Sharifa Stevens, BOW Ministry Team Member

Kelley Mathews, BOW Ministry Team Member

Protestants in general often don't talk much about Mary, mother and disciple of Jesus. Kelley Mathews, however, provides us with lots to think about from her interesting insights into who she was and her life and witness.

What are the Seven Sorrows in her life? Kelly talks about them and what we can learn from Mary about being a disciple.

Don't miss this lively discussion about Mary, mother and disciple of Jesus.

This episode is also available on video.

Recommended resources

Women in the Story of Scripture podcast episode

Artwork mentioned:1) Michelangelo Buonarroti, The Pietà, 1498-1499, St. Peter’s Basilica, Vatican City. 2) Artist Unknown, Theotokos, Our Lady of Sorrows, created 6th-7th century.

Timestamps:

00:21 Introductions

01:35 Why Talk about Mary?

02:40 Mary of the Seven Sorrows

05:31 Simeon's Prophecy

07:43 The Pietà

09:38 Protestants and Mary

10:59 What can we learn from Mary as a disciple?

17:06 The through-line between Mary's Magnificat and Jesus' themes

20:18 Mary's humility

25:26 Mary behind the scenes

29:04 Art depicting Mary

32:58 Mary as an eyewitness

35:00 Resources

TranscriptSharifa >> Hello, everyone, and welcome to Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. I am your host, Sharifa Stevens, and today I have the pleasure of talking to Kelley Mathews. Kelley Mathews has ministered to the church through writing and editing for over 25 years, though it does not look like it! Kelley has co-authored eight books, including 40 Questions About Women in Ministry. She is a freelance writer and editor, a former women's ministry director and Bible study teacher.

She has been married to John, a school administrator, for 27 years. They are parents to four active, mostly grown children. Kelley earned her Master of Theology from Dallas Theological Seminary in the year 2000 and is currently pursuing a Doctor of Ministry in New Testament from Houston Theological Seminary. Welcome, Kelley.

Kelley >> Hello. Hello. It's kind of fun being on this end of the screen, right?

Sharifa >> I'm glad.

Kelley >> Right. Yeah. I'm usually one of the interviewers.

Sharifa >> But today I'm interviewing you because we are going to be talking about Mary, the mother of Jesus. Now we're talking about her perhaps in a different light than the audience might usually be used to her. We usually don't hear about Mary unless it's Christmas time. Right?

Kelley >> Right. Right. Seems a little weird to be talking about her now because it's nowhere near Christmas when we're recording. And you should be listening to this after the New Year for sure.

Sharifa >> Exactly. But when we only hear from Mary about Mary at Christmas time, there is so much depth and wisdom that we miss. She is a part of our cloud of witnesses, so to speak.

Kelley >> Yeah.

Sharifa >> Someone to glean wisdom from and to learn from and to take inspiration from. Well, you’re studying about Mary in part for your dissertation.

Kelley >> Yes.

Sharifa >> I want to get into it with you. One of the ways that Mary, the mother of Jesus, is identified in the larger church and traditionally in the Roman Catholic Church is as Mary of the Seven Sorrows. Is that correct?

Kelley >> Yes.

Sharifa >> What is. . .

Kelley >> Mary has a lot of titles.

Sharifa >> A lot of Titles.

Kelley >> That's yeah, that's definitely one thing I think Protestants don't understand or may not even be aware of is the fact that the larger church and we could say the Catholic Church with this started way before there was any division of church when we were all united in the Patristic Era and then through the Medieval Time and all that.

Mary was very much honored and she came by all these different names to emphasize different parts of her character and role within the church. Typically, as someone that would be an intercessor,

Dr. Jennifer McNutt, author of The Mary We Forgot

BOW Team Member, Sharifa Stevens

Who is the Mary that we forgot? Mary Magdalene. Although she was the first apostle or messenger of the Good News, Dr. Jennifer McNutt says that her story is often confused, scandalized, and undervalued by the church. Don't miss Dr. McNutt's lively conversation with Sharifa Stevens about her book, The Mary We Forgot.

In this podcast, Dr. McNutt helps us see Mary's prominence in the Gospels and how she serves as a model of discipleship for both men and women today instead of being the Mary we forgot.

This episode is also available on video.

