Charlie's work is driven by a mission to promote honest communication, responsible leadership, and greater accountability in business.

In this episode, Katie and Malin dig into the mechanics of trust, the cost of what you don't say, and why sustainability comms might be the most powerful trust-building tool a business has, if only more of them were brave enough to use it.

In this episode, we cover:

If trust is built by consistently doing what you say you'll do and evidencing it over time, then sustainability comms isn't a risk to be managed; it's the infrastructure through which trust gets built.

More from Charlie:

The Anti-Greenwash Charter

truMRK

Connect with Charlie on LinkedIn

Resources mentioned:

Asket Impact Report

Strategic Sustainability by John Pabon

The Responsible Edge Podcast

The CMA Green Claims Code

Naked Paper

Patagonia

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

One of seven original designers at WeWork who helped create the coworking product that transformed the industry, Dean went on to lead design teams across New York, London, Shanghai and Tokyo, delivering more than 3 million square feet of workspace. That front-row seat to commercial real estate's endemic waste problem sent him in a new direction: in 2024, he completed the Circular Economy Masterclass at the University of Exeter Business School and launched his 'Circular by Design' furniture collection — a direct challenge to the throwaway culture he'd watched up close for two decades.

But it's not the furniture that brings Dean to Spill the Green Tea. It's something he said on a panel at the Surface Design Show earlier this year that stopped Katie in their tracks: environmentalism needs a new narrative. In this episode, they dig into exactly what that means and what it looks like in practice.

In this episode, we cover:

None of us can save the planet single-handedly but if we each play our part within our sphere of influence, that adds up to something far greater than all of us spreading ourselves too thin.

Resources mentioned:

Sophie's World by Jostein Gaarder 

Emotionally Durable Design: Objects, Experiences and Empathy by Jonathan Chapman

Black and British: A Forgotten History by David Olusoga

Emergent Strategy by Adrienne Maree Brown

AI News & Strategy Daily with Nate B. Jones

Work in Progress by Dean Connell 

The Ellen MacArthur Foundation Butterfly Diagram

More from Dean

Website: https://iamdc.co/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iamdeanconnell

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

With expertise rooted in sustainable design and innovation, Caroline is a former founder and director of the Material Futures postgraduate course at Central Saint Martins. She is co-author of Radical Matter: Rethinking Materials for a Sustainable Future (Thames & Hudson) and guest curator of Our Time on Earth, which opened at the Barbican in 2022 and continues to tour globally.

In this episode, we cover:

This conversation is ultimately about what happens when the courage to speak gets mistaken for the risk and why staying silent has consequences that run far deeper than staying safe.

More from Caroline:

Website: https://tiltfutures.co/

IG: https://www.instagram.com/tilt_futures/

LI: https://www.linkedin.com/company/tiltfutures/ & https://www.linkedin.com/in/caroline-till-b701626/

Resources mentioned:

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

Rob's two most recent books, From What Is to What If and How to Fall in Love with the Future, have made him one of the most distinctive voices in the climate space, not for telling people how bad things are, but for insisting that giving people something to long for is the most radical thing any of us can do. 

In this episode, we cover:

What emerges from this conversation is both a provocation and an invitation. The future as we currently envision it is dark and scary and we need to create a sense of longing or what Rob calls “memories of the future” for a more positive outcome to give people something to move towards rather than run away from. 

More from Rob

Website: https://www.robhopkins.net/

Podcast: https://www.robhopkins.net/podcast/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/yoodooright1968

Resources mentioned: 

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

Inspired by an article by Solitaire Townsend, they explore why so many businesses are falling short, why both greenwashing and greenhushing are the wrong response, and what brave, honest communication could look like instead.

In this episode, we cover:

The episode is equal parts reality check and rallying cry because talking honestly about imperfect progress isn't a comms risk, it's the most credible thing a brand can do right now.

