SHEROES

The penultimate episode of the Road To Joni series packs in more conversations than any episode so far. As host Carmel Holt heads east toward home and the finale of the series on Joni’s 81st birthday, the throughline of “Both Sides Now” continues on with four artists whose creative path would have been very different if not for Joni Mitchell. Sylvan Esso’s Amelia Meath was introduced to Joni’s music at the age of 12 by her dad. They listened in the car on cassette until she knew the songs by heart. Amelia cites Joni’s freedom with her voice and her ability to talk openly about the challenges of living inside the music industry as core inspiration for her own creative journey. She tells Carmel that she thinks that the celebration of Joni should go on forever.

Multi-grammy award winning and nominated singer, songwriter and Tony award winning playwright and author Anäis Mitchell says that Joni is in the DNA of what she does as an artist. She talks about the impact of Hejira and the powerful example it set for her to witness a woman genius (Joni) doing it on her own terms. Anäis shares that she can relate deeply to the duality of “Both Sides Now” - how revisiting something in her 40s that was written in her 20s can mean something totally different.

Next we hear from Allison Russell about how her “Once & Future Sounds” set at the reemergence of Newport in 2021 came about, and how it led her to being on stage with Joni Mitchell the following year, as well as The Gorge in 2023, and most recently, at the Hollywood Bowl. She pinpoints hearing the clarinet in “For Free” for the first time as a pivotal moment that led her to playing clarinet with Joni as part of the Joni Jam.

Our final conversation in Episode 9 is with Grammy nominated Irish singer, songwriter, multi- instrumentalist Andrew Hozier Byrne, aka Hozier. He talks about how Joni’s music cracks open the hearts of anyone who listens to it… and we can attest that in this episode, even stories about Joni’s music will crack some hearts open. Andrew tells Carmel about a meeting with Brandi Carlile in LA that led him to Joni’s living room as part of an early Joni Jam. He emotionally tells the story of how Herbie Hancock started playing “Summertime” and Joni started singing along. He says about Joni, “It’s like being in the presence of something mythical.”

This week’s episode comes to you in the afterglow of two sold out Joni Mitchell performances at the Hollywood Bowl in Los Angeles, where molecules were rearranged, hearts were broken wide open and 17,000 fans basked in her brilliance. Though she has a bit of FOMO over missing out on being part of the Joni Jam, this week’s first guest, Shawn Colvin, has plenty of Joni stories. After initially discovering Clouds as a teenager at church camp, Shawn found herself many years later recording her 2nd album at Joni’s house with Joni’s then-husband Larry Klein, and Episode 7 guests Béla Fleck and Bruce Hornsby. Shawn says that she learned everything she could from Clouds, including a percussive approach to guitar, and it set her on a path to a solo approach to performing and writing songs which would not have happened without Joni Mitchell. She tells host/producer Carmel Holt about her “big brother” relationship with Bruce Hornsby and how he helped her overcome the heartbreak of a terrible New York Times live show review by sharing a folder of his own scathing media clips, one of which called him a “gherkin” (UK speak for pickle). MUNA guitarist, multi-instrumentalist and writer Naomi McPherson grew up in a family of jazz musicians. Like several of our guests, their gateway to Joni Mitchell was Blue and then the fretless bass of Jaco Pastorius on Hejira locked them in. From there, they went hardcore into 70s and onward Joni while listening to cassette tapes of Turbulent Indigo, Night Ride Home and Miles of Aisles in their 1998 Honda Accord. Naomi says that they are still learning from Joni’s music and that because of her, they play exclusively in open tunings. They talk about how Joni’s music spans genres and how much sonic exploration there is to mine in her catalog - from folk to the jazz era to 80s pop influences. Naomi thanks Joni for her fearlessness and considers her to be the greatest songwriter of all time.

The two guest interviews featured in Episode 7 with Bruce Hornsby and Béla Fleck were recorded back-to-back by host/producer Carmel Holt. As it turns out, the threads that connect the two artists to each other and to Joni, make the conversations a perfect pair. Joni's then-husband, Larry Klein, played bass on and co-produced several of her albums in the '80s and '90s. He would also bring the two guests in this episode closer to each other and to their shared SHERO, Joni.