Resources:

The Mary We Forgot: What the Apostle to the Apostles Teaches the Church Today

Jennifer Powell McNutt

McNuttshell Ministries

Timestamps:

00:21 Introducing Dr. Jennifer Powell McNutt

01:56 What compelled you write about Mary Magdalene?

06:42 What do we Protestants tend to forget about Mary Magdalene?

09:06 Who is she according to the biblical account?

19:48 A hermeneutic of surprise

23:38 Her story shows God's power.

27:41 Advice for women called to ministry but limited in opportunity

31:57 Who are the people whom we tend to overlook today?

35:05 Why read the book, The Mary We Forgot?

TranscriptSharifa >> Hi, and welcome to another episode of Beyond Ordinary Women. My name is Sharifa Stevens, and I have the distinct honor of welcoming Dr. McNutt to our program today. Let me tell you a little bit about this scholar Jennifer Powell McNutt is the Franklin S. Dyrness Chair of Biblical and Theological Studies and Professor of Theology and History of Christianity at Wheaton College.

She is an award-winning author, a fellow in the Royal Historical Society and an ordained teaching elder in the Presbyterian tradition. Dr. McNutt serves as a Parish Associate at her church and regularly speaks at universities, seminaries and churches across the country. She and her husband co-founded McNuttshell Ministries, which is fun to say, which serves as a bridge between the Academy and the church.

They live with their three children in Winfield, Illinois. Dr. McNutt is also the author of a book that we are talking about today, which is called The Mary We Forgot. Go out and get it. Dr. McNutt, it’s an honor to be with you today. Thank you for coming.

Dr. McNutt >> Thank you so much for having me. I'm delighted to meet you and to get connected with your ministry and the good work that you're doing.

Sharifa >> Thank you. Well, why don't we just dive right into it?

So what compelled you to write The Mary We Forgot? And how did that conviction sustain you through the research and writing and in the process through the years—working and children?

Dr. McNutt >> Yes, I think, it's been a long journey with Mary Magdalene. I talk a little bit about that journey in my book—about going to see Jesus Christ Superstar as a teenager and being super confused. And sort of wondering and I think, you know, because of the fact that in my church, we really did include the women of the Bible.

But with Mary Magdalene, it was so very muddled, very confused about who she was and what she means when she is this first witness at the empty tomb and before the risen Christ on that Easter Sunday.

You know, there's so many questions. I think as a woman who was drawn and called to ministry, I have been, you know, wanting to understand the Gospels and women in the Gospels and how they have contributed to Jesus's ministry. And also in the Pauline epistles as well. I think there are other women that I would go to before I would go to Mary Magdalene.

And a lot of that had to do with kind of the back story that, you know, traveled with her everywhere.

Then, you know, later as a scholar, I worked on the history of the Bible and history of the interpretation of the Bible. And I focused on the Reformation. And it was just so interesting to see how the reformers—both the male refor...

Julie Pierce

Kay Daigle

There is an art to giving and receiving feedback. Leaders benefit from feedback by growing as leaders themselves and helping those who work with them. Executive Coach Julie Pierce joins Kay Daigle to discuss how and why to give and receive feedback. Julie's suggestions are very practical and transferable to any situation.

If you have been blindsided by critical feedback (as most of us as leaders have at some point), Julie will help you deal with that and learn to embrace it.

Julie provides great practical suggestions to help you start giving and receiving feedback so that you reach your full potential as a leader.

If you prefer, this episode is available to watch on video.

Recommended resources

Julie's post The Gift of Feedback

juliepierceleadership.com

Timestamps:

00:21 Introduction to Julie & why feedback is hard

08:02 Why feedback is so important

09:18 How we as leaders should give feedback to others

19:48 Feedback in Women's Ministry

26:38 Suggestions for leaders who struggle with feedback

34:32 Responding to critical feedback

40:17 Other resources

TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle. Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast as well as video. My special guest today is Julie Pierce. Welcome, Julie.

Julie >> Thanks for having me, Kay.

Kay >> Oh, we're so happy that you're here today and that we're having this conversation. We're going to be talking about the art of giving and receiving feedback, and that goes along with your role. You're an executive coach. You develop leaders one-on-one through coaching. You consult with teams; you communicate with groups; you do all that kind of leadership communication stuff.

