Conversations With a Wounded Healer

Why therapists feel anxious at work, why practice owners feel overwhelmed, and how both sides can rebuild trust and psychological safety.

You know how we are always talking about dismantling harmful systems on this podcast? Well…what happens when those systems show up inside group practices?

This conversation with Andie Baumgartner and Nadia Parfenova from Rowan Tree Counseling goes deep into the complicated, emotionally loaded relationship between practice owners and employees. And, in fact, it was THE conversation that helped me realize we needed to work with employees as well as business owners in the Group Practice (R)evolution!

Topics include:

• Therapist burnout and workplace trauma

• Transparency, hierarchy, and power dynamics

• Why trust feels so difficult in therapy workplaces

• The emotional realities of group practice ownership

• Risk tolerance, private practice culture, and clinician anxiety

From the fear many clinicians carry into the workplace to the pressure practice owners feel holding entire businesses together, we unpack what's happening behind the scenes in the therapy industry and what it might actually take to build healthier, more sustainable working relationships.

Join The Therapist Network and receive 20% off your subscription tier when you enter the code SARAHROCKS.

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Group Practice (R)evolution is a podcast series offering insights from owners, employees, and experts, and resources to support this wildly ambitious vision for the future.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

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Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

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Why trauma-informed therapists are questioning the medical model, rethinking therapist education, and redefining what healing can look like in a disconnected world.

In my ongoing effort to "future-proof" the field of therapy, I'm encouraging practitioners to dream beyond the conventional session model. How do we move our profession and the world closer to a truly person-centered ethos? How do therapists expand our professional capacity to welcome (or, at least tolerate) interpersonal nuance, spiritual inquiry, somatic experiences, and/or political difference?

My guest, Dr. Danica Harris, suggests that therapists begin by loosening their death grip on the one-on-one billable hour, among other things. Danica is the somatic experiencing practitioner behind The Empowered Therapist on Instagram. She's also a complex trauma expert working internationally as a coach, facilitator, presenter, and educator.

If you're gonna chart a course for a utopian professional future, you're gonna want Danica along for the ride!

• Why the medical model is failing many therapists and clients

• The growing divide between therapy education and real-world healing

• How trauma shows up in therapists themselves

• Why younger clinicians are challenging old systems

• The role of spirituality, embodiment, and vulnerability in healing

• What hope looks like during times of collective trauma

Join The Therapist Network and receive 20% off your subscription tier when you enter the code SARAHROCKS.

Join the waitlist for the next Authentic Leaders Group!

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

Thank you to The Therapist Network for sponsoring the show!

The Therapist Network is a global community built by and for therapists. You'll find live consult groups, an ever-growing library of workshops and courses, plus a community that really sees you. Sarah's group, Tending to the Wounded Healer, meets every other Monday from 1–2pm CT, and it's a space to explore the intersection of your lived experience and your clinical work.

So if you want to feel more supported and less alone, visit TheTherapist.Network—or join Sarah's group directly at tinyurl.com/HealerConsultTTN.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

What if power isn't something to avoid—but something to learn? Francine Proulx-Kenzle and Sarah Buino explore sociocracy, personal power, burnout, and how early childhood experiences shape the way we show up in systems.

I'm going to say something that might make a few therapists squirm: power is not the enemy. And yet… so many of us act like it is.

In this conversation with Francine Proulx-Kenzle, I kept coming back to a core truth that I think we—especially in the therapy world—need to hear again and again: power simply exists. What matters is how we relate to it.

Key takeaways from this episode:

• Power isn't something you have or don't have—it's something you learn to use

• Avoiding power often leads to recreating the same harmful dynamics

• Burnout is often a sign of disconnection from your own needs and agency

• Systems like sociocracy show us what shared, humane power can look like

• Healing isn't about becoming perfect—it's about staying in relationship with your humanity

If there's one thing I want you to take from this conversation, it's this: you don't have to reject power to be a good person. You just have to learn how to use it differently. And that work starts with you.

