The importance of including the spiritual dimension in coaching is increasingly acknowledged, but weaving it into the world of coaching can feel clunky. In this conversation with coach and founder Saniel Bonder we explore the spirit/matter split, the language of awakening, the dynamics of spiritual hierarchies and the integration of coaching and spiritual growth. Saniel Bonder is the founder of the Waking Down in Mutuality teachings and recently launched Human Sun Institute and The White-Hot Yoga of the Heart with his wife and teaching partner Linda Groves-Bonder. He has helped hundreds achieve unshakable spiritual awakeness amid the stresses of everyday living. His books include Healing the Spirit/Matter Split and Waking Down.