This episode features a portion of a live stream discussion that took place in Zion Lab, where we explored the dynamics of delegation within bishoprics and youth leadership. Zion Lab is a welcoming space to discuss what you’re learning in your calling, share best practices and helpful resources, connect with others, and strengthen your ministry. Everyone is invited. Whether you’re new to your calling or have years of experience, your insights and questions are welcome.

A key theme of the conversation is the unspoken pressure that bishops feel as the figureheads of their wards. We address the anxiety that arises when programs falter or activities do not meet expectations, and how this can lead to a reluctance to delegate responsibilities. The discussion emphasizes the importance of setting clear expectations when extending callings, ensuring that leaders understand not just their tasks but also the vision behind their roles.

Listeners will hear insights from various participants who share their experiences and strategies for effective delegation. We also touch on the broader responsibilities of bishops beyond youth leadership, including the importance of collaboration with elders quorum and Relief Society presidents. The conversation reveals how effective delegation can alleviate the burden on bishops and enhance the overall functioning of the ward. We encourage bishops to give themselves grace, acknowledging that they cannot do everything and that the Lord will take care of His children.

00:02:18 – Delegation in Leadership

00:03:25 – Setting Expectations for Callings

00:04:46 – Meeting People Where They Are

00:06:33 – Focusing on the Rising Generation

00:07:50 – Delegating to Elders Quorum and Relief Society

00:09:59 – Prioritizing Youth Responsibilities

00:10:30 – Understanding Repentance

00:12:39 – Positive Reinforcement in Leadership

00:13:25 – Parental Involvement in Teaching

00:15:32 – Training Parents to Teach

00:17:27 – Bishop’s Fireside Discussions

00:19:57 – Youth Leading Discussions

00:21:07 – Encouragement for Overwhelmed Bishops

00:27:03 – The Lord’s Church and Grace

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Benjamin Hardy, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Skylar Haws has dedicated over a decade to serving youth in various church callings, including Young Men’s President and Priest Quorum Advisor. He has also taught early morning seminary and worked as a youth Sunday School teacher. Skylar’s passion for youth leadership stems from his own experiences and a desire to help young men grow spiritually and personally. He resides in Saratoga Springs with his family, where he balances his church responsibilities with work and family life.

Skylar emphasizes the importance of meeting young men where they are. He discusses the value of building relationships and creating meaningful experiences through high adventure activities. Skylar highlights the significance of pushing youth to embrace challenges while connecting their experiences back to Christ. He also addresses the dynamics of planning activities, engaging parents, and fostering a supportive environment for all young men, regardless of their individual circumstances.

04:00 – Skylar’s Background in Youth Leadership

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Benjamin Hardy, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Listen in to this livestream conversation from the Leading Saints Zion Lab, and help build a stronger Sunday School community! Zion Lab is a welcoming space to discuss what you’re learning in your calling, share best practices and helpful resources, and connect with other presidencies and strengthen your ministry. Everyone is invited. Whether you’re new to your calling or have years of experience, your insights and questions are welcome.

This conversation comes from a recent Zion Lab community livestream focused on Sunday School presidencies. This informal gathering allowed participants to share their experiences, best practices, and challenges related to their callings. We discussed the purpose of Sunday School, the dynamics of teaching council meetings, and how to effectively engage parents and teachers in the learning process. We also explored the challenges of organizing teacher council meetings, with participants sharing their successes and struggles in getting attendance and fostering meaningful discussions.

Join the Leading Saints community at LeadingSaints.org/Zion for the full, unedited conversation and to continue engaging in these important discussions. We recognize that leadership in the Church can be isolating, but through collaboration and shared experiences, we can uplift and support one another in our callings. Join us as we explore these vital topics and work together to enhance our leadership skills and strengthen our communities.

00:04:46 – Joshua’s Experience as Bishop

00:05:59 – Martha’s Transformation as a Teacher

00:06:40 – Chris’s Missionary Work and Goals

00:08:48 – Teacher Council Meetings Discussion

00:10:51 – DJ’s Insights on Teacher Councils

00:12:56 – Brent’s Perspective on Sunday School

00:16:21 – Jeff’s Experience with Parent Councils

00:19:25 – Matt’s Thoughts on Transitioning Teaching

00:23:16 – Brent’s Approach to Teaching Nuggets

00:26:20 – DJ’s Success with Parent Councils

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Benjamin Hardy, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Allison Schreiber is entering her seventh year as an early morning seminary teacher in New Braunfels, Texas—an experience she describes as one of the most joyful and spiritually-rich callings of her life. Fluent in German and Russian, Allison served in the Russia Moscow Mission before earning a bachelor of Fine Arts in Interior Design from Brigham Young University, along with certification in International Color Consulting. Her dedication to sacred spaces led her to intern with the Temple Construction department, contributing to the designing of temples in Houston, Boston, and Nauvoo.

