The Other 22 Hours

We often treat commercial success as the final destination of a creative life, but for legendary songwriter Matraca Berg, it was just the first act. She was the first woman to have five different country No. 1s in a single year and her songs have been recorded by everyone from Linda Ronstadt, Trisha Yearwood, and Deana Carter to the Chicks, Chris Stapleton, and Reba McEntire. Matraca’s catalog defines generations of American songwriting.

We sit down the GRAMMY-nominated member of the Songwriting Hall of Fame to explore the realities of achieving massive success while battling paralyzing stage fright, the transition from the multi-platinum physical sales era of the 1990s to modern streaming, and how she keeps her creative tank full as the industry has changed around her. In a culture obsessed with youth and immediate output, Matraca offers a grounded, reassuring perspective on aging within an art form, artistic alignment, and learning to trust.

In This Episode:

• Matraca Berg
• Ep 147 - Jeff Hanna
• Sudie Calloway
• Mel Tillis
• Joni Mitchell
• Bluebird Cafe
• Clint Black
• Nanci Griffith
• Ep 60 - Lori McKenna
• Bobby Braddock
• Harlan Howard
• Ashley McBryde
• Gary Harrison
• Ep 28 - The Wood Brothers
• Zach Berkman
• Tiger King
• Chris Stapleton
• Ella Langley
• Jessi Colter
• Waylon Jennings
• Maggie Gyllenhaal
• Peter Sarsgaard
• Hill Country Barbecue
• Jake Gyllenhaal
• Minnie Pearl

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

Behind nearly every influential indie-rock and pop record of the last 15 years has been the brilliant mind and hand of string arranger and multi-instrumentalist Rob Moose. The three-time GRAMMY winner has contributed to thousands of records by the likes of Paul Simon, Taylor Swift, Phoebe Bridgers, Bon Iver, St. Vincent, Bruce Hornsby, and Mumford & Sons. In this calming, deeply reflective conversation, Rob opens up about "peaking" in the live touring industry, the transition to a studio-centric life, and how fatherhood has introduced a powerful focus into his creative process. It is an exploration of legacy, creative boundaries, and why sustaining a 20-year career ultimately comes down to treating music not as an athletic feat, but as a deeply human relationship.

In This Episode:

• Rob Moose
• Manhattan School of Music
• Columbia University
• The New School
• Interlochen Arts Academy
• Nirvana
• Bon Iver
• SNL
• Paul Simon
• Madison Square Garden
• Bowery Ballroom
• ‘The Artist’s Way’ - Julia Cameron
• Nonesuch Records
• Gabe Kahane

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

To celebrate our 150th episode, we try a bit of an experiment: interviewing ourselves, for the first time. After nearly two decades of partnership, we examine the evolution of the creative self. Michaela Anne – whose fifth record, 'These Are The Days,' marks her first in over a 10 years for which she retains total ownership – discusses the "massive shift of self" required to walk away from industry gatekeepers. Aaron Shafer-Haiss, whose compositions have scored major network dramas like 'Station 19' and 'The Good Doctor,' reflects on the "utilitarian creativity" of a producer. It is a conversation about resilience, the "growth seesaw" of a creative marriage, and the realization that the dream is already happening.

In This Episode:

• Michaela Anne
• Aaron Shafer-Haiss
• ‘These Are The Days’
• Ep 109 Major Jackson
• Nonesuch Records
• Hardly Strictly Bluegrass Festival
• Bonnaroo
• Cayamo
• Mountain Stage
• Folks Fest
• Middle Tennessee State University
• Owen Biddle
• Seth Taylor
• Ethan Ballinger
• Kyshona
• Lyle Davinsky
• Lauren Balthrop
• Post Malone

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

Molly Tuttle has shared stages with Ringo Starr and Billy Strings, yet she still grapples with the unpredictable "ups and downs" of a musician's schedule, and the inherent instability of the road. We talk with the GRAMMY-winning artist, and first woman to win IBMA Guitarist of the Year, about the "baggage" of turning a passion into a profession. We explore the necessity of trusting one's gut over industry expectations, how she navigates the transition from bluegrass traditionalism to rock-leaning solo projects, and the quiet power of a partner who understands the nuance of tour routing.

In This Episode:

• Molly Tuttle
• Nonesuch Records
• Tyler Childers
• Berklee College of Music
• Ep 3 - The Milk Carton Kids
• The Goodbye Girls
• The Stray Birds
• Ozark Mountain Folk Center
• First Ladies of Bluegrass
• Alison Brown
• Ep 50 - Sierra Hull
• Missy Raines
• Becky Buller
• Ketch Secor
• Old Crow Medicine Show
• Chris Stapleton
• Ep 28 - The Wood Brothers

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

Ray Benson is an absolute pillar of American music, a nine-time GRAMMY winner whose band, Asleep at the Wheel, has defined western swing for over half a century. In this conversation, we talk with Ray about the "geographical imperative," rebuilding his career from a broke-down bus to a musical institution, and the delicate balance between the craft of music and the business of image. This is an exploration of longevity, team building, and the importance of finding a "moral compass" in leadership.

