This new year, there has been a lot of buzz about how short-lived most people’s commitment to their resolutions are. 

Pat and Bret discussed that trend, and the fact that restaurants don’t pile on the better-for-you limited-time offers in early January the way they used to. Instead, they start rolling out later in the month, possibly in anticipation of slimming-down efforts that are renewed in the spring.

They rounded out the podcast with an interview Bret conducted with Yara Herrera, chef and partner at Hellbender in the Queens, New York, neighborhood of Ridgewood, who discussed the changing role of women chefs, her sourcing strategy and some of her favorite dishes. Give a listen.

Welcome to a new year of Menu Talk. On this week’s podcast, Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, and Pat Cobe, senior menu editor at Restaurant Business, talk trends.

New Year’s Day marks the start of Dry January, which seems to be motivation for people to moderate alcohol consumption for a while, even if they fall off the wagon before the month is out. Pat has tried it and stuck with it twice, but this year, she’s going with “Damp” January instead, cutting back without completely abstaining. 

However Dry January shakes out, the hosts are in agreement that the quantity and quality of mocktails at restaurants and bars is much improved. Bret recently wrote about how the complexity and craftsmanship of spirit-free options offers non-drinking guests an experience that’s not at all diminished. In fact, spirit-free pairings or smaller pours with a tasting menu can actually enhance rather than dull the experience.

Aside from the spirit-free trend, which Pat and Bret see continuing, we chatted about the abundance of food and drink predictions that have landed in our inboxes. Will the sweet-heat or “swicy” flavor trend move into 2025, and what will be the “it” cuisine this year? And what’s with all the brown sugar and espresso on the beverage side? Plus, what happened to all the healthy menu items that usually launch in January? 

Tune in to find out the latest, plus Pat shares an interview with Nathan Louer, chief brand officer at Jamba. He discusses how Jamba has evolved from a juice and smoothie concept to a destination for meal replacements and snacks that balance health and indulgence. Louer and his team are focusing innovation on the core menu, introducing new categories including bowls, blended coffees and bites. Give a listen.

On this week’s podcast, Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, and Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, discuss recent tasting adventures.

Bret traveled to Los Angeles on vacation, where he began exploring restaurants in the West Hollywood neighborhood where he was staying almost as soon as the plane landed. He tried two happy hours, one at Madre, where he had a memorable fruity and spicy margarita and chicken enchilada with mole, and another at Laurel Hardware, where he ate glazed pork ribs while sipping a couple of beers.

The next day, Bret met up with a restaurant consultant friend who led him to several of his favorites, starting in Beverly Hills at a small plates restaurant called Bacari, where each dish was better than the next and most were a reasonable $15. The culinary tour continued to an old-timey place called The Hideaway, followed by loaded breakfast burritos at Cofax Coffee, and several hotspots in the Silver Lake-Eagle Rock area of the city. Before heading to Las Vegas for the second leg of his trip, Bret had tasted L.A.’s wide array of global cuisines, including Armenian, Japanese and regional Mexican.

Meanwhile, Pat got a preview of Taco Bell’s new chicken nuggets, which roll out nationwide on Dec. 19. The nuggets are coated with a mix of breadcrumbs and tortilla chips to make them extra-crunchy, and they lived up to the crunch. Since nuggets demand a dipping sauce, Taco Bell introduced three new ones: Hidden Valley Fire Ranch Sauce, Jalapeno Honey Mustard and creamy Bell Sauce.

The steak boards at Rare Society offer a sampling of several cuts and sauces. | Photo courtesy of Trust Restaurant Group.

Then Pat shared clips from an interview with Brad Wise, chef-partner in San Diego-based Trust Restaurant Group and operator of six Rare Society steakhouses—among other concepts. Chef Wise introduced the Santa Maria style of wood-fired cooking at Rare Society, using oak sourced from Central California. He also has a unique way of presenting Wagyu and dry-aged steak on wooden boards and lazy Susans so guests can sample many different cuts.

