The Nathan Barry Show

Growing a membership from $500,000 a year to $5 million comes down to five specific things. In this episode, I map them out on the board using Matt Trinetti’s membership as an example.

Matt is the cofounder of London Writers’ Salon, where 1,000 writers gather every weekday to write together in silence. They’re on track for $750,000 this year, and Matt wants to grow from 2,000 members to 20,000.

In this episode, I give him the exact blueprint for how to get there. Up on the board, we get into why mission and vision come before any growth tactic, how to track your funnel and conversion rate at every step, why retention is one of the biggest levers in a recurring revenue business, and how to package your products so people know exactly which plan is right for them.

If you run a membership or any subscription business, I think you'll get a lot out of this conversation.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:37 London Writers' Salon by the numbers
02:06 Three membership tiers and the Residency
04:28 The goal of $5 million and 20,000 members
05:42 Why a revenue goal felt uncomfortable for Matt
06:30 Why profit is permission to do it again tomorrow
07:19 The five keys to scaling a membership
07:43 London Writers' Salon's mission
08:59 Why creative health will become a category
10:45 Turning your mission into a vision with numbers
11:26 How Kit sets its mission and vision
13:11 Why your vision has to be big enough for your team
17:09 Why Kit tracks counterbalancing goals
18:36 How Writers' Hour started in the pandemic
21:36 Why you need to obsess over your funnel
21:52 Why a membership is really a SaaS business
23:07 Mapping the membership funnel
25:18 Matt's 27% trial conversion rate
27:05 Why all traffic is not created equal
27:52 Why a 5,000-person event barely converts
28:39 How Kit gets three more upgrades a day
30:27 Upselling without making members feel sold to
32:58 Why retention is everything
33:23 User churn vs revenue churn
34:46 Why cohorts change your churn numbers
36:33 Why retention is the biggest lever you have
38:06 What cancellation surveys miss
38:37 Why every membership needs a pause option
41:04 Getting on calls with members who cancel
42:01 Should you add new products?
44:22 Why every product decision goes through the funnel
46:03 How renaming a plan "hobbyist" changed what people bought
47:01 Why Silver and Gold don't tell people anything
50:15 When to launch a separate product
53:04 How adding more can lower perceived value
53:55 The $499 annual accelerator idea
55:51 Why you need to measure 30-day churn
58:17 LTV to CAC, the number that tells you when to scale
1:01:28 How every metric feeds into LTV to CAC
1:04:01 How to calculate customer acquisition cost
1:06:12 Matt's three big takeaways
1:07:24 Final thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Matt:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mtrinetti
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthew-trinetti
Newsletter: https://seekingwithmatt.substack.com

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
London Writers' Salon: https://londonwriterssalon.com
Circle: https://circle.so
The Ladders of Wealth: https://laddersofwealth.com

Highlights:
06:30 Profit is permission to do it again tomorrow
27:52 The 5,000-person writing event that barely converts
38:37 Why a pause button could save your members
53:55 Why I'd sell a $499/year membership instead of $49/month
58:17 The one number that tells you when to scale

As the founder of an email marketing platform, you’d think my newsletter would be dialed in. But it turns out there's a lot I could be doing better. I think that's true for most creators, who get so caught up in growth hacks that their list slowly dies out or hits a plateau they can't get past.

Chenell Basilio reverse engineers how the biggest newsletters grow and took her own newsletter, Growth in Reverse, to 21,000 subscribers in just 10 months. In this episode, Chenell walks me through the 5 levers behind newsletter growth, including how to make your content insanely valuable, how to build momentum with tactics like quizzes, and the one lever she sees hardly anyone using. Then she applies all of it to my own newsletter, from the headline on my site to how I share podcast episodes, and it turns out I have some work to do.