Join The Therapist Network and receive 20% off your subscription tier when you enter the code SARAHROCKS.

Join the waitlist for the next Authentic Leaders Group!

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

Thank you to The Therapist Network for sponsoring the show!

The Therapist Network is a global community built by and for therapists. You'll find live consult groups, an ever-growing library of workshops and courses, plus a community that really sees you. Sarah's group, Tending to the Wounded Healer, meets every other Monday from 1–2pm CT, and it's a space to explore the intersection of your lived experience and your clinical work.

So if you want to feel more supported and less alone, visit TheTherapist.Network—or join Sarah's group directly at tinyurl.com/HealerConsultTTN.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

Sarah explores sociocracy with Ted Rau, discussing models of shared leadership, and what it really takes to bridge the gap between overwhelmed owners and under-resourced clinicians.

Our third cohort of the Authentic Leaders Group starts this spring and it's got me thinking about systems that need to change. While change may be inevitable, it's far from easy. That's especially true in the therapy field.

Our clients and culture are undergoing sweeping evolution and so too must group practice. How do we bridge the gap between employees and owners when both feel overworked and underpaid?

Sociocracy could be the answer.

• Why group practice feels unsustainable right now: Exploring the growing disconnect between owners and clinicians—and how burnout, compensation, and evolving cultural needs are pushing the current model to its limits.

• What sociocracy offers instead: Insights from Ted Rau on consent-based governance, shared decision-making, and how "circles" can distribute power, responsibility, and accountability.

• The real question behind systems change: What it actually asks of us—owners releasing control, clinicians stepping into leadership—and whether the field is ready to experiment with more equitable, collaborative ways of working.

I'm committed to having more of these system-focused, heart-centered conversations. I hope you are, too.

Join our Authentic Leaders Group! Next cohort starts May 1, 2026.

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

Thank you to The Therapist Network for sponsoring the show!

The Therapist Network is a global community built by and for therapists. You'll find live consult groups, an ever-growing library of workshops and courses, plus a community that really sees you. Sarah's group, Tending to the Wounded Healer, meets every other Monday from 1–2pm CT, and it's a space to explore the intersection of your lived experience and your clinical work.

So if you want to feel more supported and less alone, visit TheTherapist.Network—or join Sarah's group directly at tinyurl.com/HealerConsultTTN.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

What happens when therapists stop performing growth and actually practice it together? Kathryn Esquer shares how The Therapist Network emerged from a real need for authentic connection—and why community, vulnerability, and accountability are essential for sustainable clinical work.

You know how I'm always going on about a) doing your work, and b) doing that work alongside others? It occurred to me that many therapists don't know where to begin, especially with "everything" happening to our profession and the communities we serve.

Kathryn Esquer felt that same deep desire for peer-based connection and support. So, she built it. Today, The Therapist Network offers professionals a virtual space for genuine collaboration, collective wisdom, and feedback––the kind of inspiration and resource-sharing that chaotic Facebook groups just can't provide.

Katy and I advance that goal by offering a "what to expect" primer for healthy group dynamics:

• Why build community? Your professional growth and mental well-being depend on it! Joining something is scary as hell, but extending yourself is better than going it alone.

• Practice discernment. Not all collaboration is good! If you're questioning a group's leadership, motives, or focus, then it's time to find a new space.

• Include elders and others. If the group doesn't embrace a mix of backgrounds, orientations, or ages, then it's not a true community.

• Seek safety. Authenticity is easier to access when a group feels secure. A reminder that safety doesn't mean devoid of accountability. A safe community promotes responsibility among all its members.

Take time to find your people.

Join The Therapist Network and receive 20% off your subscription tier when you enter the code SARAHROCKS.

Join our Authentic Leaders Group! Next cohort starts May 1, 2026.

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

Thank you to The Therapist Network for sponsoring the show!

The Therapist Network is a global community built by and for therapists. You'll find live consult groups, an ever-growing library of workshops and courses, plus a community that really sees you. Sarah's group, Tending to the Wounded Healer, meets every other Monday from 1–2pm CT, and it's a space to explore the intersection of your lived experience and your clinical work.

