Jim Hake, founder of Spirit of America, joins The Burn Bag to discuss why civilians matter in modern national security—and how his organization is filling gaps government can’t. A Silicon Valley entrepreneur turned national security innovator, Jim founded Spirit of America after 9/11 to bring a whole-of-society approach to U.S. missions overseas.

In this conversation, Jim breaks down why he believes the U.S. has been “fighting with one hand tied behind its back,” what it means to be not neutral in global competition, and how Spirit of America became the only nonprofit with a formal partnership with the Department of Defense. We explore how his team works alongside U.S. troops and diplomats in places like Ukraine and Taiwan, strengthening trust, building resilience, and shaping outcomes in the gray zone.

Jim and A’ndre reflect on where civilian support fits in a new era of strategic competition—and what it says about America’s ability to lead without uniformed force.