If you're trying to grow your newsletter and want a total masterclass in how to do it, this is the episode for you.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:37 Why growth tactics are only 1 of 5 levers
02:03 How Chenell hit 21,000 subscribers in 10 months
03:29 Why going deeper than everyone else stands out
04:40 Lever 1: Insanely valuable content
06:24 6 ways to make content insanely valuable
08:34 Mario Gabriele's S-1 breakdowns
10:11 Making readers the smartest person in the room
12:40 Why you should get on calls with your readers
13:28 Lever 2: Positioning
13:55 How a food waste app became The ADHD Weasel
16:05 Why positioning changes over time
18:54 How to find readers to talk to
20:28 How reader calls shaped Sam Vander Wielen's bundle
21:19 Lever 3: Building momentum
21:56 Why you should pick one platform
22:15 Why quizzes are working so well
26:21 The quiz that 9X'd The ADHD Weasel's growth
27:16 How to get noticed by creators you admire
28:46 Building a quiz for The Ladders of Wealth
29:47 Lead magnets that don't need new content
30:39 Using AI skills as lead magnets
32:01 Why you should post more on social
35:05 How to mine your best content
38:34 Why it's okay to repeat your best stories
39:43 Lever 4: Conversion
41:55 Chenell's spicy take on Linktree
43:35 How Dru Riley got a landing page to 40%
45:55 Why the wrong views won't convert
48:27 How Pat Walls positioned Starter Story's paid product
50:54 Lever 5: The one hardly anyone is doing
51:39 Why you need an "almost there" page
53:24 What makes a great welcome email
55:52 How to surprise new subscribers
58:21 Doing what bigger creators can't
1:02:12 Why you should subscribe to your own newsletter
1:03:55 Chenell audits Nathan's newsletter
1:06:38 The bar for Nathan's newsletter content
1:09:20 Splitting the podcast into its own email
1:11:36 Turning the book launch into content
1:13:44 Chenell reads Nathan's homepage headline
1:16:36 Sharing your success without bragging
1:18:42 Promoting the newsletter inside episodes
1:22:56 Fixing Nathan's conversion points
1:26:14 The hidden cost of double opt-in
1:29:49 How newsletters monetize
1:31:46 Why Packy McCormick's sponsored deep dives work
1:33:19 Group coaching and high-ticket offers
1:36:00 The pricing sweet spot for memberships
1:37:26 When paid newsletters work
1:40:48 How to price a paid newsletter
1:43:57 Final thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Chenell:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chenellco
X: https://x.com/chenellco
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chenellco
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@growthinreverse
Website: https://growthinreverse.com

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
Growth In Reverse: https://growthinreverse.com
Newsletter scorecard: https://growthinreverse.com/scorecard
The Generalist: https://www.generalist.com
The ADHD Weasel: https://adhdweasel.substack.com
Trends.vc: https://trends.vc
Starter Story: https://www.starterstory.com
The Ladders of Wealth: https://laddersofwealth.com

Highlights:
06:24 The 6 ways to make content insanely valuable
26:37 The quiz that 9X'd The ADHD Weasel's daily growth
50:54 The growth lever almost no one is using
1:13:44 Chenell roasts Nathan's newsletter
1:31:46 How Packy McCormick gets paid 5 to 10X for sponsored deep dives

What happens to your newsletter when the first thing to read it isn't a person, but an AI agent? For anyone who has built a business on email, that shift is coming a lot faster than most of us expect.

I sat down with Dan Shipper, co-founder and CEO of Every, a company that writes about AI, builds AI software, and gets to test the models before they're released. Dan has interviewed Sam Altman and is one of the people closest to the cutting edge that I know.

We get into how good AI has become at using your computer, why Dan thinks the newsletter as we know it is dead, why OpenAI or Anthropic will likely build a new kind of inbox, and the one number his team is chasing right now that they might stop chasing soon. Dan also shares why, despite all the change, he's so optimistic about where this is going.