A born leader and meticulous planner, Allison has worn many hats across decades of youth and community service, serving extensively in the Young Women organization. She’s chaired committees, organized record-breaking Boy Scouts of America district events, and served on BSA Woodbadge staff for three consecutive years after completing the prestigious leadership training herself. Whether designing a youth conference or directing a camporee, Allison brings creativity, discipline, and a touch of grace to every detail.

In her seminary classroom, Allison blends her vast experience with a personal mission: to make early morning Seminary not just bearable but transformational. Through intentional leadership moments and peer-supported learning, she cultivates a classroom culture where students feel empowered to plan, lead, and strengthen one another in faith.

Allison shares effective teaching strategies and principles that can enhance youth engagement in a seminary setting. She shares proven methods to encourage participation and create a lively learning environment. The conversation highlights the importance of making gospel connections and how thoughtful planning can help youth see the relevance of gospel teachings in their everyday lives.

Allison shares her approach to teaching, emphasizing the need to mix up learning methods to keep students engaged. She discusses the use of games, interactive activities, and creative resources, such as movie clips, to make lessons more relatable and exciting. She also touches on the significance of recognizing each student’s voice and ensuring that everyone feels valued and included in the class.

Allison introduces the “EDGE” method—Explain, Demonstrate, Guide, and Enable—as a framework for teaching leadership skills to youth. She explains how this method empowers students to take charge of their learning and prepares them for future leadership roles. Allison shares practical examples of how she sets her students up for success, including organizing activities that foster teamwork and collaboration. She emphasizes the importance of loving and supporting youth, encouraging leaders to create an environment where students feel safe and motivated to participate.

03:15 – Allison’s Background and Experience

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Benjamin Hardy, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

This is a follow-up conversation. Listen to the first episode here.

Jeff Strong worked nearly 30 years in the consumer products industry as a senior executive at Procter & Gamble and global president and chief customer officer at Johnson & Johnson. He then taught in the Marriott School of Business at Brigham Young University and worked as an advisor to the Church before serving as a mission leader in the Arkansas Bentonville Mission. Jeff has since spent several years doing research on why people are leaving the Church. While not a professional researcher, his career involved a large amount of research and the research he shares in this podcast was done with the help of some of the top Latter-day Saint researchers in the world. Today, Jeff lives in Midway, Utah, and stays busy with a little lavender farm, some business consulting, and enjoying family.

Jeff Strong dives deeper into the complexities of faith and community. He explores the idea that while many church leaders may come from a similar mindset, the diversity of perspectives within the congregation is essential for a healthy community.

Jeff shares insights from a comprehensive study on disaffiliation and church experiences, highlighting the strengths and weaknesses of the church culture. He notes that while many members appreciate the community, service, and spiritual growth offered by the church, there are significant concerns about judgment, conformity, and exclusivity that can alienate individuals with differing beliefs or backgrounds.

Jeff and Kurt talk about the tension caused by differences, and Jeff illustrates how the natural human response to perceived threats often leads to conformity and exclusion. He discusses the importance of yielding to the Holy Spirit to navigate these tensions, rather than allowing fear to dictate responses.

A key part of the episode is the introduction of a segmentation model that categorizes Latter-day Saints into six belief mindsets: Seekers, Cultivators, Protectors, Avoiders, Connectors, and Explorers. Each segment is defined by its unique values and priorities, with Protectors making up a significant portion of church leadership. Jeff and Kurt discuss the implications of this model, emphasizing that a church comprised solely of one segment would lack the richness and diversity necessary for a thriving community.

Understanding these different mindsets can help church leaders foster a more inclusive environment that accommodates a broader range of beliefs and experiences. Jeff encourages listeners to embrace the complexities of faith and community, recognizing that the presence of tension can lead to growth and deeper understanding.

00:02:00 – Discussion on disaffiliation from the church

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Benjamin Hardy, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

James Fletcher is the founder and chief investment officer of Ethos Investment Management, and has been investing professionally in emerging markets for 20 years. He is also the founder of the global non-profit Young Investors Society, which provides lessons to teens on investing and financial literacy in over 3,000 high schools and 80 countries around the world. James has a bachelor’s degree in Finance from Brigham Young University and also teaches as a BYU adjunct professor in Finance. He has lived in a variety of places, from Boston to Brazil and Los Angeles to Hong Kong, and currently lives in Springville, Utah, with his wife and five children, where he serves as a bishop in the Hobble Creek Springville Utah Stake.

