Everyone Hates Marketers | No-BS Marketing & Brand Strategy Podcast

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

When Wes Bush left a job that he hated, he knew he had to pursue something that would give him the energy and drive to work at it consistently every day.

Within three years of making that decision, he’d written a book, built a coaching program, and launched the Product-Lead Institute.

In this episode, Wes tells me how he got to that point in his career and the influences behind his decisions.

He also reveals his 16-step guide to building credibility.

Topics covered:

• Why Wes treats his LinkedIn profile like a landing page
• What led him to launch his own business
• If you can build demand you can build any business
• How to discover what it is that you truly love to do
• The benefits of specialising in an area
• Doubling down on what gives you the most energy
• How Wes created and ran a course for the CXL Institute
• Why you need to pick a villain in marketing
• Mistakes he made when building his personal brand

Resources mentioned:

• Product-Lead Institute
• Vidyard
• Eat Your Greens - Wiemer Snijders
• Key Person of Influence - Daniel Priestly
• The Unique Ability - Julia Waller & Catherine Nomura
• Dilbert
• CXL Institute
• Gainsight PX
• Drift
• HubSpot
• Pratfall Effect in Marketing: Admit Your Flaws to Win Customers

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

Mark Ritson tells things as they are, and that’s why he’s one of my favorite marketers.

The founder of the Mini MBA in Marketing, he’s a long-standing columnist for marketing week, has worked with some of the world’s biggest brands, and has taught at some of the top business schools.

In this longest ever episode of Everyone Hates Marketers, I challenge Mark to tell us how he would build a business on a limited budget.

Topics covered:

• What does the long and the short of it mean?
• Start with what you’ve got
• How to start a business that maintains 
• Why you should ask yourself what it is you can do that most other people can't
• Why small brands can take risks that the bigger brands can’t
• Why you should stand up and be counted as the founder of your business
• How the birth of his first child forced him to start Mini MBA
• Why scalability is such an important word
• What’s so fantastic about shitting your pants

Resources mentioned:

• Mini MBA
• Differentiate or Die - Jack Trout
• Different - Youngme Moon
• Net Promoter
• Mark Ritson - 4 Steps to Creating a Rock-Solid Strategy
• Daft Punk: 5 Marketing Lessons to Make Your Business Famous
• How to Compete With Big Brands Even With Very Few Resources

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

You should be very familiar with my guest today.  

As a serial entrepreneur, he’s founded and co-founded multiple companies over the past 20 years including, KISSmetrics and Crazy Egg. He’s now CEO of FYI, a solution for having all of your documents in one place.

In this episode, Hiten talks about value proposition and why keeping it simple is the key to making it successful.

Topics covered:

• The definition of a value proposition
• Thinking about people first and understanding what they want
• Examples of value propositions
• The three mistakes businesses make with their value proposition
• Understanding how people see your business in order to understand your value proposition
• Why the value proposition is in the eye of the beholder
• The first step to defining your value proposition
• Ensuring you able to deliver on your value proposition
• The importance of keeping what you do simple to understand
• Why you should consider the most unique thing that your business does

Resources mentioned:

• Use FYI
• Crazy Egg
• Kissmetrics
• Category Creation: 4 Reasons to NEVER Do It

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

Joanna Wiebe is the original conversion copywriter. She’s the co-founder of Copyhackers and Airstory.co, and she’s written for companies like Wistia, Buffer, Crazy Egg, Shopify, and more.If you’ve ever struggled to write copy for your landing page, you’ll want to learn from Joanna. Tune into our interview for her step-by-step guide to better customer research, more authentic writing, and increased conversions for your business.

What is Copy Hackers?

Copy Hackers is where startups and marketers go to learn how to write persuasive website and email copy. Joanna teaches all things copywriting, growth marketing, and how to run a profitable freelancing business.

Topics covered:

3 Steps to Writing Copy That Converts

Conversion copywriting is about moving somebody to take action. Your role is to convince someone to say yes to your offer—whether it’s buying your product, signing up for your email list, or clicking a link to read your latest blog post.

