisor. She co-founded ASAP Pathway in 2020 — the first comprehensive online education platform for pediatric airway and sleep dentistry — and serves as visiting faculty at Spear Education, mentoring the Airway Workshop alongside Dr. Jeff Rouse.

Learn more about ASAP Pathway: asappathway.com.

Follow Tracey on Instagram @drtraceynguyen

Set up Google Scholar Alerts at scholar.google.com 

Questions answered by this episode:
1. Why doesn't cosmetic dentistry last as long as it should?
2. What is airway dentistry and why does it matter for restorative cases?
3. How is sleep apnea connected to dental wear and bruxism?
4. How can a dentist start reading medical literature outside of dentistry?
5. What is ASAP Pathway and who is it for?
6. Can AI help me with patient education and case research?
7. Should I be using ChatGPT or Open Evidence for clinical literature review?
8. What is skeletal expansion in adults and when is it indicated?
9. How do I collaborate with sleep physicians and ENTs as a dentist?
10. How do dentists start a continuing education company?

About The Special Lists

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists. Running a dental practice isn't easy, and if you're in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you're on an island. That's why finding your people—those who've been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It's about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com (with two L's)
Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io

Hosts

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area. Dr. Seda's education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master's degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producer: Mary Ellen Clarkson
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis.

Running a dental practice isn't taught in dental school, and most owners learn it the hard way. Practice coach and former periodontal practice co-owner Geri Gottlieb joins the show to share what 30+ years in dentistry — and a humbling jump into ownership herself — taught her about what actually makes a practice work.

Geri unpacks why dentistry is a team sport, why culture is anything but soft, and why a culture is whatever you tolerate, not what you write on the wall. She breaks down the character traits of an ideal team player (humble, hungry, emotionally intelligent), why 85% of poor performance is the system and not the human, and why systems aren't restriction — they're the bumpers that free your team to be present with patients.

Geri also shares the moment her own team told her she was holding them down, and what it took to finally build the team she'd been preaching about all along.

GUEST

Geri Gottlieb

Founder & Lead Coach, GG Practice Coaching & Development

Geri Gottlieb has spent more than three decades in the dental industry as a practice manager, co-owner of two large periodontal practices alongside her husband, and now founder and lead coach of GG Practice Coaching & Development.

She helps dentists and specialists across the country build stronger teams, healthier cultures, and more sustainable businesses. Geri is certified in the Five Behaviors of a Team and DiSC Behavioral Assessments, and previously spent four years as a lead coach with ACT Dental Practice Management. Her philosophy: build a team so strong you don't know who the boss is.

Learn more about GG Practice Coaching & Development

Connect with Geri on LinkedIn

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists. Running a dental practice isn't easy, and if you're in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you're on an island. That's why finding your people—those who've been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It's about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io

Cameron Full

Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS

Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS

Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area. Dr. Seda's interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction.

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master's degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producer: Mary Ellen Clarkson
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io

Beyond clinical skill, running a successful dental practice requires clear vision, strong systems, and the right people.

Periodontist and MAZ Management co-founder Dr. Justin Zalewsky shares the leadership principles that guide his approach, including organizing life into three buckets — work, thinking, and personal time — and using tools like impact filters to keep projects and teams aligned. 

He explains how core values and structure shape hiring, promotions, and day-to-day decision-making.

Justin also addresses the challenges of hiring associates, emphasizing mentorship, clear expectations, and structured onboarding. 

GUEST

Justin Zalewsky, DMD
President & Co-founder, MAZ Management

Justin is a board-certified periodontist who has practiced in the Washington, D.C. metro area for more than 15 years. Seven years ago, he co-founded MAZ and began expanding through strategic acquisitions, building a network that now includes three periodontal practices and four general dental offices. Today he leads an organization of more than 80 team members and 15 doctors, supported by a centralized management team that allows him to remain an active clinician while guiding the company’s growth. His leadership focuses on developing strong teams, placing people in roles where they can thrive, and building practices that deliver exceptional patient care.

Learn more about MAZ Management

Learn more about Alexandria periodontist Dr. Justin Zalewsky

Connect with Justin on LinkedIn

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists.

Running a dental practice isn’t easy, and if you’re in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you’re on an island. That’s why finding your people—those who’ve been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It’s about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com 

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io 

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area.

Dr. Seda’s interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. 

He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction. 

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master’s degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producers: Mary Ellen Clarkson & Hannah Burkhart
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io

What does it really take to build a dental practice that’s future-proof and not just profitable?