Resources mentioned:

How to Dodge the Imminent Net Zero Mass Failure by Solitaire Townsend, Chief Solutionist at Futera 

Accenture analysis (November 2024) the fourth annual Destination Net Zero report, provides a clear-eyed, empirical assessment of where the world’s largest companies stand on their decarbonization journeys 

The Power of TED* (*The Empowerment Dynamic) by David Emerald — on moving from the drama triangle (victim/rescuer/persecutor) to empowered communicator, challenger and coach (this is an affiliate link)

The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen Covey — specifically the circles of control, influence and concern (this is an affiliate link)

Eden, by Tim Smit (this is an affiliate link)

The Carbon Literacy Project

The Anti-Greenwash Charter

1% for the Planet

Brand examples: Ace & Tate, Patagonia, Tony's Chocolonely, Fairphone

You can access the full episode transcript here

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

In this Episode of Spill the (Green) Tea, Katie and Malin speak about how to communicate sustainability clearly, credibly, and without getting called out sharing their two different (but surprisingly aligned) 3Cs frameworks for navigating climate communications. Together, they unpack what it really takes to build trust, avoid greenwashing, and bring audiences with you on the journey, not just at the finish line.

In this episode, we cover:

This episode is a practical deep dive into what responsible sustainability communication actually looks like and how it’s rooted in clarity, action, and honesty.

Resources mentioned:

You can access the full episode transcript here

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

In this episode, Katie & Malin speak with Sangeeta Waldron, an author and award-winning communications specialist who helps organisations navigate the intersection of purpose, influence, and responsibility with a particular focus on climate change and decision-making under uncertainty.

Sangeeta is the founder of Serendipity PR & Media, a Climate Reality Leader trained by Al Gore, and the global contributing editor for the India CSR Network. She has advised senior government officials and some of the world’s most influential organisations on ethical, effective, and culturally intelligent communication, and is a regular guest lecturer at UK universities.

She is the author of three books, including What Will Your Legacy Be?, which was presented at Davos 2025, and Corporate Social Responsibility Is Not Public Relations, shortlisted for the UK Business Book Awards in 2022. As a keynote speaker and moderator, Sangeeta is known for bringing warmth, clarity, and deeply practical insight to complex conversations.

In this episode, we cover:

This episode is a candid, hopeful conversation about how honesty, storytelling, and imperfect action can rebuild trust and move sustainability forward without fear or false perfection.

More from Sangeeta

Website: http://www.serendipitypr.co.uk/

LinkedIn: @sangeetawaldron

Instagram: @sangeeta.waldron

Book: What will your legacy be? & Corporate Social Responsibility is Not Public Relations

Resources mentioned:

What’s Your Dream by Simon Squibb

Podcast: The Rest is Politics with Alastair Campbell and Rory Stewart

Project Drawdown®

You can access the full episode transcript here

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

In this episode, Katie and Malin explore the growing tension between greenwashing and greenhushing, starting with clear definitions of both and why the distinction matters. They introduce Planet Tracker’s Greenwashing Hydra as a useful framework for understanding the different ways misleading environmental claims show up, and explain why greenwashing, while problematic, is at least visible and open to challenge, whereas greenhushing removes information altogether and reduces accountability. 

The conversation looks at how increased scrutiny, regulation and confusion around the Green Claims Code have led many organisations to retreat into silence, even when they are making genuine progress.

They also unpack the wider forces driving greenhushing, from perfectionism and fear of getting it wrong to political pressure, economic uncertainty and the complexity of sustainability data. Katie and Malin discuss why silence slows collective progress, weakens transparency and can lead to fear-based decision making within organisations. At the same time, they highlight the opportunity for “brave brands” to stand out through honest communication, build trust and loyalty, and strengthen relationships with customers, partners, investors and employees. 

The episode sets the tone for this new series, that imperfect but transparent communication is far more valuable than saying nothing at all and is essential for moving towards a regenerative economy.

