Cider Chat

Michigan Cider: The Great Cider State with Paula Englin

Michigan has earned its place as a leader in the cider industry, boasting the highest number of hard cider businesses in the U.S. In this episode, Paula Englin, Executive Director of the Michigan Cider Association, discusses the state's growth in cider, the role of education, and how Michigan cider makers are shaping the industry with events like the well known cider competition GLINTCAP – Great Lakes International Cider and Perry competition.

MCA Executive Director Paula Englin

With nearly 195 cider businesses and a thriving community, Michigan truly is The Great Cider State

Growing Michigan Cider: Collaboration & Education

The Michigan Cider Association was founded over a decade ago to bring cider makers together, advocate for legislative needs, and expand consumer awareness. Today, the association focuses on education, providing opportunities for cider makers at all levels—from home enthusiasts to large-scale producers.

One of the recent big initiatives has been working with the Cider Institute, formely known as the Cider Institute of North America (CINA), to offer subsidized cider education. Michigan cider makers have benefited from foundational courses, cider guide certifications for taproom staff, and marketing efforts that drive cider sales across the state.

Mapping Michigan's Cider Scene

Michigan's unique geography, shaped by the Great Lakes, creates an ideal environment for growing apples. Many cider makers source their fruit locally, often within 30 minutes of their production sites. Here's how the cider landscape breaks down:

To use this Hand Map – Hold up your left hand, palm facing outward, with fingers together and thumb extended—this mimics Michigan's Lower Peninsula, often called "The Mitten," with Detroit near the base of the thumb and Traverse City near the tip of your pinky.

• Metro Detroit (Thumb region) – A hub for orchards and cideries, home to well-known producers.
• Southwest Michigan (Pinky side of the mitten) – A mix of wineries and cideries, taking advantage of the region's wine industry crossover.
• Grand Rapids & the Fruit Ridge (Center of the mitten) – A major apple-growing region supplying cideries statewide.
• Traverse City (Top of the mitten) – A destination for cider lovers, known for high-quality cider apples and innovative makers.

Cider Events That Put Michigan on the Map

Michigan's cider industry thrives on consumer engagement, and events play a major role in getting more people to appreciate and support local cider.

• Michigan Apple Festival (Sparta, MI) – A harvest celebration featuring local apple growers, cider producers, and even an apple peeling contest!
• Cider Week Grand Rapids (May 9-17, 2025) – A week of cider-focused events, including pairing dinners, tap takeovers, and a board game night at House Rules in Grand Rapids.
• Grand Rapids Wine, Beer & Food Festival – Showcasing a variety of Michigan ciders to educate new consumers and cider fans alike.

GLINTCAP: Great Lakes International Cider and Perry competition

Michigan is also home to GLINTCAP (Great Lakes International Cider & Perry Competition), the world's largest cider competition. Paula now oversees the event, which continues to grow, introducing a low and no-ABV category for the first time in 2025.

One major shift? Judging is now fully digital, improving feedback delivery and accuracy. The competition also expanded international accessibility, making it easier for cider makers worldwide to participate.

Contant the Michigan Cider Association

• Website: https://michiganciders.com/

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• Totally Cider Tour to the UK – send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for spots opening on this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025 and future cider tours.
• Letter from Patron Rod – Become a patron of Cider Chat via Cider Chat Patreon
• Stone Ridge Orchard May Wassail – follow on Instagram
• Episode 296 Bauman's |Oregon's Destination Farm Cidery

Monica Cohen on Leading the ACA

Monica Cohen, the new CEO of the American Cider Association (ACA), stepped into her role at CiderCon 2025 in Chicago. With a background in dairy marketing and a passion for helping craft industries grow, she brings fresh energy and a bold vision to the cider world.

Her introduction to cider mirrors a challenge the industry faces—many consumers assume all cider is the same.

She's on a mission to change that.