If email sits at the heart of your business, I think you'll get a lot out of this conversation.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:22 The AI workflow every creator should set up
02:43 How Dan writes by talking to his AI
04:21 Why computer use is suddenly so good
05:12 How an agent reordered Dan's 8,000-word story
07:31 Turning an editor's taste into an AI skill
09:44 How to build a skill without writing it yourself
10:49 Using evals to make your skills better over time
12:45 Should you go deep on one AI platform?
15:29 Nathan's AI workflow for following up after events
18:24 Why Dan is so optimistic about AI
20:55 The three stages of adapting to new technology
23:59 Ambition in the age of AI
25:30 Why creators should stay diversified
26:01 Building an app for your audience in a weekend
27:08 Why every creator can now have a feed
29:08 How Dan uses custom feeds to run Every
31:06 Everyone can now work like Ryan Holiday
32:08 Why AI curation hasn't caught up with creation
32:51 Frontier alerts and writing for each reader
34:29 Why Every is hiring more engineers than ever
37:02 Why Dan says the newsletter is dead
40:21 When your open rate drops to zero
41:05 Seth Godin and being missed when you don't publish
42:27 Why OpenAI and Claude will build a new inbox
43:43 What actually replaces email?
46:26 How Dan is positioning Every for what's next
47:25 Why Every may stop chasing email signups
48:35 Pushing content through MCP servers
49:52 What creators should do to get ready
51:59 Why quality matters more than ever
54:00 What a high-quality audience has done for Dan
55:21 Why Nathan is underusing his AI tools
56:44 The Eight Levels of AI
58:02 How Every makes money
58:53 Splitting Every into frontier and product teams
1:01:56 Pirates vs architects
1:02:41 Kit's App Store and the cost of experiments
1:03:54 How Every launches experiments it won't support
1:06:04 Dan's hot take on AI and jobs
1:07:23 What Andrew Carnegie's story teaches us
1:08:07 What Dan is reading right now
1:10:24 Where to start with Every
1:11:05 Final thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Dan:
X: https://x.com/danshipper
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/danshipper
Website: https://danshipper.com
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@EveryInc/videos

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
Every: https://every.to
How Codex Happened: https://every.to/p/how-codex-happened
The Eight Levels of AI Adoption: https://every.to/guides/the-eight-levels-of-ai-adoption
After Automation: https://every.to/chain-of-thought/after-automation

Highlights:
02:43 Why Dan writes by talking out loud to his AI
08:35 Turning 40,000 copy edits into a "Kate pass"
21:17 The agency rupture everyone feels with AI
37:29 Why the newsletter as we know it is dead
47:25 The one number Every might stop chasing

Do you want to know how to get into rooms with people who are several levels above you?

Jayson Gaignard is the reason about 50 of my favorite entrepreneur friends are in my life. He’s the founder of Mastermind Talks, an invite-only community for entrepreneurs, and the author of Community Made, which breaks down exactly how to build those key relationships yourself.

In this episode, Jayson shares how to find your people, invest in them, and ask for help. We get into how to host your own event when you can’t get an invite, the three ways to get access to people above your level, and why “How can I help?” is the wrong question to ask.