You can read more about Julie on her bio on our website at beyondordinarywomen.org. And Julie, I have your website as JuliePierceLeadership.com. Is that it?

Julie >> Yes, that's me.

Kay >> And Pierce is P I E R C E, right?

Julie >> Yes.

Kay >> Is there more than one way to spell Pierce?

Julie >> There are a lot of different ways, but the best way is pie.

Kay >> That’s good.

Julie >> About right. I mean, that's one of my favorites, so that's good.

Kay >> Well, today we are talking about feedback. And as Julie wrote in her notes to me, “Is feedback the other F word?” And why do you say that? Because we hate feedback? Because it's tough? Why do you feel that way about it?

Julie >> You know, I say it that way, and obviously I'm joking! And yet there's a little bit of truth behind every joke, right? Because we all are so scared of getting any kind of feedback because feedback has become this dirty word. Where we immediately assume it's going to be this deep cutting criticism that is just going to cut to our core instead of this life-giving catalyst for our growth.

And so if we can shift our mindset around it, and if we can get some skills about how to give and receive feedback, it really can be one of the key things that just unlocks our potential and really what God has for us and for those we lead. So it's really critical, and yet we just have that often had such terrible experiences,

Quite honestly, like each one of us probably has a horror story to tell about someone who offered to give us some feedback, and really they just wanted to beat us up a little bit.

And so that's often we have just a little bit of trauma in our background from feedback. And so we just say, “Oh, never mind, I'm not going to touch that with a ten foot pole.” So I think if we can get the skills and if we can shift our mindset about how we think about it, it really can unlock some amazing growth process.

Kay >> Right. Well, you know, speaking of people having that kind of reaction, I remember that years ago I handed out to some Bible study leaders like a self-evaluation and I got feedback from one of my friends who said so-and-so was really complaining about it because she said, “This is just like a job evaluation.

Nika Spaulding

Kay Daigle

Why celebrate Lent? In this episode of the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast, Nika Spaulding joins Kay Daigle to discuss all things Lent. Although we may think that Lent is only for Catholics, Anglicans and other liturgical churches, it isn't. Nor is it all about fasting. Celebrating Lent means focusing on Jesus as we prepare our hearts for Easter.

So how do we celebrate Lent? How does it work and who should participate in it? When did Christians begin celebrating this season? What are its benefits? What is fasting all about? How should we celebrate it? Nika deals with all of these questions.

We encourage you to plan ahead to participate in Lent beginning on Ash Wednesday, which occurs March 5 this year.

If you prefer you can watch this episode on video.

Recommended resources

Readings for Lent

N.T. Wright's Lent for Everyone series. This year is Lent for Everyone: Luke, Year C--A Daily Devotional

N.T. Wright's new devotional, From Wilderness to Glory: Lent and Easter for Everyone.

The Crucifixion by Fleming Rutledge

Bread and Wine: Readings for Lent and Easter.  Each day's devotional is an excerpt from a different author's work.

Music that draws you to Christ

Timestamps:

00:21 Introduction to Lent

05:13 Background of Lent

07:09 Fasting

10:29 Adding in spiritual rhythms during Lent

13:55 Preparing your heart, soul and mind for Easter

16:00 Lent calls us to reflect on the brevity of life

24:06 Other reflections during Lent

25:10 Lent involves community

26:44 Lent is an invitation to repentance & reconciliation

28:32 Suggestions for what to do, read, etc.

TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women. Welcome to this podcast and video episode of the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast. We are so glad to have you with us today. Today, our topic is “Why Celebrate Lent?” and our guest speaker is Nika Spaulding. Welcome, Nika.

Nika >> Thanks, Kay. I'm excited to be.

Kay >> I’m always so happy when you join us. You give us such a depth and wealth of information, and it’s so encouraging and positive. A few months ago, and it seems like just yesterday, Nika and I recorded an episode “Why Celebrate Advent? We talked about why we thought that was a great thing for Christians to do. At that time, we decided we would do one on Lent as well.

And so here we are. It's already time. It doesn't seem right!

Nika >> Doesn't seem right. I feel like it was yesterday.