James Fletcher shares his insights and experiences as a bishop and youth leader. He shares his approach to engaging with youth, highlighting the advice he received to focus on them while allowing other leaders to manage adult responsibilities. He discusses his passion for working with young people, which has been shaped by his background in youth mentorship and his founding of the Young Investor Society, an organization that teaches financial literacy and investment principles to high school students.

James emphasizes the importance of setting high expectations for youth while providing the necessary support and mentorship. He also discusses the significance of creating engaging and interactive experiences for youth, rather than simply delivering lessons. He shares how challenging youth with high expectations can lead to remarkable growth and engagement, citing examples from both his church leadership and his work with the Young Investor Society.

00:04:04 – First Impressions of Being a Bishop

00:05:16 – Unique Ward Dynamics

00:06:57 – Approach to Engaging Youth

00:07:54 – Background in Youth Engagement

00:09:37 – Weekly Engagement with Youth

00:11:06 – Measuring Success as a Bishop

00:12:00 – Personal Story of Mentorship

00:14:23 – Principles for Working with Youth

00:18:47 – Interactive Learning Experiences

00:21:10 – High Expectations and Support

00:23:01 – Recognizing and Nurturing Gifts

00:30:54 – Real Love and Genuine Support

00:36:21 – Young Investor Society Overview

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Benjamin Hardy, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Dr. Benjamin Hardy is an organizational psychologist, author, and speaker known for his work on the psychology of exponential growth and transformation. He has mastered a highly unique form of strategic psychology and is known for his ability to rapidly scale companies to seemingly impossible levels. The author of several books and cofounder of his rigorous scaling company, Scaling.com, Benjamin helps companies scale 10x or more within three years. His innovative psychological and strategic frameworks are unlike anything else in business right now and are seeking to disrupt both the fields of psychology and business. Benjamin and his wife Lauren have seven children and live in Orlando.

Benjamin introduces the idea that setting ambitious goals can lead to more effective pathways for growth. He explains that when organizations aim for significantly higher targets—such as a tenfold increase in growth—they are compelled to streamline their efforts and eliminate unnecessary complexities. This principle is particularly relevant for church leaders who may feel constrained by traditional metrics of success.

Benjamin emphasizes the importance of aligning daily actions with a higher purpose. He discusses the concept of “raising the floor,” which refers to the necessity of letting go of lower standards and practices that no longer serve the organization’s goals. By doing so, leaders can create a more focused and effective environment for achieving their objectives.

The conversation also delves into the psychological aspects of goal-setting, highlighting how the future should shape present actions rather than being dictated by past performance. He shares a compelling story about an audacious missionary baptism goal and how adjusting adjusting and filtering ultimately achieved the goal—illustrating the power of high aspirations and the need for leaders to be willing to say no to less-impactful activities.

Benjamin explores the challenges church leaders face in maintaining focus amidst competing priorities and discusses the tendency to add more initiatives rather than simplifying and prioritizing efforts. He encourages leaders to define clear, measurable goals that can guide their actions and decision-making processes, along with a call to embrace ambitious goals. By focusing on fewer, higher goals and raising their standards, leaders can unlock the potential within their wards and organizations, ultimately leading to greater success in their missions.

00:04:00 – Applying Scaling Principles to the Church

00:05:20 – The Goal Shapes the Path and System

00:05:50 – The Power of 10x Goals and Short Timelines

00:08:40 – Missionary Work as an Example of Scaling

00:10:50 – The Past and Future as Lenses for the Present

00:14:10 – Operating From the Goal, Not Toward It

00:14:40 – Raising the Floor and Saying No

00:15:30 – Blake’s Missionary Experience and Filtering

00:19:40 – Overcoming the Influence of the Past in Organizations

00:21:50 – Simplicity vs. Complexity

00:23:10 – The Challenge of Too Many Goals in Church Councils

00:24:50 – Focusing on Key Priorities in Leadership

00:28:00 – Defining and Owning Roles in Church Leadership

00:28:50 – Understanding and Raising the Floor

00:31:30 – The Floor as a Standard of Accountability

00:33:30 – Avoiding Guilt from Too Many To-Dos

00:36:10 – Setting Clear, Numeric Goals

00:40:20 – The Future Shapes the Present

00:42:50 – Repentance and Reorienting Towards the Future

00:44:50 – Distancing from Past Self and Growth Mindset

00:48:50 – Measuring Impact and Qualitative vs. Quantitative Goals

00:53:00 – Accountability in Systems and Leadership

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

This is a rebroadcast. The episode originally aired in March 2021.