American Cider Association CEO, Monica Cohen Priorities for 2025

Monica laid out her key focus areas for the ACA:

• Enhancing membership value – Ensuring small and large cideries alike benefit from ACA resources.
• Growing ACA membership – Making the association indispensable to cider makers.
• Strengthening advocacy – Fighting for fair industry regulations, including tax structures.
• Increasing consumer awareness – Changing public perception and getting cider on more menus.

Cider's Big Opportunity

Monica believes cider's time is now. She emphasizes that innovation, consumer education, and stronger industry collaboration will be key to the next phase of growth.

CiderCon Takeaways & The Path Forward

At CiderCon 2025, Monica had an "aha moment" during Cider Share, experiencing firsthand the incredible diversity of cider. She sees the event as more than just a conference—it's a place for the cider community to connect, share ideas, and shape the industry's future.

Looking ahead to CiderCon 2026 in Providence Rhode Island, Monica wants to grow attendance, attract new industry partners, and ensure the event remains relevant and impactful for all makers big or small.

Contact the American Cider Association

• Website: https://ciderassociation.org

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• Totally Cider Tour to the UK – send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for spots opening on this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025.

An Unspoken Creed By Sune Kroghansen

Enjoy this special Story in Ciderville from Denmark!

"Roedding

The restart of the cider adventure in Rødding. In the mid-00s, the villagers of Rødding had begun making cider. It faded due to the focus on grafting, planting and nursing the thousands of apple trees in the apple village.

In the fall of 2018, focus was about to change again, apple trees was maturing and a decrease nursing left time for something else. Organized by the association: "Æblets by" — "The Apple Village" a congregation was held, 2 score of interested participants met in the community house of the small village of Rødding in Salling. Amongst was participants living close by in the parish, living in the municipality, the region, and a scarce few from far away. The desire to use the apples for more than just planting. Apple juice production was already a major activity in the village, inspiring the entreprenant townsfolks to move further. Creating activity, community and jobs from the apples grown.

Those present discussed opportunities of diversifying activities, moving into cider production along with vinegar, jam, jelly. During the fall of 2018 and winter of 2019, the first cider was fermented. Apples from the gene bank Pometet Nursery part of, University of Copenhagen. Was used I these ferments.

Inspired by, among others: Andrew Lea, Cider Chat, Cold Hand Winery, University of Copenhagen Department of Plant Sciences. Fermentation and experimentation started with a steep learning curve: Oe, capsules, corks, aglets, disgorging, remuage, tirage, liquere de expedition, brownhat, so2, eggysmell, ester, alcohol taxes, VAT, tankcleaning, oak, food safety control, acid. We tasted, laughed, spit, drank, smelled with a focus on the experience and excitement of the taste experience. We try to greet a new taste or flavour: "I don't know you, what can you do? What makes you shine?"

Of course, everyone has a favorite taste. But experience has taught us. That there is great variation, and "good taste" depends on what the cider is to be used for.

The Cider Club meets regularly. Both with a focus on cozy togetherness but also with a focus on technical details, training cider crafting techniques and in taste and sensory. Promoting spreading the joy of fermented apples.

I don't know if the word "Creed" or "credo" was discussed, I don't think so! however a "spirit" has been underlying everything though unspoken:

The unspoken creed It should taste good. It should be as local as possible. It should preferably be in unmanipulated.

Although "natural" is a well-worn word. It is the idea/spirit/dream that we should strive to find:

The apple or apple cultivars that make good cider. The cultivar should also be able to:

Grow on a healthy, unpruned, untended tree, where we live. They should be easy to press into apple juice. The juice should ferment alone without adding anything other than time. It should be able to keep without any other preservation than a lid.

It may be construde as a naive dream that does not abide into modern production society, nor does it fit efficient agriculture. And probably not even practically possible.

So there have been deviations from the idea along the way. Mostly to follow the first part of the unspoken creed: "it must taste good"

Like a vanilla bean, that tastes fantastic but is not particularly widespread growing in the Danish landscape.

So if kakifruits, sulfur, sugar, oak, pineapple, oranges, erythritol, lactose, pasteurization, elderflowers. Are necessary to achieve "good cider" then so be it.