Kay >> I can't believe we're talking about Lent. And you know the day we're recording this, we still have a little bit of time. But still it's coming up and it won't be long before it's here.

Nika >>Yeah.

Kay >>  And I suppose since we talked about the fact that neither one of us had ever celebrated Advent until we were adults. You didn't grow up in the church, and I grew up in a non-liturgical church. And we just kind of thought that Catholics do that. We don’t; we're Protestant.

So I'm assuming that you and I are the same on Lent, that we didn't practice Lent until we were adults as well.

Nika >> Yeah, exact same. I would say the biggest difference was I probably didn't even know Advent existed until I was an adult. But Lent I did know because of the very thing you're talking about because I had buddies who are Catholic. I remember seeing them with ashes on their head and not being able to eat certain foods, and so I knew Lent existed. But to me it was this kind of bizarro thing that once a year my Catholic buddy's did.

That was the extent of what I understood about it.

Kay >> Yeah, and all my Catholic friends— I heard them at school talking about what are you giving up for Lent? What are you giving up for Lent? And I thought, this just seems . . .

Nika >> Yeah. Why would I give up anything?

Kay >> Why are you giving up anything? And they weren't real happy about it, so it didn't make me want to celebrate Lent. You know, I just,

Kelly Arabie

Debbie Swindoll

What does effective discipleship entail? What can we do in our churches to become more successful disciple-makers? How can we as individuals do a better job of discipling others?

Debbie Swindoll joined BOW Ministry Team Member Kelly Arabie to discuss this important topic. Debbie calls us to dive into community if we want to grow as disciples of Jesus. What does that look like? Debbie provides practical and insightful answers to guide us to effective discipleship.

You can watch this episode if you prefer.

Other resources

Don't miss the other discipleship video that Debbie did for BOW, Re-imagining Discipleship: A Spiritual Formation Perspective. It is part of a series that you won't want to miss if you are involved in making decisions about discipleship or if you disciple others. Other podcasts in the Re-imagining Discipleship series: A Theological Perspective, A Church Leader Perspective, A Missions Perspective, and A Kingdom Perspective, and Reclaiming the Fear of the Lord.

Receive a free sample of Debbie's spiritual formation curriculum Life with God

Time Stamps

00:24 Introductions

01:36 Ministry of Grafted Life

02:54 What does effective mean in terms of discipleship?

05:35 Developing the Fruit of the Spirit

09:35 The relational component

15:16 The challenge to experience being seen & known

19:05 What does this kind of relationship with others look like?

22:02 What does such a relationship with God look like?

24:43 It's very personal

29:37 Growing in community

33:03 Helpful resources

TranscriptKelly >> Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women podcast. My name is Kelly Arabie. I'm one of the team members here at Beyond Ordinary Women, and today we are talking with Debbie Swindoll of Grafted Life Ministries. Along with her husband Kurt, Debbie founded Grafted Life and serves as the Executive Director and the director of Church Formation. Debbie graduated with a Masters in Spiritual Formation and Soul Care from the Institute of Spiritual Formation at Talbot Seminary and Biola University.

Debbie also serves as the Spiritual Formation Pastor at her church, Journey Community Church. Debbie, welcome. We are so happy to have you.

Debbie >> Thank you. It's a long thing there. I'm getting older. I'm old now.

Kelly >> No.

Debbie previously spoke with Kay about Reimagining Discipleship. And so I want to encourage our listeners to go ahead (and we'll talk about that more at the end) but listen to that video as well. That will give you an introduction to our topic today. Today we are talking about effective discipleship.

Deb, why don't you start with telling us a little bit about the Ministry of Grafted Life.

Debbie >> Well, we started Grafted Life in 2010 and it was a bunch of colleagues of mine that had degrees in spiritual formation, which is kind of another word for discipleship, or how people grow, how we're formed as Christians.

And we really had heart for the church. We'd gone to this graduate program and we'd experienced a lot of life change and we'd seen people change significantly. And yet we knew that everybody can't go to a graduate program. Everybody can't go to seminary. And so what, what could we bring back to the church that would maybe be more effective, more meaningful, more transformational for people in their lives and in their growth, in their spiritual growth. So we started really praying into that and thinking about it.

