Today we have a fascinating deep dive on Chinese intelligence structure, tactics, capabilities, and threats with long-time China expert Nicholas Eftimiades. Nick spent 34 years in the US government with DIA, CIA, State, DHS and more with an intense focus on China and high tech space programs.

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In the 90's, Nick wrote the book Chinese Intelligence Operations, which is an examination of the structure, operations, and methodology of the Chinese intelligence services and widely regarded as the seminal work in the field. To give you an idea of how impactful this work was, Nick was immediately labeled by the Chinese government as an 'enemy of the state,' 100+ Chinese intel assets were recalled to China, and he was asked to appear before Congress and personally brief political leaders on both sides of the aisle.

Nick served overseas in Vienna, Frankfurt, Moscow, London, and Tokyo after studying in China and Taiwan in college where he picked up the language. His long career in DIA includes senior assignments as the Chief of Counterterrorism Operations, Transnational Issues Division, Futures Division, and Space Division. He has been awarded the National Intelligence Council Achievement Award and DIA Director's Intelligence Award - that agency's highest recognition of achievement. He is also a nonresident Senior Fellow at the Forward Defense practice of the Atlantic Council's Scowcroft Center for Strategy and Security.

He is a professor at Penn State and a frequent lecturer and public speaker on future technology, space, and national security issues. His company Shinobi Enterprises offers confidential consulting and training with specific and in-depth expertise on China's domestic environment, national security, and commercial espionage operations and tactics.

With that, please enjoy this deep dive on all things Chinese intelligence and threat-related from an expert in the field.

🎙️ Find Nick Online:

1. Professor Site:

   • Visit Nick's faculty page at Penn State for more information about his academic work.
   • Penn State Faculty Page

2. Shinobi Enterprises:

   • Explore Nick's consulting company for confidential consulting and training on China's national security and espionage operations.
   • Shinobi Enterprises

3. Books by Nicholas Eftimiades:

   • Chinese Espionage Operations and Tactics: Dive into Nick's detailed analysis of Chinese espionage.
     • Chinese Espionage Operations and Tactics on Amazon
   • Chinese Intelligence Operations: Discover the seminal work that examines the structure, operations, and methodology of Chinese intelligence services.
     • Chinese Intelligence Operations on Amazon

🌟 Stay informed and connected with Nick's expertise on Chinese intelligence and global security!

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⏰ Show Notes:

• 00:00 Intro
• 01:04 Guest Introduction: Nicholas Eftimiades
• 03:05 Nick's Career Journey
• 05:14 Language Skills and Early Career
• 14:13 Writing the Seminal Book on Chinese Intelligence
• 20:04 Challenges and Investigations
• 25:39 Understanding Chinese Espionage Motivations
• 42:40 Google Engineer's Espionage Case
• 44:22 Nick's Childhood and Early Influences
• 45:42 Overview of Chinese Intelligence Organizations
• 47:59 Internal Politics and Purges in China
• 49:28 China's Global Influence and Espionage Tactics
• 01:04:19 The Threat of TikTok and AI
• 01:13:43 Nick's Career Reflections and Advice
• 01:24:38 Conclusion and Listener Comments