The Cider Club is a spirit, and a loose part of an international movement of cider from pure apple juice. We strive to include everyone, and avoid selfishness, selfsufficientness. We are not signers of the "New Nordic Food Manifesto of 2004" but looking back it has influenced us tremendously. With a mixture of epicurean joy of life and the joys of the table. Sustainable thinking and naive optimism. The best we can do, each thing in its own time.

BUT we originate from the village of apples so the foundation is the diversity of the old apple cultivars.

The hope is to, create something people will choose to enjoy. And It should be fun along the way. Without ruining anything for the world of tomorrow.

Wasalling!"

Have a story to tell for the "Stories in Ciderville" segment?

• Must be 3000 words or less or under 4 audio minutes
• Apples and pommes must be integrated into the story line
• Send your essay and a recording of yourself reading your essay to [email protected]m

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• Totally Cider Tour to the UK – send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025
• Chicago Cider Week
• Chicago Cider Summit
• CiderCon2025

A sit down Cider Chat with the makers behind Worleys and Honey's Cider!

Neil Worley was last on this podcast back in 2016 on episode 26! He and Ria met up at CiderCon which was being held that year in Portland Oregon. Neil's episode on Keeving, a basic how-to, has been a perennical favorite for listeners. Kimberly Jones took over Honey's Cider in 2019 for Bob Honey. Both makers are based in Somerset and each have their own unique style and approach to making Cider.

Neil and Kim Craft Ciders Made at Worley and Honey's

Worley Cider:

• Special Reserve Keeved Cider – winner of the Golden Fork award
• Medium Dry Bottled Cider
• Find Worley at Frome Weekly Market

Honey's Ciders

• Midford Cider (Medium Dry)
• Cam Valley Cider
• Stony Bonk (Cider-Ginger Beer Blend)

Kimberly Jones In this Cider Chat with Worleys and Honey's

Neil and Kim have observed a shift in cider preferences, with still ciders flourishing outdoors. Neil's experiments in keeving and controlled oxidation highlight the scientific precision he applies to cider making. Meanwhile, Kim is expanding Honey's range with blends tailored to local heritage.

How to find Worleys and Honey's Cider

Visit the Froome Independent Market from March to December on the first Sunday of each month for a chance to taste their creations.

cider to go in classic Bag in Box Contact info for Worleys and Honey's Cider

• Worleys – https://www.worleyscider.co.uk/
• Honey's – http://www.honeyscider.co.uk

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• Totally Cider Tour to the UK – send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025
• Chicago Cider Week
• Chicago Cider Summit
• CiderCon2025 Promo Code – Once you get to the registration form, towards the end of the first page you'll reach a section in the form that says "additional registration information" and there is a question: If you have a coupon, please enter code here (case-sensitive): CiderChat

Albert Johnson on Ross on Wye Cider & Perry Offerings

This is the 3rd time we have featured Albert Johnson because it is always a treat to hear about the happenings at Ross on Wye Cider and Perry. In particular, we catch up on the accommodations on site for visitors and of course the wide range of single varietal ciders.

Albert Johnson In this Cider Chat

Visitor Experiences and Accommodations Discussion on camping, bed & breakfast options, and orchard chalets. Includes details on the Yew Tree pub and its offerings.

Cider Offerings and Unique Styles Explanation of single varietal ciders, dry cider philosophy, and production techniques.

Events and Festivals Highlights of monthly cider clubs, Ciderganza, Summertime Soiree, and the Ross Cider Fest.

Cider Pairing Insights Recommendations for pairing cider with specific dishes, including creamy pastas, fish, and spicy curries.

Social Media and Community Engagement Albert's approach to outreach via tastings, social media, and fostering personal connections.

Future Plans and Challenges Focus on growth strategies, challenges in the UK cider market, and maintaining the unique identity of Ross on Wye.

Conclusion and Final Thoughts Reflection on the importance of community, passion for cider, and welcoming visitors to Ross on Wye.

