Orna Donath is an Israeli sociologist, a teacher at Tel Aviv University, and the author of the landmark book, "Regretting Motherhood." During our conversation, Orna talks about the women she profiled in her book, the difference between regretting motherhood and having ambivalence towards it, and why and how women end up in a life where they regret being mothers. Orna also talks about regretting motherhood as one of our world's taboo topics, the idea that being childless is "selfish," what it is like for women to "come out" as regretting parenthood, and whether the desire to be child-free is an innate orientation.

This is one of the most important and interesting conversations I've ever had. Amazingly, Orna's work is the first of its kind: a study that gives voice to women whose experience of motherhood has been an unequivocal mistake. We often, I think, like to believe such people don't exist, hence the shame that's often associated with those who affirm this experience. Orna has helped to bring such women out of the shadows and, I hope, begun to lessen the stigma of those who honestly share the regret they feel about an irreversible, life-changing decision.

If we are to live in a world that respects and encourages individuality and personal preferences, then Orna's work is a consciousness-raising offering. I hope that it will help millions of women learn that they are not alone, and reduce the likelihood of people being influenced by conformity and peer pressure over honoring one's inner compass.

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(00:00) Intro

(04:27) The genesis of the study "Regretting Motherhood"

(06:46) Defining regret

(10:25) Ambivalence vs. regret

(13:24) Similarities with "coming out" as gay

(16:55) A first-of-its-kind study

(20:25) Quotes from women

(23:55) Completness vs. deficiency

(29:55) Normative vs. normal

(32:57) Is being childfree selfish?

(38:00) Who is most at risk for regretting parenthood?

(42:44) Can removing stigma reduce regret?

(46:40) Are there advantages of being childfree?

(51:30) What it's like to know you don't want kids

(54:55) How Orna endured in honoring her preference

(58:40) Orna's forthcoming study of elderly childfree people