If you want to build relationships with people you admire, this is the episode to watch.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:23 How Jayson connected Nathan to 50 entrepreneur friends
02:15 Why Jayson wasn't always a super connector
02:57 The loneliness that led to Mastermind Dinners
04:14 Never beg for a seat when you can build your own table
05:29 Why the host gets the most status in the room
06:14 Lower-lift ways to bring people together
06:49 How Summit Series started with a ski trip
08:57 Start with the easiest yes
09:28 The anchor tenant strategy
10:27 Nathan's author mastermind with James Clear
11:06 Partnering to host the room
12:35 Organizing a team to play above your level
13:21 Will Guidara's gratitude for being invited
14:51 Buying access and the speed of relationships
15:43 Money, moxie, and service
15:58 Andrew Wilkinson's $57,000 lunch with Bill Ackman
17:58 Moxie and the power of cold emails
19:30 The man who stood up Mark Zuckerberg
20:45 Nathan chickens out of meeting his heroes
22:55 Eight seconds of courage
24:02 Leaving energy vs. lingering energy
24:47 Nathan's 45-second intro to Chris Brogan
25:44 How a quick hello led to a call with Steven Bartlett
27:06 Why you shouldn't put people on a pedestal
27:53 Abundance vs. scarcity when meeting people
29:47 Service and Ryan Holiday's apprenticeship
31:20 Why Benjamin Graham told Warren Buffett he was overpriced
31:58 Why "How can I help?" is the wrong question
32:18 How Jayson built a relationship with Shep Gordon
33:12 How to offer help that's actually specific
36:00 The relationships that weigh you down
38:55 Why all relationships go dormant naturally
39:45 Why entrepreneurs and creators feel isolated
41:17 Craft + Commerce as an annual pilgrimage
42:35 Conferences vs. masterminds vs. communities
46:00 Conversations that normally take years
48:00 Do great work and your network will find you
49:55 How great work raises your hit rate
51:54 Why you're not ready for Diary of a CEO
53:35 Putting in the reps on camera
54:28 Ramit Sethi's advice on media training
56:39 Increasing your surface area of luck
59:38 Jayson's friends-only email updates
1:02:06 The email that saved MMT in 2020
1:04:59 Who to include on your update list
1:05:50 Nathan's missing annual review
1:07:22 The 90-minute quarterly update
1:08:17 A fan base vs. a community
1:09:59 Curating like the bouncer at the club
1:10:36 Kit's triads and MMT's MM3s
1:15:00 People come for content, stay for community
1:15:47 The ask, give, praise model
1:18:26 How praise reinforces the value of the network
1:21:02 Praise cards mailed 90 days later
1:24:18 Why the book is called Community Made
1:27:06 Final thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Jayson:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jaysongaignard
X: https://x.com/jaysongaignard
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jaysongaignard
Website: https://www.jaysongaignard.com

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
MMT: https://mmt.community
Community Made: https://communitymade.com

Highlights:
02:22 Jayson had two people at his bachelor party
24:02 Leaving energy vs. lingering energy
49:55 Why great work changes your hit rate on everything
1:02:06 The friends-only email that saved MMT
1:21:02 The praise cards Jayson mails out 90 days later

The story you leave out of your content could be the reason someone connects with your work.

I sat down with Philip McKernan, author of One Last Talk, who has helped Olympians and World Cup athletes and consulted with the US Army and the Pentagon. We get into why your origin story matters, how to recognise the gifts you undervalue, and why the fear that drives success can eventually become exhausting. Philip walks me through his framework connecting story, gift, and impact, then coaches me live through my discomfort with promoting my upcoming book. A simple drawing exercise leads to a challenge I wasn’t expecting about who I’m letting down by holding back.

If you’re building a personal brand but feel uncomfortable sharing your story or promoting your work, I think you’ll get a lot out of this conversation.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
02:00 The business pitch that needed a personal story
07:00 Philip’s own origin story
11:00 Helping an athlete reconnect with his purpose
17:00 Finding the gift you overlook
21:00 When fear-driven ambition becomes exhausting
24:00 Why I’m not afraid of my business disappearing
34:00 Buying a castle when business was down 95%
38:00 Building a better relationship with yourself
40:00 Why asking for help feels uncomfortable
43:00 Philip coaches me through a drawing exercise
47:00 The challenge I wasn’t expecting
54:00 Why being visible can feel frightening
57:00 An exercise to uncover your story
1:03:00 Understanding what your happiest days reveal
1:09:00 Learning from your darkest days
1:16:00 How sharing your story creates connection
1:18:00 Final thoughts and where to find Philip

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Philip:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/philip_mckernan/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/philip-mckernan
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@philipmckernan
Website: https://philipmckernan.com

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://kit.com
One Last Talk: https://onelasttalk.com
The Ladders of Wealth: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/The-Ladders-of-Wealth/Nathan-Barry/9798893312393

Highlights:
02:00 The business pitch that needed a personal story
21:00 When fear-driven ambition becomes exhausting
43:00 Philip coaches me live
47:00 Why we undervalue our own work
57:00 An exercise to uncover your story

Most creators try to grow by posting more. More content, more platforms, more hours. But the biggest creators and thought leaders grow in a very different way, and most of it happens behind the scenes.

