This is our unabridged interview with Musa al-Gharbi. 

 Society has never been more focused on equality and diversity… right?

 The last few decades have been marked by a drastic increase in what often gets labeled “social justice.” Companies and individuals perpetually take very public vows to defend progressive values and denounce all kinds of injustice. But somehow, in spite of all this, social and economic inequalities have only worsened. How is this possible?

 “The fundamental tension,” argues Musa al-Gharbi, “is that while a lot of us are committed to social justice, we also really want to be elites.” Musa makes the case that an excess of public symbolic gestures has created a backwards world where justice is preached but rarely done, offering a sharp critique of the ways many of us, on all sides of politics and culture, have used social justice as a subtle way to serve ourselves.

 Show Notes

 Resources:

 "We Have Never Been Woke" by Musa al-Gharbi

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 PDF of Lee’s Interview Notes

 Transcript of Abridged Episode

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