B&B Breakfast by Aunt Hillary at Broome Farm B&B Event Calendar at Ross

• Ross Cider Fest: Starts the Thursday after the August Bank Holiday (varies yearly, e.g., August 28 in 2025).
• Ciderganza: Easter weekend.
• Summertime Soiree
• Ross-tober-fest:

Contact for Ross on Wye Cider and Perry Company Yew Tree Pub, Ross on Wye Cider and Perry Co.

• Website: rosscider.com

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• Totally Cider Tour to the UK – send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025
• Snowcapped Cider | Colorado
• CiderCon2025 Promo Code – Once you get to the registration form, towards the end of the first page you'll reach a section in the form that says "additional registration information" and there is a question: If you have a coupon, please enter code here (case-sensitive): CiderChat

Past Episodes with Albert Johnson

• 410: International Perry Panel | CiderCon 2024
• 404: Ross Cider and Perry is Lit!
• 194: The Reason for Being | Ross on Wye Cider & Perry, UK

Bob Cork's Cider Career Bob Cork

• Bob Cork has 40 years of experience in cider making, starting in 1980.
• Initially an apprentice engineer, he transitioned to cider making, thanks to his engineering background.
• He now works as a cider-making consultant, still contributing to the legacy of Showering Cider Mill.

The Evolution of Showering Cider Mill and Babycham Entrance to Showering Mill

• Showering Cider Mill, made an undeniable mark for a perry called Babycham.
• The mill has evolved over the years, modernizing its equipment while maintaining traditional cider-making techniques.
• During the production of Babycham, horizontal tanks for producing this widely popular drink. At the time they were laid outside and eventually a buidlign was built around the tanks.
• The Shepton Mallet Cider Mill is the second largest mill in the UK and over the years it expanded to include a variety of ciders, while continuing to produce Babycham, the popular Fever brand and today a traditional cider called Showering Triple Vintage.

The Traditional and Modern Blend: The Triple Vintage Matthew, Daniel, Jonathan Showering and Ria Windcaller

The Triple Vintage cider, created by the Showerings blends three vintages to produce a high-quality product.

Bob Cork in this episode discusses how it is made using bittersweet and bittersharp apples, fermented with a wee bit of natural yeast and then a cultured yeast. The cider is matured to achieve a balanced, high-quality cider. Key to the cider-making process, is low-temperature fermentation and controlled maturation.

Bob Cork's Advice for Aspiring Cider Makers

• Bob advises aspiring cider makers to approach the craft with passion, as it requires significant investment and a long-term commitment.
  • He emphasizes the importance of a solid business plan and understanding the market's cyclical nature.
  • Despite the challenges, he believes in the future of cider, with increasing consumer interest in high-quality, craft ciders.

Mention in this Cider Chat

• CiderCon2025 Promo Code – Once you get to the registration form, towards the end of the first page you'll reach a section in the form that says "additional registration information" and there is a question: If you have a coupon, please enter code here (case-sensitive): CiderChat
• Totally Cider Tour to the UK – send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025
• Wassail episode: episode 393: How to Wassail and Drink Hail

Wilding Cider, founded by Sam and Beccy Leach in 2019, uses Regenerative farming practices and a "rural method" to cider making. Based in Somerset the culinary skills of Sam blend with Beccy's Sommelier palate. Their dedication to traditional orchards and natural fermentations has led to the creation of their standout orchard based ciders and perrys. This process sets Wilding apart, showcasing a commitment to purity, sustainability, and the land.

Beccy and Same Leach The Orchard at Wilding

• Size & Scope: 7.5 acres at the home orchard and additional rented orchards.
• Varieties: Kingston Black, Stoke Red, Porter's Perfection, and so many more.
• Regenerative Practices

Sam in the home orchard

The orchards provide the perfect environment for Wilding's cider-making, ensuring low-intervention fermentations that align with the Rural Method philosophy.