We ended up developing some curricula and also starting an association for spiritual directors that could really serve people in the church and come alongside them in their spiritual growth.

Kelly >> So as today we're talking about effective discipleship, what in your definition is effective?

Debbie >> Okay, that's a really good question because I'm not sure when we think about discipleship, we always think about effective.

You know, if you just look up in the dictionary, what is effective,

The focus of this episode is our interpretation and understanding of women in the story of Scripture. We at BOW are thrilled to welcome once again Dr. Sandra Glahn of Dallas Seminary. In this recording Dr. Glahn talks with Kay Daigle about the way we interpret the stories of women in Scripture and how that affects our perspective of them. Additionally she suggests that we learn to understand them from the context and provides many examples of how to be true to the text--and there are so many!

Whether you're a teacher of the Word or you're reading through the Bible and want to understand the women in the story of Scripture, you'll be encouraged as a woman by Dr. Glahn's insights and helps. You can also access this episode on video if you prefer.

You may also want to access some of the many episodes featuring Dr. Glahn and her insights and scholarship.

Time Stamps

00:24 Why this topic?

02:02 The elements of story help us interpret correctly

06:12 How does knowing more about narrative help us interpret?

07:02 Noticing whether a person is named or not

10:15 Faulty approaches to the story

12:56 How do we correct faulty interpretations?

15:04 Who are some women in the Bible we tend to skip?

21:32 Evil-izing women of the Bible & not the men

23:50 Questions that women are asking about the Bible

26:40 How will understanding story help us avoid faulty interpretations?

32:24 Final encouragement for Bible teachers

34:17 Other resources from Dr. Glahn

TranscriptKay >> Welcome to this Beyond Ordinary Women Ministry podcast. We're so happy to have you on video or our podcast. Our guest today is Dr. Sandra Glahn, who has been with us many times. Welcome, Sandi. Thank you for being here.

Dr. Glahn >> Such a pleasure. Always a pleasure. Love what you're doing.

Kay >> Thank you so much. I always contact Sandi once or twice a year and just say, what do you have going on? What can we talk about? Because I know what a blessing it will be to all of you out there. And today we are talking about “Women in the Story of Scripture.” And I'm particularly excited about this one.

Why are you working on this right now? Do you want to give us a little background?

Dr. Glahn >> Yeah. So I'm working on a book right now called A Woman's Place in the Story. And my pitch was basically this: First we had men's history, and we study David and we study the children of Israel, and we study Moses, which is important to study as Scripture is important. But we tended to initially just skip the women and then as a corrective have gone back and done studies on the women of the Bible, which we are not done doing, by the way.

So it's still completely appropriate to have a women's study Bible and studies of women because so often they were left out. Example, you might have heard a sermon series on Genesis that skipped the story of Tamar, that's essential to the plot of Joseph's life and to his brother Judah. So my argument is we need to go beyond cameoing women.

The ideal would be to just tell the story but include the women as they're in the story because they're serving an important function in the story. And so what I want to talk about now is some of the tools we need to see them so that we interpret what's happening appropriately.

Kay >> Well, that's great. I'm really excited about this as a Bible teacher myself. So I know I'm going to learn from you today, and I suspect that everyone out there will as well.

So first, let's talk just a little bit about the elements of story.

Dr. Glahn >> You think about if you read a novel, you’ve got a character, you've got a plot, you've got a setting. One of the things to know when we're reading the Hebrew Bible is that often the land acts as much like a character as a person, and God's using the land and things like this—we’ll get to the daughters of Zelophehad later.

But just as an example: these women who come and they're concerned that their father's name will be forgotten,...

Rebecca Carrell

In BOW's latest episode, Rebecca Carrell talks with Kay Daigle about the biblical term "the fear of the Lord" and the need for reclaiming it. What does it even mean? And why is it so crucial to our discipleship?

Is the fear of the Lord simply revering or honoring God? Do we find that there is there more to it when we actually study it biblically?

Other Resources

This podcast is part of a series on Re-imagining Discipleship. Don't miss our other episodes: A Theological Perspective, A Spiritual Formation Perspective, A Church Leader Perspective, A Missions Perspective and A Kingdom Perspective.

You can connect to the video version of Reclaiming the Fear of the Lord if you prefer. When you click on the podcast episodes of the other conversations in this series, you will find the video links as well.