I sat down with Domonkos "Doma" Eross, founder of Flowin, a creative agency for thought leaders, to talk about what actually drives audience growth right now. We get into his seven strategic steps to succeed as a thought leader, why creator partnerships are the number one source of growth in the creator economy, and Doma’s outreach technique for landing dream clients.

If you've ever wanted to know the systems the biggest creators use to consistently grow their audiences, I think you'll get a lot out of this conversation.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:33 How Doma started working with thought leaders
03:03 Why direct outreach works
03:33 The Manchester United cold email
05:05 Why a well-packaged pitch gets attention
06:49 Using credibility to get past the first filter
08:06 How office hours turned into clients
09:13 Leaving energy vs lingering energy
10:13 Why curiosity beats a target list
11:59 How your network compounds
12:54 The seven steps to succeed as a thought leader
13:18 Step 1: Develop exceptional knowledge first
14:17 Step 2: Define your mission and theory of change
16:19 Step 3: Build an ecosystem strategy
18:21 Matching your ecosystem to how you make money
19:51 Step 4: Turn your ideas into the right content
21:18 Protecting clients from the wrong projects
22:38 Step 5: Build the right team
23:12 Why team size and influence don't correlate
24:55 How James Clear decides what to work on
26:32 Building a team around impact
28:26 The most surprising role on a thought leader's team
30:53 What thought leaders know about saying no
32:17 Focus on your craft and outsource the rest
33:22 Step 6: Creator partnerships, the #1 source of growth
35:14 Why Creator Network works better than list swaps
37:19 How partnerships work at a smaller scale
39:00 How much growth Creator Network drives
40:27 Why partnerships are a win-win
41:22 Set up partnerships before your podcast episode airs
44:27 Why the creator economy isn't competitive
46:32 What Doma has learned from his clients
47:57 Step 7: Build and perfect your organic channels
48:13 Why your newsletter is the only channel you own
49:56 Building a newsletter that sounds like you
53:05 The three phases of a book launch
54:15 Teasing your book in your newsletter
55:26 Why you need to book podcasts months ahead
56:08 The concentrated strike approach
56:34 How to pitch the biggest podcasts
58:48 Which podcasts actually sell books
59:50 The people behind podcast bookings
1:01:36 Using a live event to launch a book
1:03:37 How Doma runs Flowin
1:05:08 Why Doma doesn't want to scale
1:06:40 Final thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Doma:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/domonkoseross
Website: https://flowin.consulting

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
Flowin: https://flowin.consulting

Highlights:
03:33 The Manchester United cold email
13:18 Why thought leadership is the result, not the goal
24:55 How James Clear decides what to work on
33:22 The #1 source of growth in the creator economy
53:05 The three phases of a book launch

Personal brand has become one of the biggest buzzwords in the creator world. Creators everywhere are launching offers, building funnels, and posting consistently, yet very few are creating something people actually remember.

I sat down with Chris Do, Emmy award-winning designer and founder of The Futur, to talk about what it really takes to build a personal brand that stands out. We get into why most creators end up serviceable but forgettable, why branding comes down to differentiation, and the three-part framework behind brands people obsess over. Chris also shares why the real work of personal branding happens internally, how to find your voice phrase, and the trust triangle that decides who audiences believe. Partway through, he turns the interview around and starts coaching me, and we go much deeper than I expected.

