Influence doesn't always come from title, age, tenure, or position. Sometimes the people with the most influence are simply the people leaders trust the most.

In this episode, Tim Stevens talks with David Whiting (GenerosityOS SVP and LeadingSmart Senior Consultant) about how church staff members can grow their influence in healthy, practical ways. Drawing from David’s years as a senior pastor and ministry leader, they unpack why some people are invited into more conversations and decisions while others feel overlooked, under-appreciated, or left out of the room.

They also discuss why influence starts with the things every leader can control: follow-through, honesty, effort, ownership, teachability, loyalty, and joy. This is part one of a two-part conversation on influence, focusing on the character side of leadership before moving into competency in the next episode.

Additional topics include:

church leadership
staff culture
leadership influence
ministry teams
character and competency
staff trust
decision-making
follow-through
ownership
team alignment
teachable leadership
healthy communication
church staff development
leading with humility
organizational trust

Timestamps

00:00 Introducing David Whiting and today’s conversation on influence
03:00 Why many staff feel under-appreciated, overlooked, or left out
05:00 Why the decision-making room often gets smaller as a church grows
07:00 The difference between character issues and competency issues
09:00 Why influence starts with what you can control
10:30 Do what you said you would do
13:00 Own it when you blow it
16:00 Tell the truth without shading, spinning, or hiding details
19:00 Bring the effort and become dependable
23:00 Think church, not turf
27:00 Why leaders lose influence when they become territorial
29:00 No surprises: keeping supervisors informed
32:00 Stay teachable and receive correction without defensiveness
36:00 Evaluate honestly and care more about getting better than looking good
39:00 Be loyal in the right rooms
44:00 What reasonable loyalty looks like on a healthy team
47:00 Serve with joy, humility, and a good attitude
50:00 Why character grows influence but competency creates the lid
52:00 Final thoughts and a preview of part two

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PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

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Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

Preschool ministry is not just childcare. It may be one of the clearest relational bridges your church has to young families in the community.

In this episode, Tim Stevens talks with Brandi Watterson about how churches can think more strategically about preschool ministry. Drawing from Brandi’s 17 years of experience owning and operating preschools, they unpack the opportunity churches have to start, strengthen, or realign early childhood programs connected to their ministry.

They also discuss why many church preschools drift over time from mission to maintenance, how tension can build between the church and preschool sides, and why excellence, trust, and clear alignment matter if a preschool is going to serve families well.

Additional topics include:

church preschool
early childhood ministry
daycare ministry
church leadership
family ministry
children’s ministry
church operations
ministry alignment
community outreach
preschool leadership
staffing and structure
church facilities
mission drift
building trust with families

Timestamps

00:00 Introducing Brandi Watterson and preschool consulting at LeadingSmart
02:00 Brandi and Danny’s story in ministry
04:30 Starting a church and buying their first preschool
08:00 Taking over a struggling school and rebuilding trust
11:00 Expanding into multiple preschool models
13:30 Common challenges churches face with preschools
14:30 The tension between the preschool and the church
16:00 How churches lose sight of preschool as a ministry opportunity
18:00 Why preschool can become a relational bridge to families
20:00 Bringing excellence to church preschool programming
22:00 Practical ways pastors and ministry teams can connect with preschool families
24:00 Should your church run the preschool or partner with someone else?
26:00 Licensing, timelines, facilities, and startup realities
29:00 How LeadingSmart helps churches start, strengthen, or realign preschool ministry
31:00 Brandi’s leadership experience and Forbes Business Council work
33:00 Final thoughts for churches with preschool opportunities

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
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PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

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Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

In this episode, Tim Stevens and Holly Tate talk about what makes a healthy church leadership team and why having the right people in the room matters. Drawing from Tim’s leadership team teaching and their work with churches, they unpack the characteristics leaders should look for when deciding who belongs at the senior leadership table.

They also discuss why leadership team health is about more than titles and org charts, how to know whether someone can think beyond their own ministry area, and why senior leaders set the tone by the way they participate in meetings. Tim and Holly also talk through the tension between executive teams, senior leadership teams, subject matter experts, and the importance of clarity around decision rights.

Additional topics include:

church leadership
healthy leadership teams
church staffing and structure
executive team dynamics
senior leadership teams
decision rights
church org charts
team alignment
healthy conflict
leadership team meetings
mission commitment
active participation
adaptive leadership
church staff culture
senior pastor leadership

Timestamps

00:00 Why healthy teams require the right people
05:30 Committed to the whole mission, not just one ministry area
09:45 Healthy conflict, respectful debate, and decision support
17:15 Adaptability, accountability, and leadership maturity
22:10 Empathy, listening, and team culture
28:30 Active participation and why senior leaders set the tone
34:15 Titles, org charts, and who should really be in the room
45:30 Random segment: favorite sandwiches
51:00 LeadingSmart’s first Executive Team Gathering

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
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PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

🔔 Subscribe to stay updated on future episodes

Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

In this episode, Tim Stevens and Holly Tate talk about the difference between leading from scarcity and leading from abundance. Drawing from Tim’s first three years leading LeadingSmart full-time, they unpack why leadership pressure can pull even healthy leaders toward comparison, defensiveness, competition, and fear.