Time Stamps

00:23 Introducing Rebecca Carrell

04:36 Rebecca, why your interest in the fear of the Lord?

06:49 Why is the fear of the Lord difficult to understand?

08:56 What is the fear of the Lord?

15:26 What are the ramifications to the church over the loss of the fear of the Lord?

17:24 A healthy fear of the Lord

20:53 The way forward

23:44 Is the megachurch part of the problem?

25:09 How can a megachurch be done well?

30:11 Final encouragement

32:02 Other resources on discipleship

TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. Welcome to this episode with Rebecca Carrell, our special guest. Welcome, Rebecca.

Rebecca >> Thank you so much for having me, Kay.

Kay >> Oh, we're so happy to have you again. And I'm really looking forward to this topic today. We're going to be talking about reclaiming the fear of the Lord, and it's going to be part of our series on Reimagining Discipleship. In that series, we've talked about various things that seem to be missing in the church today, and it all affects our discipleship.

It's all part of our discipleship. And so this particular topic, when I saw that Rebecca had done some work on it and spoken on it, I felt like it was just perfect for what we do. Thank you, Rebecca, for doing that.

Rebecca >> Oh, you know, this has just kind of been a burden on my heart for the last few years. And so it actually feels good to give it some expression.

Kay >> Yes. Well, and that's the way I've felt about the whole discipleship thing, it was really a burden for me to see what I saw as a real lack of discipleship in the church. And so I'm really excited about this conversation.

Rebecca holds a master's degree in Christian education from Dallas Seminary, and she is now working on her doctor of education degree. That is wonderful. I'm so excited to hear that you're doing that.

Rebecca >> I am not sure how any of this happened.

I've been in school since 2015. It's like when, oh Lord, will we be done? Hopefully in a couple of years.

Kay >> My husband always says that if I could, I'd go to school all the time and that really is true.

Rebecca >> And when you work there, it makes it easy because you know they're like, Sure, you can take some classes. So it's like, Well, we'll just keep going then.

Kay >> That's great. Well, I'm really thrilled that you're doing that. Rebecca also produces and hosts a podcast, Honestly Though, and the subtitle is Real Talk, Real Life and Real Faith. And I highly recommend that our audience connect with that podcast. After spending 20 years on the radio in Dallas Fort Worth, she now mentors and teaches students at Dallas Seminary.

Tell us what you teach.

Rebecca >> So I have been working with the Great Dr. Sue Edwards and Dr. Joye Baker. They are nearing retirement. And so the plan is to have me work with them. They mentor me. And so when they finally decide to hang it up, I will be taking the classes that pertain to women ministering to women. So right now we co-teach a class called Women Teaching Women, which teaches women how to write and teach their own Bible studies.

Jodie Niznik

Julie Pierce

Identifying the best support for Christian leaders is crucial when we deal with personal issues or leadership problems. What kind of outside professional will provide the best kind of guidance and wisdom for whatever has us stuck? Will a spiritual director, coach, counselor or pastor best help us with our difficulties? What are the differences in the kind of counsel and wisdom we would receive from these various professionals?

Joining host Kay Daigle are Jodie Niznik and Julie Pierce who discuss the differences and provide guidance for those of us who need support of some kind. Identifying the best support for us as Christian leaders is the first step in moving forward.

Connect to the video of this conversation if you prefer.

Resources

Three FAQs about Leadership Coaching by Julie Pierce

Website for ESDA, a network of Christ-centered spiritual director

Contact Julie Pierce:

[email protected]

Connect on LinkedIn

Schedule a Free Discovery Call with Julie.

Our BOW resources to help You, As a Leader

Time Stamps

00:32 Introducing BOW's guests and the topic

05:27 Counselors' expertise

11:03 Coaches' expertise

18:40 How does a spiritual director help someone?

23:40 What should we expect from a pastor?

29:58 How does a leader help others discern where to best go for help?

31:33 Finding qualified experts

35:15 What not to do

42:31 Other helpful resources

TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle. Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women podcast and video episode. Today's topic is designed to help you as a leader when you feel stuck or if you're struggling personally or in your ministry. We want to help you, and to do that we have invited two special guests to be with us, Jodie Niznik and Julie Pierce.

