In this conversation, Dan sits down with performance coach and former trader Denise Shull, author of
Market Mind Games and the real-life inspiration for Wendy Rhoades on
Billions. Denise explains why the old mantra “take the emotion out of trading” is scientifically wrong—and how learning to work with your emotions, instead of against them, can dramatically improve your decision-making. From intuition and regret to boredom, ADHD and market regime changes, this episode redefines what it means to be a “disciplined” trader.
In This Episode, You’ll Discover:
Why every decision requires emotion
How modern neuroscience shows that perception is prediction—and that your brain is constantly asking, “Is this good or bad for me?” before you ever place a trade.
Emotions as data—not distractions
The difference between “integral” emotions (about the trade and market) and “incidental” emotions (about you, your P&L, identity and history), and why separating the two is a core trading edge.
How to use intuition without going “on tilt”
Why true intuition is unconscious pattern recognition built from experience (like a chef knowing a steak is done by sight) and when “I feel good about this trade” is useful versus dangerous.
A practical method to blend logic and gut feel
Denise’s 1–7 conviction/emotion scale, how granular emotional language improves performance and how to consciously factor “how much do I really believe this?” into your trading process.
The real role of regret and how slumps start
Why trying to “stay positive” can backfire, how unprocessed regret leads to trading slumps and how to use negative emotions to actually improve instead of burying them.
Cutting the worst 5% of your trades
How recognizing fear of future regret and choosing your “flavor of regret” can help you avoid revenge trades, impulse trades and the handful of decisions that wreck your year.
Managing boredom and ADHD tendencies
Practical ways traders can keep boredom from morphing into overtrading—by defining time frames, having intentional breaks and non-trading activities, and challenging the myth that you must always be in the market.
Adapting to market regime changes
How to think about market environments like different “genres of music,” why you don’t need to catch the exact top or bottom and how ego and the need to feel smart can sabotage regime shifts.
The one daily practice Denise recommends
The simple but powerful question—“What am I feeling and why?”—and how regularly sorting feelings into “about me” vs. “about the market” aligns you with how the human brain actually works.
About Our Guest – Denise Shull
Denise Shull is a former CBOE floor trader turned performance coach specializing in decision-making under risk and uncertainty. She holds a master’s degree in neuropsychoanalysis from the University of Chicago, traded at firms like Schonfeld, and later ran a day trading desk during the internet boom. Her work shows how emotion and cognition are intertwined in every decision—a theme she explores in her book Market Mind Games, which helped inspire the Wendy Rhoades character on Showtime’s Billions. Today, she coaches hedge fund managers, traders, and elite athletes around the world on how to use emotions and intuition as a competitive edge.
Options involve risk and are not suitable for all investors. Prior to buying or selling an option, investors must read Characteristics and Risks of Standardized Options (ODD) which can be found at https://www.theocc.com/company-information/documents-and-archives/options-disclosure-document
Don’t trade with money you are not prepared to lose. Anything discussed on this show is intended to be generalized information and not intended to be a recommendation to buy or sell any security. The host and guests are not familiar with listeners’ specific situations. For trading information relevant to your specific needs, speak with a licensed broker or advisor.
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