In this episode, Joe interviews Satya Thallam: Policy Advisor at the international law firm, Arnold & Porter; and longtime policy expert based in Washington, D.C. who previously served in senior roles at both the White House and the U.S. Senate.

Thallam was the lead author and negotiator of the Federal Right to Try Act, which grants terminally ill patients access to experimental therapies and substances that have completed Phase I testing but have not yet been approved by the FDA. He discusses its intricacies and benefits, how psychedelics were not a focus but were always obvious, whether or not it allows people to grow their own mushrooms, and more. He talks abut the implementation of the first Federal legalization of hemp under the Farm Bill in 2018, breaking down the history and detail of how it came to be, and why a difference of .3% in weight truly matters when establishing law.

He discusses the changing landscape of politicians and psychedelics; how local action creates a culture of inspiring Washington; the internal fight between different agencies and the endless lobbying it takes to get things done; how one needs to cater their argument by who is listening; risk assessment and judgment-proof operations; the concern over whether or not we got everything wrong with cannabis; and why we will likely begin seeing a lot of coalitions popping up in the psychedelic space. Click here to head to the show notes page.