Welcome.

Jodie >> Thank you. It's good to be here.

Kay >> Well, thank you for giving us your time and being here to help leaders in this situation.

And we're really reaching out to you as leaders. You may not even need this right now. You may not need it right this moment, but you may need it later, so this episode is very important. It will help you if you need some support just because you're not sure what to do next in your ministry, or how to deal with a problem—whether it's that you have burned out or whether you just need some emotional support, whatever it is.

We are here to help direct you to the right person because there are choices. And we're going to talk about the choices of going to a spiritual director, a counselor, coach, or just a pastor. What are the differences? And when would you go to one and not the other? We'll talk about their areas of expertise to help you make that decision.

So let's talk about you, Jodie, for just a minute. Jodie has a scripture meditation podcast, So Much More that is excellent. Jodie has been on a church staff, and she understands what it's like to have that kind of pressure on you to be a spiritual leader.

And we've had some great previous conversations with Jodie. We've talked about leadership lessons from the life of Moses. We've talked about taking a personal retreat. We've talked about spiritual practices that can help us.

So look at her full bio on our website, BeyondOrdinaryWomen.org, and learn more about her. So, Jodie, we're just thrilled that you were able to be with us again.

Jodie >> Thanks, Kay. It's always so, so good to be here.

Kay >> And Julie, we are delighted to have you come for the first time—and hopefully it won't be for the last that you’ll be able to join us. Julie and I first met years ago. We were on the same church staff. I believe your title was church Communications Director.

Julie >> Yes. Good memory, Kay. It feels like a long time ago.

Kay >> Yeah, I started thinking that was probably it. Julie has a whole list of churches where she has served and also helped with their leadership situation. And she just has had a lot of leadership development roles...

Nika Spaulding

Kay Daigle

Why celebrate Advent? In this episode Nika Spaulding talks with Kay Daigle about what Advent is, why we should consider celebrating it, and how to do that in a meaningful way. If you've only done the wreath or the calendar at Advent, this episode will give you new insights as well as ideas to make it more personal to you and your family.

This episode is available on video for those who prefer watching it.

Recommended resources

Watch for the Light: Readings for Advent and Christmas

Advent by Tish Harrison Warren

Advent: The Once and Future Coming of Jesus Christ by Fleming Rutledge

Connect to the document with Advent candle lighting readings, BibleProject Advent Series and Spotify Playlist for Advent songs.

If you're interested, you can connect to other BOW posts centering on Christmas.

Timestamps:

00:36 Introductions

01:58 Nika & Kay's experiences with Advent

04:26 Quote from Tish Harrison Warren, author of Advent, on the big idea of Advent

05:15 The four weeks of Advent

09:22 Origins of Advent

13:26 Reasons to celebrate Advent

18:38 Advent puts us in the place of those waiting for Jesus

23:46 What John the Baptist teaches us about waiting

27:50 Suggested ways to celebrate Advent

34:35 Other Advent resources

TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. Welcome to this podcast episode and video. Whichever way you're watching or listening, we are thrilled that you have joined us. I am joined today by Nika Spaulding. Nika is a speaker, an author, a writer, and she is almost finished with her DMin in New Testament. Welcome Nika.

Nika >> Thanks, Kay. I'm excited to be here. And I'm excited for this topic. I think you and I both are, so this will be fun.

Kay >> Yeah, I think so too. So when do you finish this New Testament degree?

Nika >> So all I have left is the thesis, so I suppose it's as quickly as I can write, which means not for a while. So it's not going as fast as I anticipated, but I think I'll be done in June 2025 and ready to graduate. So hopefully I'll knock that.

Kay >> That's really right around the corner.

Nika >> Yeah, it feels like it's right there. Like I've done all the, you know, the classes and you know, how it goes. Can you do all this work? And then you're like, the finish line is, I can see it, but what's between the finish line and now is like 90 pages. So I can knock that out.

Kay >> Yeah, well, I can hardly wait to read it.

Nika >> Thank you.

Kay >> Anyway, Nika and I do want to talk about Advent and I think that we both have really benefited from celebrating Advent through the years. For me, I didn't grow up in a church that celebrated Advent in any way. We weren't a liturgical church in any way. We didn't do things like this, and it was really only as an adult that one of the churches I was in even had the Advent wreath and the candles in the church.