So if you want to feel more supported and less alone, visit TheTherapist.Network—or join Sarah's group directly at tinyurl.com/HealerConsultTTN.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

Group practices are changing fast—and the legal stakes are rising. This episode unpacks the employment risks, structural tensions, and workplace dynamics shaping the future of therapist employment.

This realignment impacts you whether you're a group practice owner OR a therapist staffer.

If you take only one lesson away from my conversation with Lori Goldstein, award-winning employment lawyer, let it be this: If you're not sure, then ask a lawyer.

Common group practice legal issues include:

• Misclassification: 1099 vs W-2 Therapists

• Non-Competes & Non-Solicits in Work Agreements

• Workplace Compliance & HR Discrimination Risk

• Generational Workplace Expectations

• Unethical Private Equity Practices

• ​​Therapist vs Business Owner Role Confusion

• Communication Failures Leading to Legal Disputes

Opportunities abound for new ways of working together. Just make sure you consult a lawyer first.

***

Group Practice (R)evolution is a podcast series offering insights from owners, employees, and experts, and resources to support this wildly ambitious vision for the future. Become a part of the (R)evolution in our Authentic Leaders Group.

Next Authentic Leaders Group cohort starts May 1, 2026.

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

If therapists can't feel, they can't help. Christian Snuffer dives into psychedelics, spirituality, and the future of therapy—and why curiosity and compassion matter more than any modality.

We met on Instagram and immediately bonded over, well, everything! While every tangent in this episode is just so compelling, three topics really reinforced my belief in the future of psychology and the clinicians who are dedicating themselves to its evolution:

• self-compassion - for the twisty journeys that bring many of us into this field and home to our own healing

• coachability - old dogs (and therapists) can learn new tricks, modalities, and ways of being with their clients and themselves

• psychedelics - we need to protect this vital treatment option from the scourge of capitalism

Bonus focus: spirituality, namely, how do we make space for it in practice?

Join our Authentic Leaders Group! Next cohort starts May 1, 2026.

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

Thank you to The Therapist Network for sponsoring the show!

The Therapist Network is a global community built by and for therapists. You'll find live consult groups, an ever-growing library of workshops and courses, plus a community that really sees you. Sarah's group, Tending to the Wounded Healer, meets every other Monday from 1–2pm CT, and it's a space to explore the intersection of your lived experience and your clinical work.

So if you want to feel more supported and less alone, visit TheTherapist.Network—or join Sarah's group directly at tinyurl.com/HealerConsultTTN.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

What if the biggest problem in therapy is therapists who haven't done their own work? Jamie Marich explores recovery, spirituality beyond religion, and why no modality, guru, or system can replace embodied healing.

I love show-and-tell as a teaching method, especially because it emphasizes the importance of therapists doing their own work. Dr. Jamie Marich is the perfect participant. They have a substantial catalog of "personal artifacts" to share:

• growing up inside evangelical Christian nationalism

• recovery from addiction and participation in AA

• processing their queerness in an unsafe environment

• reconnecting to their spirituality beyond organized religion

These mementos highlight Jamie's rebel journey back to wholeness and a spiritually fulfilling relationship with God, free from rigid dogma.

This conversation challenges therapists to do their own work, move beyond rigid systems, and rediscover wholeness as something already within us—not something we earn.

Join our Authentic Leaders Group! Next cohort starts May 1, 2026.

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

Thank you to The Therapist Network for sponsoring the show!

The Therapist Network is a global community built by and for therapists. You'll find live consult groups, an ever-growing library of workshops and courses, plus a community that really sees you. Sarah's group, Tending to the Wounded Healer, meets every other Monday from 1–2pm CT, and it's a space to explore the intersection of your lived experience and your clinical work.

