Today’s show:

Meta just took a 49% stake in Scale AI, and the shockwaves are hitting the entire AI ecosystem. In this episode, @Jason and @alex unpack the deal’s implications: Google ($150M customer!) and others are fleeing Scale, worried Meta will hoard its RLHF infrastructure and cut off competitors. Startups like Labelbox, Turing, and Handshake are already seeing a demand surge. Is this smart vertical integration or anti-competitive overreach? Jason shares tactical advice for founders on how to capitalize when incumbents stumble—hire ex-Scale talent, build “Scale AI alternative” SEO pages, and hit the podcast circuit. Don’t miss this deep dive into AI’s shifting power dynamics.

Timestamps:

(04:01) Is Jason becoming an AI doomer?!

(9:52) OpenPhone - Streamline and scale your customer communications with OpenPhone. Get 20% off your first 6 months at www.openphone.com/⁠twist

(13:47) PostHog, and when is it okay for founders to break the rules?

(20:56) Vanta - Get $1000 off your SOC 2 at https://www.vanta.com/twist

(25:50) Why the Navy is recruiting startups

(30:12) Pilot - Visit https://www.pilot.com/twist and get $1,200 off your first year.

(39:09) Did Zuck buy Scale in order to keep it from competitors?

(56:08) When does incentivizing customers turn into burning capital?

(1:04) How raising too much money could KILL your startup!

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Thank you to our partners:

(9:52) OpenPhone - Streamline and scale your customer communications with OpenPhone. Get 20% off your first 6 months at www.openphone.com/⁠twist

(20:56) Vanta - Get $1000 off your SOC 2 at https://www.vanta.com/twist

(30:52) Pilot - Visit https://www.pilot.com/twist and get $1,200 off your first year.

Great TWIST interviews: Will Guidara, Eoghan McCabe, Steve Huffman, Brian Chesky, Bob Moesta, Aaron Levie, Sophia Amoruso, Reid Hoffman, Frank Slootman, Billy McFarland

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