In this episode, Pastor Joel Wayne and Pastor Luke Bilberry sit down with Pastor Mike Joslyn for a candid, practical conversation on the mistakes young leaders make—and the deeper identity issues that often sit beneath them.

Together, they unpack why so many new (and seasoned) leaders feel pressure to prove themselves, why listening is more Christlike than leading with statements, and how the search for validation can quietly pull your heart away from God and toward the approval of people. From avoiding conflict to measuring the wrong things to carrying burdens we were meant to share, this episode shines a light on the subtle traps that shape unhealthy leadership.

Ultimately, the conversation keeps circling back to a single, critical theme: Spiritual leadership is not about outcomes, optics, or speed—it’s about obedience, impact, and becoming someone worth emulating.

Whether you’re stepping into leadership for the first time, serving in your church, leading in the workplace, or simply wanting to grow as a follower of Jesus, this episode will challenge you to slow down, ask better questions, listen well, and aim your life at the right target.

What you’ll learn:

• Why young leaders often rush to speak—and how to build the discipline of listening first
• How seeking validation leads to insecurity, comparison, and unhealthy leadership patterns
• The difference between impact and influence (and why only one creates lasting change)
• How to step into conflict with truth and grace instead of fear or avoidance
• Why measuring the wrong things leads to burnout—and how to evaluate success through Scripture
• Practical ways to equip others instead of carrying the weight of ministry alone
• Why spiritual leaders must know what they stand for, not just what they stand against
• How to find mentors worth emulating and ask for the wisdom you actually need
• Why evaluating your “target” matters—and how drifting from it can derail your life and calling

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Pastors Larry Mayberry and Michael Rubino for a raw, honest conversation about identity, comparison, and what it really means to lead like Jesus in a culture obsessed with results.

Together, they unpack the subtle ways pastors and spiritual leaders can start tying their worth to church size, platform, or performance—and how that robs us of joy, distorts our calling, and quietly erodes our souls. From confession and repentance to the simple practice of being present in your neighborhood, this conversation keeps coming back to one core question: Is your success defined by outcomes or by obedience?

Whether you’re a pastor, planter, elder, small group leader, or just stepping into spiritual leadership for the first time, this episode will challenge you to lay down comparison, step into vulnerability, and root your identity fully in Christ.

What you’ll learn:
- Why comparison quietly destroys spiritual leaders—and how to recognize it in your own heart
- How to root your identity in Christ instead of church size, platform, or performance
- Why confession, repentance, and vulnerability are non-negotiables for healthy leadership
- Practical ways to get out of your study and into the streets with non-believers
- How to redefine “success” in ministry around obedience to Jesus, not visible results

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In this episode of Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Joel Wayne sits down with Dr. Thomas White, President of Cedarville University, for a powerful conversation on leadership, calling, and the future of ministry in a changing world.

Dr. White unpacks why 85% of seminary graduates leave ministry within five years, the growing impact of AI on critical thinking and leadership, and how the next generation can stay grounded in biblical truth while leading with courage. Together, Joel and Dr. White explore what it means to lead with humility, resilience, and faithfulness in a culture that often rewards comparison and compromise.

Whether you’re a pastor, student, or leader navigating today’s challenges, this episode will inspire you to stand firm on the Word of God, lead with conviction, and serve with courage.

What you’ll learn:

• Why so many ministry leaders are burning out—and how to stay the course
• How to lead with humility and resilience in a critical culture
• What AI means for the future of education, ministry, and leadership
• Why your identity in Christ must anchor your calling
• How to raise up the next generation of spiritual leaders

Connect with Dr. White
https://www.facebook.com/DrThomasWhite
https://www.instagram.com/drthomaswhite/
https://x.com/DrThomasWhite
https://www.linkedin.com/in/jthomaswhite/

Learn More about Cedarville University: https://yellowjackets.cedarville.edu/

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Pastor Joel Wayne for a conversation on what it actually looks like to live as a disciplined spiritual leader.

Together, they unpack the difference between “I have to” and “I get to” when it comes to time in God’s Word, prayer, relationships, and even caring for your body. They talk about developing a biblical worldview that informs every part of life, why relationships aren’t optional for believers, and how a leader’s willingness to absorb hardship for the sake of the bride of Christ reveals their understanding of Jesus.

What you’ll learn:
- Why spiritual disciplines are about posture, not legalism (“I get to” vs. “I have to”)
- How a biblical worldview touches five key areas of life: faith, relationships, finances, habits, and work/school
- Why relationships are a biblical responsibility, not a personal preference
- How to build rhythms that keep you rooted in Scripture and prayer

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In this episode of Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Nathan Potter to unpack what it means to follow God with open hands. Nathan shares his family’s journey of obedience to the Philippines — selling their home and uprooting their lives as God calls them to global ministry.

Luke and Nathan explore how true surrender reshapes our definition of calling and home. Their conversation reveals that obedience isn’t about comfort, but about trusting God when the next step isn’t clear and discovering His faithfulness in the unknown.

Whether you’re wrestling with a big decision, leading your family through transition, or longing to live with greater purpose, this episode will challenge and encourage you to trust God completely.

What you’ll learn:
- What it really means to live with open hands before God
- How obedience often leads through discomfort before growth
- Why missions is more than a trip — it’s a way of life
- How to find contentment when God calls you into the in-between

Connect With Nathan
Email: [email protected]
Website: https://btcphilippines.org/

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In this episode of Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Pastor Joel Wayne and Pastor Michael Rubino to unpack what it truly means to be a spiritual leader. Together, they challenge the modern view of leadership, contrasting cultural models with the biblical call to servant leadership.

Through honest reflection, practical examples, and even moments of vulnerability, they explore how Jesus’ model of discipleship transforms our understanding of influence, calling, and equipping others. Whether you lead in your church, home, or workplace, this conversation will inspire you to lead with humility, clarity, and a heart surrendered to Christ’s mission.

What you’ll learn:

• The difference between spiritual leadership and worldly leadership
• Why servant leadership is rooted in Scripture
• How failure shapes effective leaders
• How Jesus modeled spiritual leadership with His disciples

Join Our Email List -> https://bethechurch.org/podcast/
Download the PDF -> https://bethechurch.org/what-is-spiritual-leadership-how-to-be-a-leader-worth-following

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The Be The Church Podcast is for spiritual leaders who want to be challenged to lead like Jesus in everyday places—at home, in your church, at school, and in the workplace. Hosted by Be The Church founder Joel Wayne and Chapel Pointe pastor Luke Bilberry, each episode features bold, authentic conversations with business and ministry leaders that are rooted in Scripture. You'll learn how to expand your spiritual influence and leverage your leadership to advance the Kingdom of God. Let's be the church together! For more information, visit bethechurch.org/podcast.

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