This week’s Talkhouse episode is particularly exciting for me, since my two guests are also two of my favorite songwriters and singers ever—and they happen to be big fans of each other. It’s Matt Berninger and Eric Bachmann.

Eric Bachmann was a massive part of the ‘90s indie-rock explosion as the snarling voice behind Archers of Loaf, a band that released four incredible albums in its relatively short run. But Bachmann ditched most of that genre’s signifiers afterward and has spent the last quarter-century writing and recording incredible songs both under the name Crooked Fingers and under his own. His records are more in line with Tom Waits or Townes van Zandt than Pavement, and his deep catalog is worth a deep dive. You could start pretty much anywhere, so it might as well be with the brand new Crooked Fingers album Swet Deth. It’s the first time Bachmann has dusted off the Crooked Fingers name in more than a decade, I’m assuming because it sounds like a more fleshed-out affair. He also invited some friends to provide backing vocals on a few tracks, including Superchunk’s Mac McCaughan, Sharon Van Etten, and today’s other guest, Matt Berninger of the National. Check out the Crooked Fingers song “From All Ways,” which features Berninger’s distinctive voice.

Fun fact: When the first two Crooked Fingers albums were reissued about 10 years ago, Bachmann asked two of his biggest fans to write the liner notes. One, I’m proud to say, was me, and the other was Matt Berninger, the intense baritone frontman of the National. As you’ll hear in this chat, Matt has been a fan of Eric’s since back in the Archers days. Berninger of course has had an incredible career in roughly that same timeframe, leading the National from small clubs to huge venues with a thoroughly unimpeachable catalog of smart, dark songs. (These two have those adjectives very much in common.) In addition to fronting the National, Berninger has stepped away on occasion for side projects and solo records. His latest release under his own name is Get Sunk, which came out last year. He’s about to launch a Canadian tour followed by some dates in Europe—catch him if you can, the solo shows are a different vibe than the National, but no less worth your time.

This wide-ranging conversation starts with a discussion of Bachmann’s recent heart attack—a scary situation that’s going to keep him off the road for a bit. They also talk about working together on “From All Ways” and a semi-secretive new thing that they’ve been hatching for the past couple of years. It’s a great, deep chat between two guys who obviously admire each other’s music a lot. If you’re not familiar with both, I strongly suggest a deep dive. Enjoy the episode.

Thanks for listening to the Talkhouse Podcast, and thanks to Eric Bachmann and Matt Berninger for chatting. If you liked what you heard, please follow Talkhouse on your favorite podcasting platform, and check out all the other great shows in our network. This episode was produced by Myron Kaplan, and the Talkhouse theme is composed and performed by the Range. See you next time!

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