But I have really grown to love Advent over the last few years. What about you, Nika? What is your background with Advent?

Nika >> Yeah, it sounds so similar to yours.

So I not only didn't grow up in a liturgical church, I didn't really grow up in the church at all. So my only experience of Advent was I had a great aunt who had sent my brother, sister and I chocolate Advent calendars, so I thought Advent was like chocolate. Like I thought it was like you get a piece of chocolate a day and my sister would eat all of hers before we even got to December 5th, and my brother would like hoard his and hide, you know?

And so I had no idea Advent was a part of a church tradition until I was an adult. And it's interesting because I asked my two roommates who did grow up in the church but did not grow up in liturgical churches like you, and neither of them had any concept of it until they were adults. And I asked them as well, Did you have a concept of Lent?

You know, you think of these two seasons: Advent prepares you for Christ...

Claudia McGuire

Kay Daigle

Several weeks before the election, Claudia McGuire and Kay Daigle discussed seeking joy in the Psalms. Our hope and prayer is that whether the candidate you voted for won or lost, you can raise your voice in thanks to God for his love and care today and find his joy.

About half of us are likely disappointed in the results, whatever they may be. Although we may not understand what God is doing in our world, we can trust his heart and his wisdom, knowing that his priority is his kingdom, not an earthly one.

Relying on what we know about God's power and his character, knowing that our God is the true ruler whom we all seek, and recognizing that he has purpose in whatever has happened, we seek joy in the Psalms today.

Recommended resources

Video/podcast episode with Nika Spaulding Cultivating Joy

CSB Scripture Notebook: Psalms which includes journaling pages

Near to the Heart of God Bible study on selected Psalms

This episode is available on video as well.

Timestamps

00:21 Introduction

01:08 Why be joyful and why the Psalms?

03:18 Claudia goes through Psalm 23, sharing what it has meant to her life

22:13 Kay's experience finding joy in the Psalms

27:26 Kay goes through Psalm 27, sharing how it helps her find joy

34:54 Insights

39:37 Other resources

TranscriptKay >> Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women podcast and video. I'm Kay Daigle your host today. And I am joined by Claudia McGuire. Welcome, Claudia. I'm glad you were able to join me today.

Claudia >> Me too.

Kay >> Claudia and I attended Dallas Seminary together, and it's getting to be a long time since that happened. I was thinking about it's being a long time. That's where we first met, I think.

She has served on our BOW ministry team since its inception, and she brings a wealth of experience and knowledge in life and in ministry to our conversation. But you can read more about her on her bio on our website at BeyondOrdinaryWomen.org.

Our topic today is Seeking Joy in the Psalms. Before we start, I want to make it clear that we recorded this session in October weeks ago from when it drops. So we don't know what happened in the election, but we guess that about half of the people in the country are upset this morning as this particular episode goes online.

Of course, that assumes that the results are in and we have no idea when that will actually happen. But as we think about today, the day after the election, and even ongoing, it's important just to remember that joy is an important quality for Christians. Whether there's disappointment, whether there's fear—no matter what it is—God wants us to have joy instead. And joy is a fruit of the Spirit.

So it is something we all should be exhibiting because we are believers and the Holy Spirit lives within us. So we should want to seek joy. That's the reason we decided to have this particular episode on Seeking Joy in the Psalms. I have found that the Psalms are a great place if you don't feel that you are joyful, If you're struggling, or if you're unhappy in any situation. It may have nothing to do with an election. But whatever it is, whatever your circumstances are, the Psalms are a great place to go.

So the big question is how do we as Christians handle bad news in general? Grief? hard times? whatever it is? How do we as God's people of faith deal with those things? And how do we exhibit joy in the midst of that?

So the Psalms are going to tell us to put our joy in the Lord.

Claudia's going to start us out.

Claudia, what Psalm has really been meaningful to you when you've dealt with things that are hard, things that your circumstances, that you're struggling in? Is there a certain psalm that you go to?

Claudia >> Yes, especially for the past two years. I think I have one that I have gone to over and over. I find that sometimes I'll wake up in the middle of the night and I just start saying it to bring peace into my sleep,