In this enlightening episode, Ginger Healy and Julie Beem sit down with Diane Gould, LCSW, and leading voice in the PDA (Pathological Demand Avoidance) movement in North America. As co-author of Navigating PDA in America and Founder of PDA North America, Diane shares her deep expertise and personal journey—including her recent autism diagnosis—to help unpack the complexities of this misunderstood profile of autism.

Together, we explore what PDA is, how it differs from traditional views of autism and oppositional behavior, and why recognizing it matters so much. From practical strategies to systemic change, this episode is a must-listen for parents, educators, and professionals working with neurodivergent children.

• What Pathological Demand Avoidance (PDA) is—and what it isn’t

• Why PDA is often misunderstood as oppositional defiance

• The power of the distinction: “I can’t” vs. “I won’t”

• The origin and mission of PDA North America

• What effective support looks like for PDA individuals

• Common misconceptions in schools and clinical settings

• The importance of collaborative, flexible approaches

• One small but powerful change you can make today

Navigating PDA in America By Diane Gould, LCSW is a groundbreaking guide for parents, educators, and clinicians seeking to understand and support individuals with PDA in a U.S. context. https://a.co/d/4HS7wy1

🌐 Connect with Diane Gould & PDA North America:📥

• Website: https://pdanorthamerica.org/

• https://pdanorthamerica.org/free-pdfs/

•  [email protected] 

• www.pdanorthamerica.org 

• learn.pdanorthamerica.org 

• facebook.com/pdanorthamerica 

• • Instagram.com/pdanorthamerica
  • @PDANorthAmerica 

PDA North America Resources: 

• PDA Learning Lab - self-paced pre-recorded webinars & trainings - https://learn.pdanorthamerica.org/ 
• Annual Conference - March 5-7th Virtual & In-Person outside Chicago 
• PDA Insights Articles - Articles posted regularly on various PDA topics - https://pdanorthamerica.com/insights 
• PDA-Affirming Provider List - over 500+ providers that consider themselves PDA-affirming, sorted by state/province - https://pdanorthamerica.org/pdaaffirming-providers/ 
• Upcoming Webinars & Events - details and registration for all upcoming announced offerings - https://pdanorthamerica.org/events/ 
• Parent Provided Educators List (if you have a PDA child that goes to an educator that is PDA affirming, we'd love for you to submit them to be listed!) https://pdanorthamerica.org/pda-affirming-providers/ 
• Free Peer Support Groups - support groups that meet regularly - https://pdanorthamerica.org/support-groups/ 
• YouTube Channel - https://www.youtube.com/
• Free Downloadable PDF Resources - free downloadables - https://pdanorthamerica.org/free-pdfs/ 
• PDA Community Contact List - parents and PDAers seeking a local community of people that understand and value their experience - https://pdanorthamerica.org/community-list/ 
• Support Shop - PDA Swag shop - https://pdanorthamerica.org/supportshop/#products 

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Let’s keep growing a trauma-informed, attachment-focused community. 💙