According to Joanna Wiebe, it’s all about getting inside people’s heads.The difference between writing persuasive copy and “meh” copy is how much you focus on your audience. You should be thinking about your audience the entire time you’re writing copy. It’s not about the words you would use to describe your product.What words does your audience use?

How do they talk about what you’re selling? Writing copy that converts means you find out how your prospects talk about their objections, their problems, and what they’re going through in life. You find those words and phrases in your research—and put them into a framework that’s designed to make people say yes.In this interview, Joanne walks you through all three steps in detail.

‍Step 1:

The best copywriting starts with research and discovery.In fact, this is the most significant part of the entire process. It’s simple. Start with customer interviews and zero in on the parts you hear that are interesting. What are the things that make you pause and take notice?When you’re really looking for messages and the order you want to put them in.If you can’t do one-on-one customer interviews, you can send out surveys or dig into a process Joanna calls review mining. The point is, you’re never starting from scratch when it comes to copy. You’re just organizing raw, voice-of-customer data.

Step 2:

How do you organize your messages on the page?In this step, Joanna shares the frameworks she uses to pull the copy together. Her favorite is PAS, or Problem, Solve, Agitate. This method opens with the problem that’s being solved—and agitates it so your reader really feels these pain points.If there’s no major pain point, you can turn the classic framework AIDA. It stands for Attention, Interest, Desire, and Action. You start organizing messages based on what will grab your reader’s attention.

Step 3:

The final step is editing. This is where you sweep through your messaging and edit it to prepare for AB testing. All you’re doing is taking the clunky voice-of-customer data and making sure it sounds smooth (but still sticky).In this interview, Joanna reveals her process called The Seven Sweeps. You’ll learn the 7-step framework for executing a fast-moving copy review, so you can edit quickly and confidently.

Resources mentioned:

• Airstory.co
• CopyHackers.com
• Rev.com transcription
• Backlinko
• Scientific Advertising by Claude Hopkins
• Tested Advertising Methods by John Caples
• Joanna Wiebe on Twitter @copyhackers
• [email protected]

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

When it comes to digital marketing it's easy to drown ourselves in endless data analytics, campaign results, and market research. But marketing boils down to one thing only--humans. Marketing psychology is the study of consumer psychology and the reasoning behind why we make decisions.

Who is Richard Shotton?

My guest today is Richard Shotton, the author of The Choice Factory: 25 Behavioral Biases That Influence What We Buy. He's also the head of behavioral science for Manning Gottlieb OMD, the #1 advertising agency in Europe.

Topics covered:

5 Little-Known Facts About Consumer Behavior

1. Pratfall Effect: If you can admit a weakness or flaw, you become more appealing to your audience.
2. Confirmation Bias: We're very good at maintaining our existing point of view.
3. Our Habits: You can persuade people in the moments when their habits become destabilized.
4. Brand Purpose: Not every company needs to have have a higher purpose beyond profit.
5. Personalization: Don’t apply it to such a degree that you lose the essence of your brand.

The Pratfall Effect

The pratfall effect is a counter-intuitive idea that was first discussed by Eliott Aronson, a professor of psychology at Harvard in the 1960s. According to this theory, you become more appealing after you admit a weakness or you exhibit a flaw.In marketing, this applies because one of the biggest issues we face is that people don't trust brands. Once you’ve admitted a flaw, you're demonstrating your honesty and the rest of your claims suddenly become more believable.

Confirmation Bias

Our brain instinctively resist new information due to confirmation bias. As Richard Shotton explains, if you already dislike a brand, your brain will continue to come up with counter arguments to maintain its existing point of view. You can counteract this in marketing by reaching your audience at moments of distraction, because they’re potentially persuadable at this point. And you can do this by thinking about the body language and the tone of your advertising.

Our Habits

What are the moments when people’s habits become destabilized? According to consumer psychology, we can encourage people to buy our products during major life events. Richard Shotton conducted research where he discovered that people are 2-3 times more likely to try a new brand after undergoing a life event.These life events can include getting married, divorced, retiring, moving, having your first child, or starting a new job. These are when our habits are in flux and we're open to buying new products to fit these changes.