If you're building a personal brand and wondering why it isn't resonating yet, I think you'll get a lot out of this conversation.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:39 What it means to un-bland yourself
02:48 Why branding is all about differentiation
03:04 Why Apple has a brand and Dell doesn't
04:31 How status and identity drive what we buy
07:29 How Target built a brand
10:42 How Kit positions its brand
11:44 Moving from features to meaning
14:11 Why most personal brands are really marketing funnels
16:11 Why personal brand work is internal
16:26 How we lose who we really are
19:04 Chris starts asking the questions
20:24 How getting sick at 24 changed Nathan's identity
21:51 Why we tie our identity to what we do
23:03 Who are you outside of your work?
23:36 Why you are the gift
25:51 How Chris answers "who are you?"
26:36 The difference between design and art
28:45 Why being true to yourself comes first
29:45 Nathan's mission
32:24 Why Chris moved from commercial work to content
33:36 Why your brand needs to stand against something
35:44 Finding your keyword and your nemesis
37:03 Why the best heroes have great enemies
40:39 The three-part personal brand framework
41:49 Chris's own brand triangle
42:33 Workshopping Nathan's personal brand
43:30 Separating who you are from your company
44:44 The story behind Chris's mission
47:25 Why all strategy is autobiographical
48:13 Nathan on feeling like a burden
49:29 Nathan's story about his stepdad
53:49 Chris's read on Nathan's story
56:36 Finding Nathan's rallying cry
59:28 Learning to accept help
1:01:26 Why we trust people who aren't perfect online
1:02:00 The trust triangle
1:04:52 How to find your voice phrase
1:08:21 Final thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Chris:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thechrisdo
X: https://x.com/thechrisdo
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thechrisdo
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thefutur
Website: https://thefutur.com

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
The Futur: https://thefutur.com

Highlights:
03:04 Why Apple has a brand and Dell doesn't
14:11 Why most personal brands are really marketing funnels
40:39 The three-part framework behind Bryan Johnson's brand
49:14 Chris turns the interview around
1:05:17 How to find your voice phrase

The online business world is changing. People have more information than ever at their fingertips, and the business models that many creators started out selling aren't converting the way they used to.

I sat down with Jasmine Star to talk about why traditional courses and memberships are becoming harder to sell, and the new hybrid offer model she now teaches her clients. We get into how to build offers around specific customer results, how to find out what people will actually pay for before you build, and Jasmine’s four-step framework for building a consistent $10K/month business. She also shares how she delivers high-touch coaching at scale, and the best ways to build trust with your audience in today’s “trust recession”.

If you’re building an online business and wondering what types of offers still work in today’s crowded online space, I think you’ll get a lot out of this conversation.

Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
01:18 Jasmine’s first digital offer
04:00 How her $197 course made $255K
04:40 Why she built a membership
06:22 The problem with traditional memberships
08:28 Building Social Curator
10:27 The creator economy after 2020
12:07 Why courses and memberships stopped working
13:12 The hybrid offer
16:40 How to price an offer
20:02 Turning coaching into a scalable offer
22:27 Who the offer is for
24:28 The 90-day $10K offer
26:30 The $4K Freedom Formula
29:32 How to keep clients accountable
33:50 Why asynchronous coaching works
35:36 Scaling coaching to hundreds of clients
39:25 How to market the offer
44:01 Using webinars to sell
47:13 Why long-form content is coming back
50:04 Measuring content performance
52:43 How Jasmine met Nathan
53:41 How to get high-value clients
55:29 Creating an offer people will pay for
59:55 Finding the right audience
1:00:49 Getting your messaging right
1:04:26 Finding your customer's pain point
1:06:10 Using DMs to build trust
1:09:38 Building a personal brand
1:11:48 Final thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Jasmine:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasminestar
Website: https://www.jasminestar.com
X: https://x.com/jasminestar
LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/jasmine-star
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@officialjasminestar

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
Social Curator: https://www.socialcurator.com

Highlights:
03:38 How Jasmine made $255,000 in five days
12:07 Why courses are no longer enough
17:31 How to find what people will actually pay for
33:50 People already have the information
36:15 Why Jasmine’s ROI guarantee isn't a money-back guarantee

Should you sell your business, or build it to own forever? Ankur Nagpal sold Teachable for $250 million and Carry for $76 million. I bootstrapped Kit and turned down a $200 million acquisition offer from Spotify. We took very different paths as founders.