Through relentless investment in safety, leadership, and education, oral and maxillofacial surgeon Dr. David Lee Hill shaped Chapel Hill Oral Surgery into what it is today. 

From rebuilding his entire facility to meet AAAHC standards, to adopting a dual-provider anesthesia model, to embracing dynamic navigation technology, doing things the hard way early paid off later.

Hear why delayed gratification beats shortcuts, how mentorship and continuing education shaped his career, and why having the right leadership team matters more than any single piece of technology. 

Listen for his takes on anesthesia models, surgical planning, culture, and why perseverance—not perfection—is often the real differentiator between practices that stall and those that thrive.

GUEST

David Lee Hill, JR., DDS
CEO, OMS Chapel Hill Oral Surgery

Dr. Hill is a Diplomate of the American Board of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery, a member of the American Association of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgeons, the International Congress of Oral Implantologists, the Academy of Osseointegration, the International Team for Implantology, North Carolina State Association of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgeons, North Carolina State Dental Association, the American Dental Association, and the American Association of Dental Research.
Dr. Hill is an active sportsman, a deep sea fisherman, a cyclist, and an enthusiastic UNC Tar Heel fan. He enjoys spending time with his family, his wife, Olivia, and his son Rémy Oliver (5y/o) and daughter Violette (1.5y/o).

Learn more about Chapel Hill Oral Surgery

Follow Dr. Hill’s practice on Instagram @chapelhilloralsurgery

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists.
Running a dental practice isn’t easy, and if you’re in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you’re on an island. That’s why finding your people—those who’ve been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It’s about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com 

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io 

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area.

Dr. Seda’s interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. 

He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction. 

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master’s degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producers: Mary Ellen Clarkson & Hannah Burkhart
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io

Dentistry looks polished from the outside, but behind the scenes, it’s harder, messier, and more human than most people realize.

Dental industry veteran Mike Gergen believes the key to success is lifelong education, culture that holds up under pressure, and leaders willing to admit that dentistry is both a clinical craft and a business. 

Hear why “just go to the course” might be the best advice dentists get, how friction in patient experience is costing practices more than they think, and why refusing to evolve risks turning dentistry into a commodity. 

Get candid insights on DSOs, leadership fatigue, patient engagement, and what it really takes to build a practice people want to be part of on both sides of the chair.

GUEST

Mike Gergen
CEO of EviDent Alliance

Mike Gergen is a seasoned dental industry executive and growth strategist known for driving transformation, culture, profitability, and strategic exits. Throughout his career, he has had the opportunity to know and work with some of the best dentists in the country.

Connect with Mike Gergen on LinkedIn

Learn more about EviDent Alliance

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists.

Running a dental practice isn’t easy, and if you’re in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you’re on an island. That’s why finding your people—those who’ve been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It’s about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com 

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io 

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area.

Dr. Seda’s interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. 

He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction. 

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master’s degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producers: Mary Ellen Clarkson & Hannah Burkhart
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io

Want to know how one periodontist turned patient-centered care into a thriving, multi-practice powerhouse?

Dr. Amit Patel is the founder of ROOT Periodontal and Implant Centers and co-founder of the Center for Oral Pathology, one of the country’s busiest oral medicine practices. Frustrated by slow biopsy results and limited patient access, he and his partner now see 150 new patients a month for oral pathology, TMD, and facial pain.

At ROOT, Dr. Patel flipped Dallas’ implant-heavy market with his “We Save Teeth” campaign, promoting LANAP laser surgery as a more affordable alternative. He ditched expensive ads and boosted results through hundreds of referral lunch-and-learns each year.

He also shares how AI, Perioscope tech, and smart KPIs streamline care, improve patient intake, and catch hidden revenue leaks that cost practices big. He explains how to leverage customized questionnaires to reveal what patients really want.

Hear how Dr. Patel maximizes efficiency, grows revenue, and keeps both patients and doctors happy. Learn how to spot hidden opportunities, improve care, and build a practice that thrives.

GUEST

Amit Patel, DDS
Owner of ROOT Periodontal and Implant Centers, Owner of ROOT Med Spa, and Co-Founder and Managing Partner at Center for Oral Pathology

Dr. Amit Patel was born and raised in the suburbs of Detroit, Michigan, and moved to Dallas in 2010. He went to undergrad and dental school at the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor and did his perio residency at Indiana University in Indianapolis. He is the director of the Seattle Study Club of Dallas and a Coach for the DEO (Dentist Entrepreneur Organization).