Pianist and genre-blending musician Bruce Hornsby sings us through his Road to Joni, which includes Joni's first live album Miles of Aisles, a revelation that led him to devour her entire early catalogue, becoming a "complete Joni Mitchell devotee." In the 90's, Hornsby would go on to play on Shawn Colvin's second album, Fat City, produced by Larry Klein. Bruce ends by giving us a hint at a new project that he considers a "Paprika Plains"-like opus.

Banjo player and fellow breaker of genre-boundaries Béla Fleck's Road began with a birthday gift from his stepfather: a copy of Blue that he would wear out that summer. Béla recounts how "The Last Time I Saw Richard" taught him entirely new emotions as a teenager. Later on, he tells us how he, too, played on Shawn Colvin's album with Hornsby and Klein, and got to record in Joni's house. He also shares the story of a terrifying overnight hospital stay his son and family endured, where they played Night Ride Home on repeat to get them through.

For Episode 6, we continue a thread from last week as host Carmel Holt talks with three “boundary dweller” artists about their Roads To Joni. Each of our guests this week are visionaries who push beyond their comfort zone. They are producers, singers, songwriters and instrumentalists. Like Joni, they are multi-Grammy nominees and winners who do things on their own terms.  

Grammy award winning artist Arooj Aftab spent her teenage years in Lahore, Pakistan listening to American folk music. She found Joni Mitchell’s Blue and from there she was “all in.” Arooj takes us through her guest DJ set that spans Joni’s earliest recordings through to her jazz-influenced and more contemporary work. She sites “Black Crow” from Joni’s 1976 album Hejira as having a powerful impact on her. 

Singer-songwriter, guitarist, multi instrumentalist, producer and Grammy award winner Brittany Howard sees Joni as “someone who wouldn't let any confines stop her from expressing herself.” We would say the same about Brittany, who has not allowed herself to be defined by genre. She has explored pop, punk, lo-fi garage, glam and folk along her sonic path to her current album, What Now. 

Finally, we meet up with three time Grammy award winning artist Annie Clark aka St. Vincent for a conversation in Minneapolis/St. Paul with Carmel and public radio station The Current in front of an audience of their members. Annie says that Hejira was the portal through which she fell in love with Joni. She credits Joni for being a trailblazer who makes only the music she wants to make. She says, “she did whatever the F she wanted and people were there for it, because it was just that good.” 

The title of this week's episode comes from a term that legendary rock photographer Norman Seeff uses to describe a truly innovative artist, one who is willing to risk sacrificing their career in order to expand beyond their creative comfort zone. He calls these people “boundary dweller artists.” Norman says that he sees Joni as the archetype of this concept. Her evolution to incorporate jazz influences in the 70s, threw some of her fans for a loop, but as we’ve heard in previous episodes, Joni was not concerned with what others think. Working with the likes of Wayne Shorter, Herbie Hancock and Charles Mingus, Joni pushed her own boundaries. She pushed Norman’s boundaries, too.

His photo sessions with Joni Mitchell spanned over 15 years and 12 sessions, and his photography of Joni has appeared in the album packaging and covers for Court and Spark, Hissing of Summer Lawns, Don Juan's Reckless Daughter, Hejira, Dog Eat Dog, and her Hits and Misses compilations. Norman Seeff tells host Carmel Holt that Joni is one of the most courageous people he’s ever worked with, and in this fascinating episode that traces Norman's road to Joni and where it led him, we learn how the process of writing and compiling his book Joni: The Joni Mitchell Sessions he realized that he had not only captured Joni's metamorphosis but he also had been led to the guiding philosophy about creativity and the artistic spirit that has guided his work, and his personal evolution.