Brand Purpose

There’s a current trend in marketing at the moment where companies are trying to find a single way of answering briefs. This can go wrong in a lot ways. Because the problems that your target market will face are varied -- and one solution is impossible.Richard explains brand purpose as an example. In some circumstances, brands should have a higher order beyond profit but it can also lead to the wrong approach if you try to apply purpose to everything. Remember the infamous Pepsi protest campaign? That's proof on how this tactic can fail.

Personalization

If you take personalization in marketing too far, there can be huge implications. In this interview, Richard shares a theory from Kevin Simler that explains the value of a brand is in it’s shared cultural meaning.If you're targeting your audience with different messages it can be great in the beginning. However, eventually people will overhear those messages and understand that your brand actually stands for nothing.

Resources mentioned:

• The Choice Factory: 25 Behavioral Biases That Influence What We Buy by Richard Shotton
• A true story: the birth of a great campaign by Paul Feldwick
• Stuff From The Loft by David Dye
• The 22 Irrefutable Laws of Leadership by Bern Bolo
• Ads Don't Work That Way by Kevin Simler
• Mark Ritson: 4 Steps to Creating a Rock-Solid Marketing Strategy
• The Anatomy of Humbug: How to Think Differently About Advertising by Paul Feldwick
• Decoded: The Science Behind Why We Buy by Phil Barden
• Rory Sutherland: The Wiki Man
• Everybody Lies: Big Data, New Data, and What the Internet Can Tell Us About Who We Really Are by Seth Stevens-Davidowitz
• @rshotton on Twitter
• Richard Shotton on LinkedIn
• Pratfall Effect in Marketing: Admit Your Flaws to Win Customers
• How to Influence Buying Decisions Without Being Shady
• How to Convince People to Buy (Without Being Pushy)

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

...

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

What motivates human behavior?

My guest today is Susan Weinschenk, behavioral scientist, author, speaker, consultant, and mentor.

She is an expert in understanding, predicting and directing human behavior. Her books include How to Get People to Do Stuff, 100 Things Every Designer Needs to Know About People, 100 Things Every Presenter Needs to Know About People, and Neuro Web Design.

In this episode, we’re going to talk about what motivates people in this complex modern world, and how we can use behavioral science to become better marketers.

Susan will explain five drivers of human behavior backed by scientific studies and what you should know about them in order to get people to do what you want.

Topics covered:

• Unconscious mental processing and self-stories
• Value versus habit based decisions
• The 5 top drivers of human motivation
• The power of storytelling
• The need to belong and social ties
• Behavioral habits and instincts
• Ethics in behavioral science
• Susan’s recommended reading

Resources mentioned:

• How to Get People to Do Stuff, 100 Things Every Designer Needs to Know About People, 100 Things Every Presenter Needs to Know About People, 100 MORE Things Every Designer Needs to Know About People and Neuro Web Design by Susan Weinschenk
• Redirect by Timothy Wilson
• Sapiens by Yuval Harari
• Thinking, Fast and Slow by Daniel Kahneman
• The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

How to create 100% accurate and detailed buyer persona.

My guest this episode is Adele Revella, CEO of the Buyer Persona Institute, speaker and author of a top five business book by Fortune magazine of 2015, Buyer Personas: How to Gain Insight into Your Customer’s Expectations, Align your Marketing Strategies, and Win More Business.

‍Adele is the perfect person with whom to discuss relating to customers and creating meaningful buyer personas.

Listen in for our insightful conversation and Adele’s step-by-step methodology to better understand your customers and improve your sales.