Learn more about ROOT Periodontal and Implant Centers

Learn more about ROOT Med Spa

Connect with Amit Patel on LinkedIn

Follow ROOT Perio on Instagram @rootperio

Follow ROOT Med Spa on Instagram @rootmedspa

Learn more about Center for Oral Pathology

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists.

Running a dental practice isn’t easy, and if you’re in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you’re on an island. That’s why finding your people—those who’ve been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It’s about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com 

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io 

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area.

Dr. Seda’s interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. 

He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction. 

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master’s degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producers: Mary Ellen Clarkson & Hannah Burkhart
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io

From Army infantry to dental empire, Dr. Jeffrey Burch explains his formula for building a team that actually sticks.

He’s a periodontist, former Army infantry soldier, and the CEO of Burch Dental Partners, overseeing 15 practices and 23 dentists. His “Team Never Sell” model focuses on long-term partnerships instead of flipping practices, with retention rates far above industry averages.

Culture is the engine behind it all. Dr. Burch built his group on four core values—commitment to excellence, humble and hungry to grow, effective communication, and winning attitude—which guide every decision from hiring to leadership development to knowing when to part ways. 

He lays out a clear path to partnership, built on careful recruiting, hands-on onboarding, mentorship, and ongoing business and clinical training. Hear how investing early helps associates grow into confident, aligned owners.

Find out how to spot the right partners, create offers doctors actually want, and build a team that’s in it for the long haul.

GUEST

Jeffrey Burch, DMD
CEO, CFO, and CIO of Burch Dental Partners and Managing Partner of Featherstone Periodontics & Implant Dentistry

Jeff is a board certified periodontist with over 20 years of experience in innovative modern dental surgery such as LANAP, Pinhole therapy, advanced bone grafting, and dental implant therapy to replace one or all teeth.

Dr. Burch is a happily married man. His wife is a GP Dentist and they have 2 boys together ages 9 and 16. He is a former infantry soldier in the US Army with service in combat zones overseas. He is an entrepreneur at his core with a special focus on businesses that serve people. His business has a buy and hold strategy and is on “Team Never Sell.”

Learn more about Burch Dental Partners

Connect with Dr. Burch on LinkedIn

Got a question for Dr. Burch? Email him at [email protected]

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists.

Running a dental practice isn’t easy, and if you’re in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you’re on an island. That’s why finding your people—those who’ve been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It’s about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com 

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io 

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area.

Dr. Seda’s interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. 

He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction. 

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master’s degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producers: Mary Ellen Clarkson & Hannah Burkhart
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io

North Carolina periodontist Dr. Deana Cook believes the real engine of a dental practice isn't the dentist, but the team running it.

Dr. Cook has two thriving practices and an executive MBA from UNC. With a background in art history, she blends creativity with science and a people-first approach to running her team. 

In her practices, Dr. Cook leans into transparency, daily KPIs, and fun incentives like team lunches and pooled bonuses to motivate staff. She shares clever systems to keep the office efficient while building ownership and accountability among her 12-person team.

She also challenges the myth of work-life balance, viewing it instead as a pendulum that swings with priorities. Hear how she gamifies goals, fosters leadership across roles, and takes incremental steps to improve systems without overwhelming the team.

Find out how Dr. Cook builds a culture where every team member feels responsible, patients are happier, and growth happens naturally. 

GUEST

Deana Cook, DDS, MS, MBA
Owner & Periodontist at Cook Periodontics & Dental Implants

Dr. Cook attended the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill for her undergraduate education in Art History. After studying abroad in Italy, she began to appreciate the wonderful mix of art and science dentistry provided and went on to graduate from UNC School of Dentistry with honors (2009). She graduated with her Master’s degree in Biomedical Science and a Certificate in Periodontics from the University of Texas Health Science Center in San Antonio (2012). Additionally, she graduated with honors from the Executive MBA Program at UNC Kenan-Flagler Business School (2023). Dr. Cook is the owner of two periodontal practices in Southeastern NC (Wilmington, Leland) and is the director of a Spear Study Club.
 She’s a proud wife and mom to two girls (Emery & Sutton).

Learn more about Cook Periodontics & Dental Implants

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists.
Running a dental practice isn’t easy, and if you’re in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you’re on an island. That’s why finding your people—those who’ve been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It’s about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com 

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io 

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area.

Dr. Seda’s interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. 

He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction. 

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master’s degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producers: Mary Ellen Clarkson & Hannah Burkhart
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io

For Dr. Lee Cochrane, clarity came through doing: learning on the fly, adjusting quickly, and letting the early chaos shape better systems. He talks about what it really takes to build a periodontal practice from the ground up, and why you often have to start before you feel “ready.”

