What does it take to keep hoping when hope keeps breaking your heart? Tami Simon speaks with Marisa Renée Lee—New York Times bestselling author of Grief Is Love and Waiting for Dawn: Living with Uncertainty—about what she calls a "ruthless, stubborn commitment to hope": the conviction that something better is coming, and the willingness to do whatever is necessary to make it so, even in the darkest seasons.

This conversation offers genuine transmission—not just concepts about awakening, but the palpable presence of realized teachers exploring the growing edge of spiritual understanding together. Originally aired on Sounds True One.

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