Why are there so few Black and women CEOs? Activist investors.

Or so says James White, the former CEO of Jamba, and Thomas Lynch, senior managing director of the private equity firm Mill Road Capital.

White recently joined Lynch’s firm to be part of its newly created Progressive Governance Fund, which seeks to improve diversity at smaller companies through targeted investments.

White and Lynch argue that activist investors ultimately hurt the long-term value of the restaurant companies they target. But they also argue that activists hurt diversity, frequently by pushing out Black or women CEOs or board members and then nominating mostly white men.