What is the Rural Method of Cider Making

Sam credits Skyborry cider in Wales for coining the phrase "rural Method". He explains in this chat that at Wilding Cider Rural Method is an energy-efficient, traditional approach to crafting naturally sweet ciders. It utilizes:

• Cold Winter Fermentations: Utilizing natural temperatures to slow fermentation.
• Low Nitrogen Content: Achieved by using unfertilized orchards for balanced fermentations.
• Minimal Intervention: Avoiding filtration, sulfites, or pasteurization.

This method produces clean, complex ciders that capture the essence of Somerset orchards.

Signature Wilding Ciders and Perry

Wilding Cider showcases the Rural Method through their unique blends and single varietals:

• Symphony: A bittersweet blend.
• Comics: Multi-orchard cider built on Browns and Yarlington.
• Single Varietals: Stoke Red and Kingston Black.
• Perry Cider: Carefully macerated to achieve depth and balance.

These ciders are celebrated for their balance of tannins, acidity, and natural sweetness, hallmarks of the Rural Method.

Contact and how to find Wilding Cider

• Website: http://wildingcider.com
• Open Days: Second Saturday of the month, April through September.
• UK: Independent shops and restaurants.
• International: Belgium, Japan, and limited availability in the U.S.

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• CiderCon2025 Promo Code – Once you get to the registration form, towards the end of the first page you'll reach a section in the form that says "additional registration information" and there is a question: If you have a coupon, please enter code here (case-sensitive): CiderChat
• Totally Cider Tour to the UK – send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025

Jane Peyton, author of The Philosophy of Cider and founder of the School of Booze, brings her deep knowledge of cider and its cultural history to the forefront in this enlightening conversation.

Jane Peyton at Hereford AppleFest Banquet 2024

Key Points Covered

Cider's Cultural Significance

• The apple as a symbol in global traditions and languages.
• Historical mentions, from Norse mythology to Captain Cook's voyages.

Defining Cider

• Cider is pressed, not brewed, differentiating it from beer.
• Diverse expressions of cider, from tannic and dry to sweet and fizzy.

The Legacy of Susanna Forbes

• A heartfelt tribute to Susanna Forbes' impact on the cider world.

Jane's Philosophy on Cider

• Advocating for better representation of cider on menus.
• Mainstream vs. artisanal cider perspectives.

The School of Booze

• Jane's initiative to educate on cider, beer, and more.
• Her work as a writer and accredited pommelier.

Highlights from the Philosopher of Cider

• Recommended Reads and Tastings:
  • The Philosophy of Cider and Jane's other publications.
  • Examples of cider diversity, including champagne-method ciders.
• Memorable Quotes:
  • "Slow cider is sunlight in a glass, the liquid expression of the orchard's soul."
  • "Cider is not apple beer—it's pressed, not brewed."
• Ciders and Perries Mentioned:
  • Little Pomona's offerings
  • Ross on Wye ciders

Contact for Jane Peyton

• Website School of Booze
• B.A. Summers novels Sole Brethren: Left To Their Own Devices & Sole Brethren: If The Shoe Fits

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• Hereford Applefest 2024 film - https://www.herefordshirelifethroughalens.org.uk/cider-perry/
• CiderCon2025 Promo Code – Once you get to the registration form, towards the end of the first page you'll reach a section in the form that says "additional registration information" and there is a question: If you have a coupon, please enter code here (case-sensitive): CiderChat
• Totally Cider Tour to the UK - send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025

The magic of Ciderville awaits you.

In this special holiday episode, Cider Chat invites you to step into the enchanting world of the Talking Pommes. The Night Before the Holiday Pressing is more than just a story—it's a celebration of all things pome, community, tradition, and the joy that comes with every glass of cider.

The cider house hums with anticipation as Ria, Perry Pear, Mr. Quince, and the Medlars prepare the night before their annual pressing. But as every year before there is always magic in the air for Ciderville. With the Talking Pommes truly anything can happen and so it does!

With snow blanketed orchards, and just the right amount of "Believe" a sleigh pulled by apples glides through the starry sky.