So if you want to feel more supported and less alone, visit TheTherapist.Network—or join Sarah's group directly at tinyurl.com/HealerConsultTTN.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

Frank Gruba-McCallister on why therapy is political, compassion is nonnegotiable, and healing must include social change.

If I had to choose one episode to light my way through the collapse of capitalism, it would be this conversation with Frank Gruba-McCallister. Truth is, there's no escaping the darkness of our current timeline. That said, there are dozens of reasons to remain hopeful, and thousands of people (like Frank) fanning the flames of optimism.

There's also hella work to do individually and collectively.

The end of capitalism will come whether we act or not. Frank offers several tips to therapists who want to operationalize hope and shape a more equitable future:

• Embody your values - "Not everyone who is awake stays awake." Our inner work is the journey, not the destination. Remain open or awake to new ways of thinking and be transparent about what has shifted for you.

• Make space for spiritual wisdom - "How can you be whole, which is what health is, by omitting what is the most essential aspect of who you are?" Don't mistake your antipathy for organized religion as rejection of your spiritual curiosity

• Mindfully engage with liberatory psychology - "We have to empower people to challenge economic and political systems. But that doesn't negate the importance of them doing work with respect to their own development and growth." Ditto for therapists!

"There's a way of coming out of this that brings you to a better place," observes Frank. If he can remain hopeful, then so can you and I.

Join our Authentic Leaders Group! Next cohort starts May 1, 2026.

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

Thank you to The Therapist Network for sponsoring the show!

The Therapist Network is a global community built by and for therapists. You'll find live consult groups, an ever-growing library of workshops and courses, plus a community that really sees you. Sarah's group, Tending to the Wounded Healer, meets every other Monday from 1–2pm CT, and it's a space to explore the intersection of your lived experience and your clinical work.

So if you want to feel more supported and less alone, visit TheTherapist.Network—or join Sarah's group directly at tinyurl.com/HealerConsultTTN.

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy

How Kristen Wynns built an award-winning practice without insurance dependence and with a good dose of humor.

Group practice owners have a decision to make right now: continue treading water or get more creative in how they operate. The field of therapy is lucky to have many examples of group practice owners who embody innovative leadership. One of those is my "conference bestie", Dr. Kristen Wynns, author, speaker, and founder of Wynns Family Psychology.

Three things practice owners take away from this conversation:

• You're the owner, not the micromanager. How you delegate tasks, build team confidence, and accept feedback is what either inspires or discourages your team.

• Fiascos often lead to fresh starts. Humans are terrified of making changes, but sometimes you've just got to take advantage of a surprise reset, even if you don't think you're ready.

• Times change. So must your practice. New tech! New employees! New competition! Build in time for periodic recalibration.

GUEST BIO

Dr. Kristen Wynns is a psychologist, author, comedian, and speaker who blends mental health expertise with humor. As founder of Wynns Family Psychology, an award-winning private practice with four locations in NC, and "Kiki" on stage, she empowers others to use laughter for healing, confidence, and connection.

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Join the Group Practice (R)evolution! GPR is a new platform and podcast series offering insights from owners, employees, and experts, and resources to support this wildly ambitious vision for the future.

Visit: https://tinyurl.com/GPRPodcast and click on "have a coupon" and enter PODCAST to enjoy all the perks of Group Practice (R)evolution for a year!

Or join our 2026 Authentic Leaders Group and get 1 year of GP(R) membership for FREE!

Next Authentic Leaders Group cohort starts May 1, 2026.

This is a journey of self-discovery and leadership mastery, where you'll not only enhance your leadership skills but also forge meaningful connections with fellow therapists who are committed to their own growth and the betterment of the therapy field. Apply now!

UPCOMING EVENTS

Check the calendar for opportunities to connect with Sarah and earn CEs.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Conversations With a Wounded Healer Merch

Join our Patreon for gifts & perks

Shop our Bookshop.org store and support local booksellers

Share a rating & review on Apple Podcasts

***

Let's be friends! You can find me in the following places…

Website

Facebook @headheartbiztherapy

Instagram @headheartbiztherapy