They also discuss why generosity is one of LeadingSmart’s core values, what it means to believe the best about other leaders and organizations, and how an open-handed posture can shape the way leaders make decisions, build relationships, and respond when they feel threatened.

Additional topics include:

church leadership
scarcity mindset
abundance mindset
generous leadership
kingdom-minded leadership
competition in ministry
leadership motives
organizational values
trust and reputation
open-handed leadership
church staff transitions
leading through pressure

Timestamps

00:00 Tim joins from Vancouver and reflects on year three of LeadingSmart
02:45 Why leadership pressure can pull people toward scarcity
05:45 The difference between competition and open-handed leadership
08:25 Why generosity is a core value at LeadingSmart
11:30 Playing the long game with relationships, reputation, and social capital
14:10 How fear of missing out can drive urgency and pressure
15:45 Why churches aren’t actually competing with each other
18:40 When healthy ambition turns into fear-based competition
21:30 Random segment: favorite or most meaningful gifts

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
Instagram: @timstevens
Facebook: @timstevens

PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

🔔 Subscribe to stay updated on future episodes

Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

In this episode, Tim Stevens and Holly Tate unpack the four types of crises churches commonly face: character, credibility, cash, and cultural. Drawing from Tim’s experience leading through crisis at Granger and Willow Creek, they discuss why crisis can feel like everything is on fire and how naming the type of crisis helps leaders focus on the right problem instead of spinning their wheels.

They also talk about why communication matters when trust begins to erode, how credibility crises can form in the absence of clarity, why cash crises require courage and honesty, and how cultural crises can put pressure on church leaders in ways that feel impossible to navigate.

Additional topics include:

church crisis leadership
church communication
organizational trust
leadership credibility
church staffing and structure
leading through change
church health
executive pastor leadership
board and elder leadership

Timestamps

00:00 Do the next right thing
01:15 Why churches need language for different types of crises
02:20 Tim reflects on leading through crisis at Granger and Willow Creek
05:20 Character crisis: when a leader’s failure creates public fallout
07:25 Credibility crisis: when trust in leadership begins to erode
10:20 When clarity lacks, negativity fills the void
13:35 Cash crisis: when the numbers tell a hard story
15:45 Cultural crisis: when outside events create pressure inside the church 
17:00 How multiple crises can stack together
18:25 Why doing the next right thing is simple but not easy
20:00 How LeadingSmart helps churches navigate pivotal moments
20:50 Random segment: favorite travel brands

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
Instagram: @timstevens
Facebook: @timstevens

PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

🔔 Subscribe to stay updated on future episodes

Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

When clarity lacks, negativity fills the void.

In this episode, Tim Stevens and Holly Tate discuss why communication and clarity are essential for healthy church teams. Drawing from real consulting conversations this week, they unpack how unclear expectations create assumptions, frustration, and tension inside organizations — especially during seasons of growth and change.

They also reflect on one year of the LeadingSmart Podcast, sharing lessons they’ve learned about consistency, audience growth, practical leadership content, and why authentic conversations are resonating more than highly polished production.

Additional topics include:

• church leadership
• staff culture
• team communication
• organizational health
• leadership development
• ministry growth

Timestamps
00:00 Why clarity matters in church leadership
01:45 Real leadership lessons from this week’s consulting work
03:10 “When clarity lacks, negativity fills the void”
04:30 Why unclear expectations create team frustration
06:15 What happens when fast-growing churches lack structure
08:00 Reflecting on one year of the LeadingSmart Podcast
10:45 Why weekly podcasting started working for Tim & Holly
12:00 Lessons from Season 1, 2, and 3
13:30 Why practical leadership content is outperforming polished production
15:00 The real reason the podcast started growing
17:00 Why every audience responds differently to content
18:15 Consistency vs chasing trends
19:00 The importance of serving the right audience
20:00 Tim gets recognized at pickleball because of the podcast
21:00 Podcasts Tim & Holly are listening to right now
24:00 Final thoughts for church leaders

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
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Facebook: @timstevens

PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

🔔 Subscribe to stay updated on future episodes

Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

Welcome to episode 24 of The LeadingSmart Podcast! Have you ever walked away from a staff retreat thinking, "That was a complete waste of time"? You're not alone — and it's completely avoidable.

In this episode of the LeadingSmart Podcast, Holly Tate and Tim sit down to unpack what makes church staff retreats genuinely effective — and what makes them a drain on your team's time, energy, and budget.

Whether you're planning your first leadership retreat or trying to make your annual all-staff offsite actually matter, these four best practices will help you design a retreat your team won't forget.

In this episode, you'll learn:

• How to define a clear "win" before your retreat even starts
• The difference between decisions to make vs. discussions to have (and why it matters)
• Who should actually be in the room — and when to split leadership vs. all-staff retreats
• Why a retreat isn't a retreat without intentional fun, shared meals, and real hang time
• How to fund a retreat even when it's not in your budget

Plus — Holly and Tim share their recent AI wins with Claude, ChatGPT, Descript, and Gemini, and how they're using these tools to save hours in their day-to-day work.

