On September 16th, Morocco became the 60th country to ratify the High Seas Treaty, triggering a countdown to January, when the treaty will officially enter into force.

The High Seas Treaty establishes a kind of “rules of the road” for international waters that lie beyond the jurisdiction of any single country—particularly around conservation and the preservation of ocean biodiversity. At the core of the High Seas Treaty is the creation of Marine Protected Areas—think of them as national parks for the high seas. And even though the treaty has not yet entered into force, it is already influencing ocean conservation efforts, according to my guest today, Nichola Clark, a senior officer for ocean governance at the Pew Charitable Trusts.

We begin by discussing why the international community felt the need for a High Seas Treaty in the first place, and then trace the story of how this agreement came to life. We wrap up with a conversation about what the treaty has already accomplished—and what it may achieve in the near future.

This episode is produced in partnership with Lex International Fund, a philanthropic initiative dedicated to strengthening international law to solve global challenges. It’s part of our ongoing series highlighting the real-world impact of treaties on state behavior, called “When Treaties Work.”