Topics covered:

• Why big data isn’t enough to understand people
• Step-by-step customer research methods
• How to effectively interview buyers
• The 5 Rings of Buying Insight
• Creating a buyer persona

Resources mentioned:

• Buyer Persona Institute
• Example
• How to Gain Insight into Your Customer’s Expectations, Align your Marketing Strategies, and Win More Business by Adele Revella
• Adele on Twitter @buyerpersona
• Adele on LinkedIn
• Buyer Persona Institute on LinkedIn
• How to Influence Buying Decisions Without Being Shady
• Buyer Personas Need to Die a Violent Death
• How to Convince People to Buy (Without Being Pushy)

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

It’s time to get customer-obsessed. Katelyn Bourgoin, the three-times founder, turned growth geek joins the podcast to explain the importance of using customer research to figure out what triggers customers to buy.

We discuss the processes Katelyn uses to help companies understand what their customers are trying to achieve, and what barriers are stopping them from achieving it, so they can design better products market them more effectively.

Topics covered:

• Why it’s important to understand what triggers your customers
• The reasons why some marketers may be feeling overwhelmed
• Social Media’s draining effect on Katelyn
• The first question Katelyn asks her new clients when starting customer research
• How the startup world taught Katelyn the importance of customer discovery
• The steps it takes to develop your customer’s persona
• Why understanding your customer is more than gathering demographic and firmographic information
• How to disrupt the Super Mario power upmarket
• Don’t forget about the importance of the functional side of your product
• Identify your customer’s challenges with their current solution
• Katelyn’s thoughts on one-on-one customer interviews
• One of Katelyn’s favorite sayings when conducting interviews
• How to make sense of the customer information you’ve gathered

Resources mentioned:

• Katelyn’s Website
• Katelyn on Twitter
• What is a martech stack?
• Strategyzer
• Cerner
• Basecamp
• Wrike
• Hotjar
• Katelyn’s Forget the Funnel Webinar
• Dovetail App
• Airtable
• Katelyn’s Research Template
• Atomic Habits - James Clear
• CXL Blog
• Buyer Personas Need to Die a Violent Death
• Buying Triggers: 6 Steps to Create Explosive Demand

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔

I've just launched a new YouTube channel!! The concept? I take real businesses struggling to stand the f*ck out, provide my positioning/branding/lead gen help, and record it all for YouTube. The first mini-series features three freelance marketers (copywriter Rob, ecommerce designer Laura, and non-fiction book coach Vicky).

I hope you'll set aside half an hour to watch it through. Maybe with your morning coffee? Or lunch break? Or evening onion soup? And then, the usual "Subscribe, Like, Share" would go a long, long way too.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q

***

How to use Jobs to be done.

On today’s episode I’m joined by my guest Claire Suellentrop, a messaging and conversion expert at Loveyourcustomers.co.

Claire is also a published author and the former Director of Marketing for Calendly. In this episode she will introduce us to the “Jobs to be done” methodology that is replacing the old method of creating customer personas.

Listen in for a step-by-step practical guide on this method, why you should be using it, and how you can implement it in your business.

Topics covered:

• Claire’s role at Calendly and transition into consulting
• How to use jobs to be done to ready your customers' minds
• The “Jobs to be done” approach to marketing
• Identifying your power customers and making a profile
• Tips for interviewing customers and getting valuable insight
• Introducing new methods to your company successfully
• Case studies and recommended resources on the “Jobs to be done” methodology

Resources mentioned:

• Why the Jobs-to-be-Done Framework Creates Better Products: Alan Klement
• Websites that Convert: The fundamentals of writing compelling website copy by Claire Suellentrop
• Loveyourcustomers.co
• Claire’s talk from the Unbounce’s Call to Action Conference
• Rev.com and Speechpad.com - Transcription services
• Matt Hodges on Marketing the Job to be Done via Intercom
• When Coffee & Kale Compete by Alan Klement
• https://jtbd.info/ Blog by Alan Klement
• Bikeshedding in Marketing: 3 Keys to Being an Effective Marketer

***

→ Buy my book: book.stfo.io
→ Watch my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdNXaHHVnVntg5gpveB-5_Q
→ Take my 60-second quiz: stfo.io/q
→ See my pretty face on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisgrenier/
→ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3p4wL4r
→ Leave a review on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7iEF1qovZZiaP1iRtxGARo

🐔