In This Episode:

• Ray Benson
• Asleep at the Wheel
• Peter, Paul, and Mary
• Pete Seeger
• Woody Guthrie
• Van Cliburn
• Lester Flatt
• Marty Stuart
• Marc Copland
• Paul Motian
• John Abercrombie
• George Strait
• Vince Gill
• Tower Records
• “The Letter Johnny Walker Read”
• Merle Haggard
• Lawrence Wright
• Mumford and Sons
• Aaron Dessner
• T.S. Elliot
• Health Alliance for Austin Musicians
• Chris Scruggs
• Molly Tuttle
• Ep 86 - Tommy Emmanuel

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

As a founding member of the legendary Nitty Gritty Dirt Band and a three-time Grammy winner, Jeff Hanna has navigated nearly sixty years in the industry, which also includes credits with the likes of Linda Ronstadt, Emmylou Harris, Johnny Cash, and many others. In this conversation we explore the geography of inspiration, from the 1970s Troubadour scene to his forty-year anchor in Nashville’s songwriting community. Jeff reflects on the economy of a perfect line, the creative vitality of a "hard reset," and why the bedrock of the work has to begin with the simple intention of having fun.

In This Episode:

• Jeff Hanna
• Nitty Gritty Dirt Band
• Matraca Berg
• Ep 16 - Rodey Crowell
• The Troubador
• The Station Inn
• Vinyl Tap
• Jackson Browne
• Tim Buckley
• Poco
• Ep 144 - Suzy Bogguss
• Ep 43 - Gretchen Peters
• Stephen King - On Writing
• Jerry Jeff Walker - Mr Bogangles
• The Mavericks
• Ringo Starr
• Levon Helm
• Sheryl Crow
• Fred Eltringham

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

As the architect behind Rolling Stone Country and the host of the Nashville Now podcast, Joe Hudak has spent decades at the center of the industry. Along with Alison Abbey Hudak, a veteran editor who has shaped the narrative of Nashville’s elite lifestyle media, they offer a wealth of experience in creative survival. This conversation dives into the "show business" of art , the moral weight of elevating artists who mismanage their influence, and the courage required to admit when a prestigious career has stifled your creative brain.

In This Episode:

• Joe Hudak
• Allison Abbey Hudak
• Jonathan Bernstein
• “People Are Drinking Less Than Ever. What’s Country Music to Do?” - Rolling Stone
• Carly Pearce
• Keslea Ballerini
• Sterling Drake
• Marissa Moss
• Nashville Lifestyles
• Ep 47 Margo Price & Jeremy Ivey
• Carl Jung

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

What happens to the creative spirit when you have been a professional "lifer" since the age of nine? Derek Trucks, widely considered one of the greatest guitarists of all time and a veteran of the Allman Brothers Band and Eric Clapton’s touring lineup, joins us to discuss longevity and leading a 12-piece musical circus. We explore the gradual shift from student to teacher, the grounding force of a musical marriage, and the essential practice of "turning the crops" to stay inspired.

In This Episode:

• Tedeschi Trucks Band
• Allman Brothers Band
• The Beacon Theater
• Eric Clapton
• Kofi Burbridge
• John Lee Hooker
• Koko Taylor
• Ace Moreland
• Colonel Bruce Hampton
• Buddy Guy
• Joe Walsh
• Gregg Allman
• Jim Scott
• Tom Dowd
• A Love Supreme
• Krishnamurti
• Mad Dogs & Englishman (movie)

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

How does an artist outlast the industry machine to build a career entirely on her own terms? We sit down with GRAMMY-winner, ACM Vocalist of the year, and CMA Horizon Award recipient Suzy Bogguss to explore the evolution of a 40-year career that spans platinum records and her 2026 induction into the Grand Ole Opry. This conversation is an invitation to reconsider what we value, moving away from the noise of the major label machine and toward a philosophy of quality over quantity, independence, and the deep community.

In This Episode:

• Suzy Bogguss
• Matraca Berg
• Jeff Hanna
• Ep 43 - Gretchen Peters
• Patty Loveless
• Ep 46 - Mary Chapin Carpenter
• Capitol Records
• CAA
• Kathy Mattea
• Folk Alliance
• Ep 16 - Rodney Crowell
• Chet Atkins

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.

GRAMMY-nominated songwriter Amythyst Kiah has performed with Moby and Billy Strings and is a member of the supergroup Our Native Daughters. She joins us for a startlingly honest look at the "farce of surface-level success." After a label debut and a whirlwind of global exposure, she found herself "barely hanging on for dear life" amidst the pressure of a rat race industry. We explore her journey to achieve detachment from outcomes, writing for sync licensing (film + TV) as a creative recharge, and the ancient wisdom that helped her trade the self-improvement doom loop for a slower, sustainable creative life.

In This Episode:

• Amaythyst Kiah
• Our Native Daughters
• Brian Eno
• ‘Music for Airports’
• Allison Russell
• ‘Tao Te Ching’
• Marcus Aurelius
• ‘Siddhartha’

Go Deeper:

• Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
• Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
• Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

The Hosts:

The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).

• More about Aaron’s work.
• More about Michaela Anne’s work.

Credits: 

Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.