A big part of his story is culture. Lee is honest about how much a practice depends on the people inside it. He describes the power of a team that feels safe, supported, and respected—both in their internal interactions and in how they show up for patients. 

Standard operating procedures, consistent communication, and clear roles create room for better patient care. When excellence is repeatable, Lee says the entire practice feels lighter and more focused.

Mentorship shaped his career, and now leadership shapes his daily life. At the end of the day, Lee sees the team as the most valuable asset he has, and building an environment where they can thrive is the real marker of a successful practice. He explains how team empowerment, positivity, and trust ripple outward into every patient experience. 

GUEST

Leonard Cochrane, DMD
Periodontist + Owner of Coastal Periodontics

Lee Cochrane is a periodontist and the founder of Coastal Periodontics in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina. A native of Greenville, Lee graduated from Clemson University with a degree in Bioengineering before completing both dental school and a periodontics residency at The Medical University of South Carolina in Charleston, South Carolina. After launching his practice from scratch in 2022, Lee has grown it into one of the area’s most trusted specialty practices through a relentless focus on team culture, operational excellence, and patient experience.

Learn more about Myrtle Beach periodontist Dr. Leonard Cochrane

Follow Coastal Periodontics on Instagram @coastal.periodontics

The Special Lists, presented by Referral Lab, is the podcast for dentists and dental specialists.
Running a dental practice isn’t easy, and if you’re in private practice, it can sometimes feel like you’re on an island. That’s why finding your people—those who’ve been in your shoes and can share real, lived experience—changes the game.

Referral Lab was built specifically for dental specialists, helping you track, manage, and convert every referral. It’s about improving case acceptance, boosting team performance, and strengthening relationships with referring providers so your whole practice runs smarter.

This spirit of connection fuels The Special Lists podcast. Hosted by the team behind Referral Lab, we bring you wisdom from practice owners and dental professionals, sharing the wins, mistakes, and lessons that shape how they run their businesses today.

Got a question for us? Send us a message at speciallists.com 

Transform your referral workflow with Referral Lab, the purpose-built platform for dental specialists to track, manage and convert every referral. Request a demo at referrallab.io 

Cameron Full
Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Cameron Full, co-founder of Referral Lab, is a strategic problem-solver with expertise in business management and digital solutions. He combines leadership, creativity, and technology to drive success across various industries.

Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn

Jason Souyias, DDS
Periodontist and Co-Founder of Referral Lab

Dr. Jason Souyias is a periodontist, educator, and co-founder of Referral Lab software. He teaches dentists and hygienists, including as a Pikos Institute faculty member. In his Port Huron private practice, he's known for excellent patient communication and experience. He's passionate about his work and dedicated to helping other dentists.

More about Port Huron, Michigan periodontist Dr. Jason Souyias

Michael Seda, DMD, MS
Periodontist and Co-Developer of Referral Lab

A clinician and entrepreneur, Dr. Seda brings 19 years of private practice experience to his periodontal and implant surgery practice in the San Francisco Bay Area.

Dr. Seda’s interests are rooted in evaluating and influencing private practice management systems in dentistry. He wants to increase practice efficiency, establish a greater sense of collaboration and trust among practice team members, and enhance quality of care and service delivered—all while maximizing and growing profitability.

Through associateship opportunities early in his career, Dr. Seda was exposed to various private practice leadership and business models. He witnessed first-hand inconsistencies in the degree of success and failure owners experienced in private practices. This ignited his passion for learning what empowers practices to thrive and grow successfully while delivering a highly satisfying patient experience. 

He is particularly interested in using cutting-edge analytics platforms to measure advanced practice metrics. He leverages these to design data-driven strategies to enhance referral patterns, scheduling systems, case acceptance rates, and other key performance indicators that lead to practice growth and patient satisfaction. 

His education spans several disciplines, including a degree in Psychobiology from the University of California, Los Angeles, a Doctorate degree from Harvard University (DMD), and a Master’s degree in Periodontics and Oral Medicine from Columbia University.

More about Bay Area periodontist Dr. Michael Seda

Follow Dr. Seda on Instagram @sedaperio

Co-hosts: Cameron Full, Jason Souyias, DDS & Michael Seda, DDS
Producer: Eva Sheie @ The Axis
Assistant Producers: Mary Ellen Clarkson & Hannah Burkhart
Engineering: Cameron Laird
Theme music: Papa Funk, spring gang
Cover Art: Dan Childs

The Special Lists is a production of The Axis: theaxis.io