Fred Bahnson is a writer, essayist, and ordained minister whose work explores the intersection of faith, nature, and community. In this profound and far-ranging conversation, Fred and Andrew discuss the adventurous spirit of Thomas Merton, wrestling with the notion of original sin, and finding an “embodied experience” of faith rooted in the natural world. Fred shares how his work—from his book Soil and Sacrament to his recent films and essays for Emergence Magazine—is an effort to present a vision of Christian faith that challenges common stereotypes, focusing instead on the larger story of what God is doing and how we live as people of faith.

Thought-Provoking Quotes: 

“[Thomas Merton] had this real adventuresome spirit that I really resonate with. And that’s very much how I conceive of my own faith journey, is it’s this unfolding adventure.” - Fred Bahnson

“So much of what you’re wrestling with are things that I’m wrestling with. Even deep, theological ideas of, What is your faith?” - Andrew Osenga

“The theology that I grew up with, at least as I received it, was all about original sin and sort of, ‘You are stained to the core. You are rotten to the core of your being.’ And it never really resonated, it just didn’t ring true to me. I knew I was sinful, but I kept thinking, If we’re created in the image of God, how can that be true that we’re also rotten to the core?” - Fred Bahnson

“I think [boarding school] was where I had an early imitation of God’s presence, that sense of, Okay, I’m on my own. I had to learn how to become self-sufficient and a lot of that was learning to pray, just kind of crying out in pain to God and feeling the love come back at me.” - Fred Bahnson

“I didn’t have this ‘calling’ to be a pastor, it was more just wanting to understand this faith that had shaped me and that I sort of couldn’t get away from.” - Fred Bahnson

“I learned about other faith communities who were starting farms and growing their own food and reconnecting with the land, but in a very faith-focused way. And I was really fascinated by that whole growing movement.” - Fred Bahnson

“This is where language doesn’t really get at our experience. I’ve sought all my life to get beyond the isms and get to the pure drop, the direct experience. That’s a lot of what I do as a writer, just place the reader there with me in the moment. To me, that is so much more powerful than ideas or argument or diatribe.” - Fred Bahnson 

“We’re nature looking back at itself. The environment is constantly moving in and out of us. We are nature and there’s no dividing line.” - Fred Bahnson

“The faith I’m drawn to is very much an embodied experience. You’re doing things, you’re smelling things, you’re watching and hearing and all of your senses are engaged. I think that’s the faith we need if we’re going to have any chance of surviving.” - Fred Bahnson

“It’s a writerly urge to use your own story as a window through which the reader can look onto some larger vista behind. Ultimately, you want to be the clear pane of glass that the reader looks through. You’re not. You’re not the final destination of the reader’s gaze. If at the end of the day, the story is just about what happened to Fred Bahnson, then I failed. It’s about the larger story you’re trying to tell.” - Fred Bahnson 

“I want to present a vision of the faith that maybe challenges some stereotypes of what a Christian is. For me, that larger story is almost always about what God is doing in our lives and how we live as people of faith.” - Fred Bahnson 

Links, Products, and Resources Mentioned:

Thomas Merton

“On the Road with Thomas Merton” by Fred Bahnson, film by Jeremy Siefert

Wilbur Awards

The Live You Save May Be Your Own by Paul Elie

The Seven Storey Mountain by Thomas Merton

Boris Pasternak

James Baldwin 

Monastery of Christ in the Desert 

Redwoods Monastery 

Annie Dillard

City Lights Bookstore (San Francisco)

Laurence Ferlinghetti

Emergence Magazine 

Jeremy Siefert

Montana State University 

Duke Divinity School 

Wendell Berry 

Sex, Economy, Freedom, and Community by Wendell Berry

Soil and Sacrament by Fred Bahnson

Anathoth Community Garden (North Carolina) 

Orion Magazine 

Michael Pollan

W.K. Kellogg Foundation 

Wake Forest University School of Divinity

Hannah Coulter by Wendell Berry

Jayber Crow by Wendell Berry

Barry Lopez

The Wisdom of the Desert by Thomas Merton 

The Art of Prayer: An Orthodox Anthology compiled by Igumen Chariton of Valamo 

“Guardians of Memory” by Fred Bahnson (Harper’s Magazine) 

The Forest Beyond film by Jeremy Siefert and Fred Bahnson

The Church Forests of Ethiopia film by Jeremy Siefert 

Thoughts In Solitude by Thomas Merton 

Seeds of Contemplation by Thomas Merton 

*Watch this interview on Andrew’s YouTube channel!  

*All episode music is by Andrew Osenga. 

Guest’s Links: 

Fred Bahnson’s website

Connect with Andrew: 

Website

YouTube

Substack

Spotify

Facebook

Instagram

How to Remember by Andrew Osenga

Hold the Light by Andrew Osenga

*The Pivot is produced in conjunction with Four Eyes Media.