SHEROES is on The Road To Joni, but in this episode we discover that sometimes that road is a bridge. A bridge to healing. A bridge to holding your own. A bridge to a new creative path. A bridge from one generation to another. Episode 4 of the Road To Joni begins at the SHEROES studio in upstate New York with 5x platinum recording artist and activist Natalie Merchant. A long time friend of host Carmel Holt, they discovered that they were both Joni Mitchell fans at a 1999 at breast cancer benefit concert that Carmel organized and Natalie headlined. The closing song from that show was a cover of Joni Mitchell’s “All I Want.” 25 years later, Natalie Merchant sits down with Carmel to reflect on her road to Joni, talks about crying at her kitchen table after missing Joni's return at Newport Folk 2022, and shares an exclusive listen to a previously unreleased recording of her cover of "All I Want" from her personal archives. Then, it's on to Newport Folk Fest 2024, where 4x Grammy Award Nominee Madison Cunningham (who also missed Joni's 2022 Newport performance) recalls listening to Court and Spark and feeling like Joni was looking into her soul. The self-taught guitar and songwriting prodigy tells us that her road to Joni is more of a bridge, partly because of all the literal bridges she crossed while listening to Joni’s music, but the deeper metaphor she uncovers during this conversation reveals that Joni Mitchell provided Madison a bridge to cross the “moat” of her religious upbringing to a place that opened up not only her musical world, but made her available for all the opportunities that found her.

Episode 3 of The Road To Joni picks up a thread from our conversation with Don Was… and leads us to esperanza spalding. In 2021 esperanza collaborated with her mentor Wayne Shorter on Iphigenia, an opera with a revisionary take on Euripides' Greek tragedy Iphigenia at Aulis. It was Ipheigenia that led esperanza to Joni’s living room, though her path on the road to Joni started years prior with a track from the 1976 album Hejira. esperanza tells host Carmel Holt how, at a recent Janet Jackson concert, she was reminded that Joni Mitchell has “literally influenced everyone.”

Joni’s influence on powerhouse string players and Joni Jam members Chauntee and Monique of SistaStrings began with “the lady that sings on the Janet Jackson song. (‘Got Til It’s Gone’).” A move from their hometown of Milwaukee to Nashville immersed the sisters in the Americana scene… which led them to a place in Brandi Carlisle’s touring band… which led to that fateful Newport 2022 performance when Joni took the stage. SistaStrings credit Joni for being an example for women to “stand on your own, be who you are, make weird music and be loud about it.”

We travel to Los Angeles for the first half of Episode 2, where Carmel talks to legendary producer, bassist, and Blue Note Records president, Don Was about his first gig ever at age 12 opening for Joni Mitchell. Don also shares how he learned an important life lesson from listening to Blue, and discusses the sophistication of Joni's harmonic and poetic compositions, and how this naturally intersected with some of the greats of jazz, including their mutual friend, the late Wayne Shorter. Next, in a heartfelt conversation, host Carmel Holt tells Bonnie Raitt that her own road to Joni began with cassettes of Blue and Bonnie's 1974 album Streetlights, and we learn that her version of "That Song About The Midway" also holds a very special meaning for Bonnie, including performing the song in Joni's living room at one of the Joni Jams. Bonnie shares how inspirational and important Joni has been for her, and the ways she has impacted her work.

Episode One takes us back to South By Southwest 2024 in Austin, TX where an interview with Kathleen Edwards takes an unexpected and affirming turn, and Kathleen remembers how a case of mistaken identity temporarily changes the backstage rules at Toronto's Massey Hall. Then we travel to Newport Folk Festival 2024, where Joni Mitchell made her big comeback in 2022, and Carmel meets up with Taylor Goldsmith of Dawes who shares how talking to Brandi at Newport a few years ago led him to getting the invitation to jam sessions at Joni's house and getting to play his favorite Joni song with his "forever north star." And Jess Wolfe and Holly Laessig of Lucius tell us of the first heartbreaking missed opportunity to go to Joni's house, which soon would turn around into an unforgettable Christmas and six year journey of witnessing the incredible healing power of music and community of the Joni Jams, from living room to stage.

Grammy-winning artist Arooj Aftab returns to SHEROES this week to discuss her fourth solo album, Night Reign, and her journey of the last two decades, staying true to her vision, and pioneering a sound that she wanted to hear.