In this episode, we cover:

Resources mentioned:

Planet Trackers The Greenwashing Hydra

Competitions and Markets Authority, the government body behind the Green Claims Code

Skills for Planet - Design Council

Texas Tribune: Texas bans local, state government entities from doing business with firms that “boycott” fossil fuels

Globally representative evidence on the actual and perceived support for climate action

LinkedIn Green Skills Report

Blue Rock Search report

The Edelman Trust Barometer 2025

InComms article - ‘Why do so many comms chiefs have sustainability in their portfolio?

You can access the full episode transcript here

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

Making Design Circular is evolving.

With a new name, a new remit, and a new co-host, this next chapter is all about one of the most urgent conversations in business today: how to talk about sustainability with honesty, nuance, and confidence.

Katie Treggiden is joined by Malin Cunningham, founder of B Corp-certified B2B thought leadership consultancy Hattrick, to launch Spill the Green Tea – a podcast exploring how brands can communicate their environmental efforts without tipping into greenwashing… or disappearing into greenhushing.

In a world saturated with content, polished claims, and call-outs, the real differentiator is authenticity. Together, Katie and Malin unpack how to share imperfect eco-efforts with clarity and credibility, so your sustainability story builds trust instead of backlash.

Expect thoughtful conversations, practical insights, and honest reflections on what it really takes to speak up responsibly in today’s climate-aware marketplace.

If you care about communicating sustainability in a way that stands up to scrutiny and still stands out, subscribe now and be the first to tune in to Spill the Green Tea

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

More from Katie

• Green, Not Greenwashed: Get the clarity and confidence you need to talk about your eco-efforts without the fear of greenwashing.
• Follow Katie on Instagram @katietreggiden.1

More from Malin

• Greenwashing 101: Green or Greenwashed? Essential insights for sales and marketing professionals to make sense of sustainability and avoid falling into greenwashing's trap.
• Follow Malin on LinkedIn @malin-cunningham

PS Looking for Brackish? That has a new home at https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/podcast

In this episode, Katie speaks with Bernadette Russell, a storyteller, author and passionate tree planter whose work invites us to pay closer attention to the quiet magic of everyday life. Bernadette weaves together stories, community action and environmental care into a body of work that is both deeply hopeful and fiercely grounded.

“Hope isn’t passive – it requires action. It’s a practice.” - Bernadette Russell

We cover:

- What inspired her to do a daily act of kindness for 366 days – and how it changed everything

- The role of hope in dark times, and how it coexists with grief, rage and despair

- Why kindness is more powerful than we think – and often quietly everywhere

- Stories from her tree planting, storytelling, and community projects

- The media response to the 2011 London riots – and why it fuelled her mission

- The difference between performative and meaningful action – and why small matters

- The tension between anger and hope, and how we hold both

- What it means to notice goodness, and how it can change how we feel in the world

“It provided me with an opportunity to look at the same garden, but from a different window.” - Bernadette Russell

This conversation is a gentle, powerful reminder that hope doesn’t require perfect circumstances, and kindness doesn’t need to be grand to be meaningful.

More from Bernadette:

Website: www.bernadetterussell.com

Instagram: @bernadetterussell

Books: Conversations of Kindness & How to Be Hopeful (these are affiliate links)

More from Katie:

Instagram: @katietreggiden.1

Website: https://katietreggiden.com/

Nature-inspired poetry: https://brackishbykatietreggiden.substack.com/t/poetry

Resources mentioned:

BBC Ideas Documentary on 366 Days of Kindness

Trees for Cities and Street Trees for Living

The Spiritual Poems of Rumi (this is an affiliate link)

Check out my full Bookshop.org podcast reading list to find links to all the books mentioned throughout Season 6 of Brackish.

What next?

If all this talk of defiant hope has got you wondering where you can find some, I have something for you. Cultivating Hope is my three-part mini-course and it’s the three steps I move through whenever I start to feel despair tugging at my edges.

You will move out of ‘fight, flight or freeze’ mode and into a calm and connected state, reconnect with nature, and find aligned actions that you can take now to keep you to remind you that you can make a difference.

In the current climate, hope is an act of defiance, and it’s one I hope you’ll take with me.

Click here to find out more here