Scot McKnight and Laura Barringer have a conversation with Amy Fritz about their book, A Church Called Tov: Forming a Goodness Culture That Resists Abuses of Power and Promotes Healing. Scot, Laura, and Amy talk about why pastors don't always publicly speak up when they see victims tell their story, where the term "wounded resisters" came from, the cost of speaking up, and the advice Scot gives to those who plan to go into ministry. Links mentioned: A Church Called Tov Chicago Tribune Sarah Pulliam Bailey Washington Post Christianity Today Bob Smietana Scot McKnight Blog Narcissism in the Church by Chuck DeGroat A Church Divided: German Protestants Confront the Past Support the show (https://buymeacoffee.com/untangledfaith)