Raise a glass and join us on this festive adventure—because in Ciderville, the magic is always just a sip away.

Meet the Stars of the Cider House

This holiday episode of Cider Chat brings together some of Ciderville's most delightful characters:

• Apple: The vibrant leader with a twinkle in their eye.
• The Medlars: Sweet, quirky, and always ready with a witty remark.
• Mr. Quince: The wise and slightly stern elder who keeps everyone on track.
• Perry Pear: Full of charm and flair, a natural performer.
• A Wide Assortment of Pommes: From Dabinett to Kingston Black, they bring their unique personalities to the mix.

The Gift of Holiday Cider Magic

This story is for anyone who cherishes the magic of the season. As Apple says, "Every glass of cider holds a story, and this one's for you."

From Cider Chat to all of Ciderville, we hope this episode brings joy to your holiday season. Raise a glass, gather 'round, and join the Talking Pommes and Ria in Ciderville!

Mentions in this Cider Chat

• CiderCon2025 Promo Code – Once you get to the registration form, towards the end of the first page you'll reach a section in the form that says "additional registration information" and there is a question: If you have a coupon, please enter code here (case-sensitive): CiderChat
• Totally Cider Tour to the UK - send an email to [email protected] to get on the wait list for this 2025 tour taking place August 25-31, 2025

The Recipe for #xpromotecider

Collaboration isn't just a buzzword—it's the recipe for growth. In this episode of Cider Chat, we explore how the #xpromotecider campaign over the course of 2024.

What is #xpromotecider?

The #xpromotecider campaign started as a way to encourage cider brands and enthusiasts to cross share episodes of Cider Chat so that Cider Chat could in turn share news about their brand. The end goal was to help educate cider fans about the resources and how-tos of cider making

Brands and fans were invited to repost Cider Chat episodes and/or download the informative Cider Chat.pdf and then tack it to a bulletin board in a tasting room.

Why Cross-Promotion is the Secret Ingredient

Cross-promotion isn't just about visibility—it's about creating a shared identity for the cider industry. Here's why it matters:

1. Building Regional Destinations Regions like the Finger Lakes, Michigan, and Normandy have become cider tourism hotspots because of collaborative efforts among cideries. By promoting each other, these regions attract visitors and grow collectively.
2. Reaching New Audiences Sharing others' stories helps introduce cider to new audiences who might not otherwise explore it. Cross-promotion creates opportunities to educate and inspire potential fans.
3. Strengthening Community Bonds When cider makers work together, it fosters a sense of unity that resonates with consumers. People want to support an industry that feels connected and supportive.

The Risks of Staying Isolated or not cross promoting

Isolation may seem like the safer route for some, but it comes with risks:

• Missed Opportunities: Without collaboration, regions miss out on tourism and media exposure.
• Industry Stagnation: Staying focused only on individual brands limits the industry's potential to grow and attract new customers.
• Disconnection: Consumers are less likely to engage with a fragmented industry that doesn't show unity.

By embracing cross-promotion, cider makers can avoid these pitfalls and contribute to a stronger, more vibrant community.

Spotlight on Cider Champions

Throughout the year, many individuals and brands have stepped up to embrace #xpromotecider. Here are just a few examples:

• @ciderexplorer consistently reshared weekly episodes, helping to spread the word.
• Cider makers downloaded and posted the Cider Chat PDF to engage their audiences and connect with their local communities.

To see the full list of contributors, check out the YouTube version of this episode, where we showcase screenshots of posts from the past year. And stay tuned to our social media for more highlights!

How to Join the Cross Promote Campaign

Ready to get involved? Here are a few ways to join #xpromotecider:

• Share this blog post or the podcast episode with your audience.
• Use the hashtag #xpromotecider in your posts and tag your favorite cider brands.
• Download the Cider Chat PDF and display it in your tasting room to encourage guests to learn more about cider.

Together, we can grow the cider community into 2025 and continue to build a stronger, more connected industry. Join the fun and start cross-promoting cider today