Creativity doesn't come easy. It is often an act of resistance against chaos and other de-personalizing forces. In this episode, author Mitali Perkins joins Mark Labberton to discuss her latest book Just Making: A Guide for Compassionate Creatives. Known for her acclaimed novels for young readers—including You Bring the Distant Near and Rickshaw Girl—Perkins reflects on the creative life as both a gift and a struggle, marked by tenderness and tenacity. With candour about rejection, moments of mortification, and the relentless call to keep making, Perkins offers encouragement for artists who want their work to be both beautiful and just.

Episode Highlights

1. "I was very, very close myself to giving up on the creative life."
2. "Any time we're bringing order from chaos, there's going to be pushback—and it's diabolical pushback."
3. "Stories widened my heart, they widened my mind, they gave me a sense of calling that I was not just here for myself."
4. "We can't put on our faith like lace and bows; it has to be in the bones of the story."
5. "When I feel that embarrassment, that mortification, if I can just stay and do something physical to honour my work, goodness comes pouring back."
6. "To not write it, after hearing your passion to combat this foe of our age, would be exactly what the diabolical enemy wants us to do."

Helpful Links and Resources

• Just Making: A Guide for Compassionate Creatives by Mitali Perkins
• *You Bring the Distant Near* by Mitali Perkins (National Book Award finalist)
• Rickshaw Girl (adapted into a film)
• *Steeped in Stories: Timeless Children's Novels to Refresh Our Tired Souls* by Mitali Perkins
• The Dangerous Act of Worship by Mark Labberton
• Kiva Microloans

About Mitali Perkins

Mitali Perkins writes novels for young readers that cross borders and break down walls. Her books include You Bring the Distant Near, a National Book Award nominee; Rickshaw Girl, now a feature film; and Tiger Boy, winner of the South Asia Book Award. Born in Kolkata, India, Perkins immigrated to the United States as a child and has published with major houses including Penguin Random House, Charlesbridge, Candlewick, and Little, Brown. Her newest book for adults, Just Making: A Guide for Compassionate Creatives, encourages artists to persist with both tenderness and tenacity. She speaks widely at schools, libraries, and conferences. More at mitaliperkins.com.

Show Notes

• Perkins describes the heart of Just Making as born from nearly giving up on the creative life during the pandemic.
• Creativity, tenderness, and tenacity
• "I was very, very close myself to giving up on the creative life."
• Just Making: a survival guide for writers and artists facing rejection, discouragement, and the sense that their work doesn't matter
• The struggles of the creative life
• Perkins speaks candidly about rejection, failed manuscripts, and the long twelve-year gap between her first and second published books.
• "You end up looking at the exterior packaging—my career looks amazing on social media—but inside it's pride, vainglory, rejections, bad reviews."
• Practices such as finding "third spaces" and championing one's own work sustain her through rejection.
• Childhood, immigration, and storytelling
• Born in Kolkata, India, Perkins immigrated to New York at age seven.
• She calls herself a "feral reader," devouring fourteen hundred novels in four years as a child
• "Stories widened my heart, they widened my mind, they gave me a sense of calling that I was not just here for myself."
• Obstacles and motivation during her upbringing as the daughter of refugees
• Encountering faith through story
• Growing up in a Hindu home and finding coming to Christ in college
• Through reading the Gospels and C.S. Lewis, she encountered Jesus as "the true story behind all the stories."
• Conversion and baptism while a student at Stanford
• Writing, justice, and flourishing
• "We can't put on our faith like lace and bows; it has to be in the bones of the story."
• Fiction that tackles themes of poverty, gender, courage, and flourishing
• Justice is defined not only as righting wrongs but fostering shalom—wholeness and human flourishing.
• Publishing industry and perseverance
• Perkins recounts the twelve-year struggle to publish her second book, revising manuscripts dozens of times.
• "It was twelve years between my first book and my second book."
• Tenacity grounded in prayer and a sense of God's invitation: "I've got the heavy yoke; will you walk with me?"
• Moments of humiliation
• Perkins shares a public humiliation at a book signing where no one lined up for her book. Choosing not to leave, she pulled out her manuscript and began editing
• "When I feel that embarrassment, that mortification, if I can just stay and do something physical to honor my work, goodness comes pouring back."
• How Rickshaw Girl was published and adapted into a film
• Coaching for creatives
• Perkins counsels Mark Labberton on his unfinished book about fear
• "To not write it, after hearing your passion to combat this foe of our age, would be exactly what the diabolical enemy wants us to do."
• How to embrace imperfection and see writing as part of a larger communal conversation
• Community and the impact of children's literature
• Direct engagement with children in classrooms and libraries
• How young readers form friendships with her characters and are inspired toward justice
• How books like Rickshaw Girl and her forthcoming The Golden Necklace connect global justice issues with young readers' imaginations

Production Credits

Conversing is produced and distributed in partnership with Comment magazine and Fuller Seminary.