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
Instagram: @timstevens
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PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

🔔 Subscribe to stay updated on future episodes

Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

Welcome back to episode 23 of The LeadingSmart Podcast! Silos are one of the most common — and most damaging — forces quietly undermining healthy church organizations. But how do you know when you have them, and what do you do about them? In this episode, Tim Stevens and Holly Tate tackle the silo problem head-on, with Tim sharing five specific ways silos hurt organizations and Holly bringing the heat on why she feels so passionately about this topic.

From territorial mindsets that replace mission with ownership, to broken trust between teams, to volunteers who burn out because nobody's communicating — Tim and Holly give church leaders practical language and tools to identify and dismantle the silos that could be quietly fracturing your culture.

And then Tim drops a hot take: are there times when a silo can actually be healthy? Holly's skeptical — but you'll have to tune in to find out if he convinces her.

In this episode:

• The 5 ways silos kill healthy organizations (including one specific to churches and volunteers)
• Why territorial language — "my ministry," "my volunteers" — is a warning sign worth paying attention to
• How silos hide problems until they're expensive to fix
• Tim's "hot take" on when siloing your team might actually be the right move
• A practical Venn diagram exercise to help leaders identify what they can — and can't — control
• When it's time to stop protecting a culture that isn't yours to fix

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
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PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

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Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

Welcome Back to Episode 22 of The LeadingSmart Podcast!

Is your leadership team misaligned on staff performance? Are you holding on to people who are quietly killing your culture — or letting go of people who just need a better role? In this episode, Holly Tate and Tim walk you through one of the most powerful staff evaluation exercises they use in nearly every leadership gathering and consultation: The 4-Box Staff Framework.

Using a simple 2x2 grid — with culture on one axis and performance on the other — you'll learn how to objectively assess every person on your team, have aligned conversations as a lead team, and know exactly what action to take for each person.

In this episode, you'll learn:

• How to define "culture fit" even if your church hasn't established formal staff values
• How to rate every staff member on a 1–4 scale for both culture and performance
• The 4 quadrants: Retain, Reposition, Remove, and Redeem — and what action each one requires
• Why your top performers will leave if you don't address your culture killers
• The difference between a PIP and a coaching plan — and when to use each
• How to handle the "brilliant jerk": the person crushing their goals but destroying team culture
• Why this exercise is gold during a financial crunch or staff restructure

Whether you lead a team of 5 or 50, this framework will bring clarity to conversations your lead team has been avoiding — and give you a shared language for making hard, loving, and necessary decisions about your people.

As always, please email us any topics you would like us to cover!

📺 Watch on YouTube at youtube.com/leadingsmart to see the actual framework graphic.

📅 Upcoming Events discussed in today's episode:

• Large Church Gathering (10K+ attendance) — September https://www.leadingsmart.com/gatherings
• One-Day Experience in Houston — June  https://www.leadingsmart.com/houston-roundtable
• Monthly Virtual Executive Pastor Cohort — open enrollment (email [email protected] or [email protected] for a free trial)
• Graphic https://canva.link/4quadrantgraphic

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
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PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

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Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...

Is your church approaching a leadership transition? The type of pastor you need depends entirely on the season your church is in — and most boards get this wrong.

In this episode of LeadingSmart, Holly Tate and Tim Stevens break down a powerful four-part framework for church succession planning that every board, search team, and executive pastor needs to hear before hiring their next senior leader.

You'll learn:

• The 4 types of senior pastors churches need — and how to identify which one fits your church right now
• Why hiring a disruptor when you need healing (or vice versa) can devastate a congregation
• When to choose an internal vs. external candidate in your succession search
• How boards can get aligned before the hiring process to protect both the church and the incoming leader
• Real-world examples from Willow Creek and other large churches navigating leadership transition

Plus — the team wraps with a fun question from James Clear's newsletter: "If every job paid the same, what would you do?" Whether you're 2 years or 10 years away from a succession, this episode gives you the language and clarity to plan well. 

Resources mentioned:

• Chicago Gathering for Executive Pastors (10K+ attendance): leadingsmart.com
• Succession Webinar — 10 Things Every Church Needs to Know: leadingsmart.com

📱 Follow us for more insights and resources
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PREORDER The Healthy Church Board Masterclass: https://www.leadingsmart.com/church-board-masterclass

💻Visit LeadingSmart.com

Need help facilitating your next staff retreat or strategic offsite? https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

Listen to Leading In Real Time Podcast Series
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ2wnxRYYqm_ThAiSPBwjH7vQH5i3H3aK

Listen to the full 40 Lessons In 40 Years series
https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast

Download The Simply Strategic Show

 https://www.leadingsmart.com/books-2

📩 Have questions or want to connect?
https://www.leadingsmart.com/lets-talk

🔔 Subscribe to stay updated on future episodes

Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-leadingsmart-podcast/id1813933962

...