How can the American church evolve to be more courageous, inclusive, and authentic in the decades to come? In the second installment of our Future Church Series, Mike Erre and Tim Stafford talk with longtime friends Kristen Howerton and Andy Lara about the current state of the church in America and what needs to change for it to thrive in the future.

Kristen—a clinical psychologist, writer, and founder of "Rage Against the Minivan"—shares how motherhood, mental health, and social justice shaped her faith journey and her critique of modern evangelicalism. She opens up about the limits of aesthetic Christianity, the damage caused by politicized faith, and why she started Orange County’s wildly popular Beer and Hymns gatherings as an inclusive alternative to traditional church.

Andy, co-founder of the Vox Podcast and an experienced podcast and media producer, reflects on the rapidly evolving landscape of church communities born from decentralized platforms like podcasting, and how church models need to abandon image obsessions and redefine leadership, success, and storytelling to truly reflect the imago Dei.

Key Takeaways: • Political Entanglement and Church Decline – Kristen critiques the evangelical church’s alliance with political ideologies and how it’s alienated the very people Jesus calls us to serve. • Inclusive Church Experiences – Why affirming, justice-centered, and spiritually rich spaces are critical to the future of the church's witness and survival. • Beer and Hymns as Sacred Resistance – Kristen details how a bar sing-along became a sacred space and blueprint for what post-church community could look like. • Revisiting the Power of Podcasting – Andy reflects on how podcast-centered communities like Vox offer a model for spiritual belonging in a digital-first world. • Image-Obsessed Christianity – How performative church culture, celebrity pastors, and aesthetic branding distort the gospel and marginalize real people. • The Gift of Exile – Why stepping outside of the traditional church model may be the path back to Jesus’ true mission.

Guest Highlights: Kristen Howerton — Psychologist, writer, and podcast host of “Selfie.” Founder of "Rage Against the Minivan" and co-creator of Orange County’s Beer and Hymns. Andy Lara — Vox Podcast co-founder, media producer, disability advocate, and creative consultant behind impactful digital church communities and podcasts.

Resources Mentioned: • Selfie Podcast – selfiepodcast.com • Rage Against the Minivan – rageagainsttheminivan.com • Red Letter Christians – redletterchristians.org • Preachers in Sneakers – Instagram • “Beer and Hymns” National Chapters – [Google Search or local chapter pages]

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