Guest: Wade Mullen.

In this episode, we have an all NEW interview with author and GRACE Editor in Chief of Institutional Response, Wade Mullen. Join Robert, Hannah, and Zane as we talk with Wade about what makes an apology meaningful, why self-protection is so tempting, and how Wade's SCORE framework can serve as a guide for authentic apologies. Plus, why click-in flooring is so infuriating and an examination of some real-life apologies.

Resources Mentioned:

• "Something's Not Right: Decoding the Hidden Tactics of Abuse—and Freeing Yourself from Its Power" by Wade Mullen
• "Truth and Repair: How Trauma Survivors Envision Justice" by Judith Herman
• Wade Mullen's Blog: wademullen.substack.com

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guest: Dr. Elizabeth Jeglic.

In this all NEW interview, we discuss grooming behaviors and warning signs with clinical psychologist and internationally renowned researcher Dr. Elizabeth Jeglic. Join Robert, Zane, and Hannah, as we talk with Dr. Jeglic about common CSA myths, red flag behaviors, different forms of grooming, and what the research has to say about female offenders. Plus, a debate on time travel as a plot device, the merits of Christopher Nolan, and what it means to wrestle with complex situations.

Resources Mentioned:

• "Child Safeguarding Policy Guide" by Basyle Tchividjian.
• GRACE Independent Investigations: Netgrace.org/independent-investigations
• GRACE Policy Review & Development: Netgrace.org/policy-review
• Red Flag Grooming Behaviors Chart: elizabethjeglic.com/post/identification-of-red-flag-sexual-grooming-behaviors

If you enjoy the GRACE Awakening please consider subscribing and donating at ⁠⁠Netgrace.org/donate⁠ ⁠

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guest: Diane Langberg

Welcome back to Season 2 of the GRACE Awakening! In this epsidoe, we have a NEW interview with psychologist, speaker, & author Dr. Diane Langberg. Join Hannah and Laura as we talk with Dr. Langberg about denialism in the Church and what it takes to have courage in this cultural moment. Plus, Hannah and Laura give a sneak peak into this season's topics, guests, and all the things we are excited about for The GRACE Awakening!

Resources Mentioned:

• "Suffering and the Heart of God: How Trauma Destroys and Christ Restores" by Diane Langberg
• "Redeeming Power: Understanding Authority and Abuse in the Church" by Diane Langberg

If you enjoy the GRACE Awakening please consider subscribing and donating at ⁠⁠Netgrace.org/donate⁠ ⁠

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guests: Laura Thien & Wade Mullen.

In this special release podcast, Robert sits down with GRACE Executive Director Laura Thien and Executive Editor Wade Mullen to pull back the curtain on our Independent Investigations. Tune in to learn how the GRACE team handles bias, what it means to be trauma-informed, and common questions we get asked by churches and individuals about the investigative process.

Resources Mentioned:

• The Safe Church Training Center: ⁠netgrace.org/training-center
• GRACE Independent Investigations: netgrace.org/independent-investigations

If you enjoy the GRACE Awakening please consider subscribing and donating at ⁠⁠Netgrace.org/donate⁠ ⁠

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guest: Laura Thien

That's a wrap! In the final episode of Season 1, we speak with the new GRACE Executive Director, Laura Thien, about her journey in abuse and trauma work and what she sees coming for GRACE in 2026. Plus, Robert, Zane, Hannah, and Laura talk about the tension of holding hope and accountability for the Church, resilience in the face of trauma, and the limited edition Selena Gomez Oreos.

Resources Mentioned:

• GRACE Live Conversation on Lament
• The Safe Church Training Center: netgrace.org/training-center

If you enjoy the GRACE Awakening please consider subscribing and donating at ⁠Netgrace.org/donate⁠

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guests: Amy Stier and Emily Petrie

In this episode, Robert has attorneys Amy Stier and Emily Petrie back to recap a GRACE Live Conversation they had over the summer on adult clergy sexual abuse and answer the many questions you asked during the live webinar. You won't want to miss it!

Resources Mentioned:

• Redeeming Power: Understanding Authority and Abuse in the Church by Diane Langberg
• Research by Dr. Diana Garland
• Consultations with GRACE

If you enjoy the GRACE Awakening please consider subscribing and donating at Netgrace.org/donate

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guest: Wade Mullen.

In this episode, we have a NEW interview with author and GRACE Editor in Chief of Institutional Response, Wade Mullen. Join Robert, Hannah, and Zane as we talk with Wade about image management, the slippery slope of self-promotion, and the 4 walls of defense used by institutions and offenders when confronted with allegations of abuse/misconduct. Plus, why Wade hates acronyms but uses them anyway, and the antidote to the 4 walls of defense.

Resources Mentioned:

• Something's Not Right: Decoding the Hidden Tactics of Abuse—And Freeing Yourself Its Power by Wade Mullen.
• ⁠The Weaponization of Perceptions: Part I⁠ by Wade Mullen.

To support the ongoing work of GRACE, visit NetGrace.org/donate

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guest: Victor Vieth.

In this special release podcast, Robert speaks with GRACE Board Member and Chief Program Officer for Education & Research for Zero Abuse Project, Victor Vieth, live at the 16th annual Virginia Crimes Against Children Conference. Victor and Robert discuss what the Bible has to say about corporal punishment, the necessity of theological engagement on the issue of child abuse, and the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America's (ELCA) groundbreaking social message on child protection that was adopted in November of 2025. And as an added bonus, hear about Victor's encounter with Johnny Cash.

Resources Mentioned:

• ELCA Social Message on Child Protection
• On This Rock by Victor Vieth
• Here We Stand: A Lutheran Response to Child Abuse edited by Craig Nessan and Victor Vieth

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guest: Elizabeth Phillips.

In this NEW interview, we discuss "taking the muzzle off the truth" with guest Elizabeth Phillips, the primary advocate behind Trey's Law in Texas. Join Robert, Zane, and GRACE Assistant Director, Emily Petrie, as we talk with Elizabeth about her brother's story and how it inspired the legislation that is rewriting the use of NDA's in child abuse cases. Plus, some ponderings about why Superman works a 9-5, if cats really are evil, and what it means to find hope in dark places.

Resources Mentioned:

• ⁠Treyslaw.com
• NDAfree.org
• LiftOurVoices.org
• Cantbuymysilence.com

Note: This interview originally took place in August of 2025 and some legislation or statistics may have changed since its recording.

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.

Guests: Scot McKnight & Boz Tchividjian.

Interviewer: Maureen Garcia.

Join Robert, Hannah, and Zane as they break down a previous GRACE Live Conversation with author and professor Scot McKnight and attorney Boz Tchividjian about the insidious use of nondisclosure agreements within churches to silence abuse survivors. Plus, how a Dr. Who villain relates to NDAs, the role of the wider-church community in stopping the normalization of confidentiality clauses, and the importance of wielding Scripture with caution.       

Resources Mentioned:

• GRACE Live Conversation
• The Weaponization of Perceptions: Part I by Wade Mullen.

Disclaimer: All opinions expressed by podcast guests are their own and may not represent the views of GRACE as an organization. Similarly, the presence of a guest on the podcast does not constitute an endorsement of them, their work, or any organization they represent. This podcast is also not a forum for GRACE to discuss past, present, or future investigations or engagements but rather to draw out broader themes, principles, and research around abuse in faith contexts.