I sat down with Ankur to break down why we made those choices and how they've played out. We get into the key considerations for selling a company vs. building it to own forever, why raising venture capital can quietly trap founders into a specific kind of business, and the hiring and go-to-market tactics Ankur used to build two companies from scratch.

Ankur also shares how founders can use the QSBS tax break to keep millions more from an exit.

If you've ever thought about selling your business, or you're trying to decide whether to bootstrap or raise venture capital, this is the episode to listen to before you make that call.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:37 Teachable's Story
03:39 Why Ankur Sold Teachable
04:47 Nathan's Approach to Building
07:16 Building to Sell vs. Building to Keep
08:34 Carry's Story
09:30 Understanding QSBS Tax Benefits
16:06 Being Bought vs. Having to Sell
16:40 Why Raise Capital for Carry?
18:25 Bootstrapping vs. VC
22:54 Lessons for Second-Time Founders
26:10 Ankur's Next Chapter: USVC
28:36 Recruiting Great Talent
32:24 Our Contrarian Beliefs
34:50 Go-to-Market Strategies
39:18 Ankur's AI Content Strategy
46:25 Staying Focused
48:58 Content Workflows
59:16 Product Market Fit Evolution
01:02:08 Closing Thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Ankur:
X: https://twitter.com/ankurnagpal
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ankurnagpal
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ankurna

Featured in this episode:
Teachable: https://teachable.com
Carry: https://carry.com

Highlights:
03:00 The Perfect Exit?
10:40 QSBS Tax Benefits For Founders
18:30 Bootstrapped vs. VC: Which is Higher Status?
23:20 Product Market Fit for Second-Time Founders
32:20 Our Contrarian Beliefs

What does it take to turn a YouTube channel into a valuable, sellable business? That's what I wanted to explore with this week’s guest, Tyler Chou (aka The Creators' Attorney).

Having spent 20 years as an entertainment attorney at giants like Disney and BuzzFeed, Tyler now represents some of YouTube's biggest channels, helping them navigate exits and build sustainable enterprises.

In this episode, Tyler pulls back the curtain on the legal mistakes creators often make, the crucial steps to take to protect your assets, and why sometimes, a creator doesn't need to sell at all - they just need a sabbatical. Tyler shares insights on how to build a business that can eventually sell for 8 or 9 figures, and what investors are really looking for beyond just views.

Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction
01:09 Private equity looks to buy YouTube channels
03:52 Creator burnout
04:52 Protecting your IP and avoiding mistakes
08:20 Diversifying revenue beyond AdSense and brand deals
10:43 Avoiding misclassification lawsuits
12:46 The problem with reaction channels
17:45 Why buyers love recurring revenue and technical products
23:11 The power of artificial scarcity
28:20 How to make your brand less dependent on the creator
37:48 Should creators sell their business?
43:49 You might need a sabbatical, not an exit
45:00 How to protect yourself from predatory buyers
51:08 Hiring operators to run products
54:19 The power of angel investors on your cap table
56:29 The value of books for creators
1:11:08 Building a network of channels
1:14:10 Where to find Tyler

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Tyler:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TheCreatorsAttorney
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thecreatorsattorney
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thecreatorsattorney

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com

Highlights:
01:38 - Why private equity is buying YouTube channels
07:50 - The power of building independent revenue streams
12:58 - Why reaction channels are worthless to buyers
38:00 - The surprising downsides of taking an exit
59:20 - The power of books for creator credibility