Clint Pulver is an Emmy Award-winning, motivational keynote speaker, author, musician, and workforce expert. The president and founder of The Center for Employee Retention, Clint has transformed how corporations create lasting loyalty through his work and research as “The Undercover Millennial”. His book I Love It Here shares how extraordinary leaders create companies their people never want to leave, and in this interview he helps translate some of that wisdom into local leadership in the Church. Clint is currently serving as a bishop.

I Love It Here: How Great Leaders Create Organizations Their People Never Want to Leave

4:40 Writing a book with lots of research was a difficult project

24:15 Do you have the right people in the right places?

31:10 Status interviews and the power of meeting regularly

40:00 Core values and a vision: keep it simple and memorable

47:35 Story of the business leader who was open and vulnerable, leading to a sense of ownership for her employees

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

Monica Tanner is an RLT-trained relationship coach and host of the “Secrets of Happily Ever After” podcast. She transforms marriages with simple communication, connection, conflict resolution, and commitment strategies. Her mission is to lower the divorce rate and improve marital satisfaction. Through her podcast, social media community, couple’s coaching practice, and new book—Bad Marriage Advice, Monica has helped thousands of couples ditch resentment and roommate syndrome and get back to living their happily-ever-after love story. In the Church, Monica serves in the Young Women program with two of her daughters.

Monica shares insights on the importance of communication in marriage, noting that many couples express a need for help in this area. They discuss the dynamics of relationships, emphasizing that both partners must actively engage in the marriage to foster a healthy connection. The episode also touches on the stigma surrounding seeking help for marital issues within the Latter-day Saint community, where some may feel that divorce is not an option, leading to feelings of entrapment.

Monica explores common misconceptions about marriage, such as the idea that “happy couples never fight.” They argue that conflict is a natural part of any relationship and that learning to navigate disagreements is crucial for growth. The discussion also addresses the problematic advice of “never go to bed angry,” suggesting that sometimes it is healthier to take a break and revisit issues with a fresh perspective.

Throughout the episode, the importance of choice in marriage is emphasized. Monica encourages couples to view their relationship as a partnership where both individuals actively choose to be together, rather than feeling obligated due to covenants or societal expectations. They advocate for open communication and the necessity of seeking help when needed, highlighting that doing so is a sign of strength and commitment.

00:03:19 – Common Marriage Struggles

00:04:54 – The Empty Nest Phenomenon

00:06:27 – Advice for Struggling Couples

00:08:34 – Unique Aspects of Latter-day Saint Marriages

00:10:55 – The Concept of Choice in Marriage

00:12:22 – Agency and Choice in Relationships

00:14:27 – The Importance of Communication

00:16:12 – Navigating Divorce Conversations

00:18:10 – Infidelity and Marriage Recovery

00:20:22 – The Role of Church Leaders

00:22:25 – Community Support in Marriage

00:24:35 – The Reality of Marriage Dynamics

00:26:16 – The Atonement and Marriage

00:28:10 – The Importance of Seeking Help

00:30:19 – Debunking the Myth of Fighting

00:33:02 – Relationship Math in Marriage

00:35:02 – The Myth of Never Going to Bed Angry

00:39:18 – Contracting for Better Communication

00:41:11 – Final Thoughts on Marriage Advice

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.

This is a rebroadcast. The episode originally ran in September 2019.

Frank Layden was a beloved basketball coach and executive best known for his time with the Utah Jazz. While he achieved tremendous professional success—earning NBA Coach of the Year, Executive of the Year, and the J. Walter Kennedy Citizenship Award all in 1984—it was his warmth, humor, and larger-than-life personality that truly defined him. Known for his self-deprecating wit and quick one-liners, Layden brought levity to the game and was deeply respected by players, colleagues, and fans alike.

Beyond basketball, Layden was cherished for his kindness, community involvement, and ability to connect with people on a personal level. He had a gift for making others feel valued, often using laughter to lift those around him. Even in retirement, he remained a vibrant part of the Salt Lake City community. Frank Layden passed away on July 9, 2025, at the age of 93, leaving behind a legacy of leadership and compassion.

Early Experiences & Utah Transition

Personal and Professional Philosophy

Leadership & Team Management

Relationship-Building & Daily Culture

Reflection on Faith & Community

00:53:04 Takeaways and Leadership Principles

The award-winning Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at LeadingSaints.org.

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Elder Alvin F. Meredith III, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Kirby Heyborne, Taysom Hill, Coaches Jennifer Rockwood and Brandon Doman, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 800 episodes.

Discover podcasts, articles, virtual conferences, and live events related to callings such as the bishopric, Relief Society, elders quorum, Primary, youth leadership, stake leadership, ward mission, ward council, young adults, ministering, and teaching.