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0:28 Mark’s newsletter, podcast, and Bloggingheads roots 3:45 Is Trump really anti-internationalist? 8:30 Who was the most pro-UN post-Cold-War president? 13:25 Is global governance doomed? 17:16 Scoring the UN’s post-Cold War track record 24:08 ICC and ICJ 101 33:17 Why the WHO matters 39:48 Heading to Overtime

Robert Wright (Nonzero, The Evolution of God, Why Buddhism Is True) and Mark Leon Goldberg (Global Dispatches, To Save Us From Hell). Recorded January 30, 2025.

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