Listen as Chef Wise talks about how he developed Rare Society as the antithesis of traditional steakhouses and describes his other concepts within Trust, including a zero-waste ice cream shop is primed for expansion.

On this week’s podcast, Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, said that the holiday season is actually a quiet time for him, with fewer media events as restaurants are busy serving paying customers, so the only party he went to this week was the holiday party of his own company, Informa, where he drank martinis and ate some interesting spring rolls — one topped with trendy chili crisp and another with Southeast Asian aromatics like makrut lime leaf. 

Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, was at the party too, and noticed how many Espresso Martinis were being ordered.

She also found other events to go to, including one at Meduza Mediterrania in NYC’s Meatpacking District, which was, in fact, Yelp’s top restaurant for 2024, based on reviews. It was very trend-forward with Eastern Mediterranean dips, seafood towers and passed lamb chops.

She also checked out a new restaurant at Grand Central Terminal, Grand Brasserie, where she enjoyed a very French trout amandine. 

Then Bret shared clips from an interview with Daniel Garwood, who is chef at Acru, a restaurant that opened in New York’s West Village in October. Originally from Australia, Garwood arrived in the United States in 2022 and landed a job as sous chef of the popular modern Korean restaurant Atomix before being put in charge of Acru where, among other things, he is serving dry-aged steaks from dairy cows.

On this week’s podcast, Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, and Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, discuss recent eating adventures.

Pat took the subway to Jackson Heights, a multicultural neighborhood in the New York City borough of Queens. It’s home to a large population of Nepalese and Tibetan families, and momos are one of their specialties. 

Momos are round or crescent-shaped steamed or fried dumplings with fillings of spiced beef, chicken, goat, chives or potato. Led by a friend who has sampled many a momo in the Himalayas, the group visited four restaurants and one food truck, tasting a good cross-section of dumplings. It was a new culinary experience for Pat and one she would like to repeat soon.

Both Menu Talk hosts described their opulent Thanksgiving feasts, and Bret continued his feasting on Black Friday. He and a group of longtime friends have a tradition of visiting Chinatown after turkey day, and this year they started with soup dumplings at Joe’s Shanghai, a spot famous for the item. They followed that with drinks at Whiskey Tavern, then soup at Great NY Noodletown. Bret admitted the day-after “feasting” has gotten a bit lighter through the years.

Pat visited Baar Baar, a modern Indian restaurant in NYC’s East Village, where she enjoyed a dinner of small plates and inventive cocktails. Among the standouts was Dahi Puri, tiny crisp rice shells filled with potato, cilantro and spices and topped with yogurt mousse and house-made chutney. Her Anarkali cocktail was an Indian-flavored riff on an Aperol Spritz; a combination of gin, Aperol, rose cordial, cardamom and prosecco.

We moved on to chat about smoothies and bowls after playing clips from an interview with Deborah Von Kutzleben, CMO of Tropical Smoothie Cafe. She discussed how the chain differentiates itself from its competitors with an all-day menu, how it is positioning itself for Gen Z’s snacking style, and how items like a pork slider are the perfect add-ons for a signature smoothie. 

On this week’s podcast, Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, and Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, discuss recent tasting adventures as the holidays approach. 

Pat went to Pete’s Tavern near Union Square in Manhattan, which decks itself out in Christmas regalia every year. She went early with friends to beat the crowds and enjoyed well-made fish & chips while her friends had burgers and nachos. The festive décor and negronis made up for the pouring rain.

On another day, Pat and her friends went to Mermaid Inn’s Times Square location, which has an “amazing” happy hour from 4-5:30 p.m. every day. That includes $12 cocktails and a bunch of appetizers, highlighted by particularly good oysters. 

Bret went to the 30th anniversary celebration of Virgil’s, also in Times Square. It’s a barbecue restaurant run by the same people who operate neighboring Italian-American landmark Carmine’s. Both are among those rare places in Midtown Manhattan where you can usually show up with a large crowd and get a table, and also eat your fill for a reasonable price.

A guest at the celebration was Shaw-naé Dixon of Shaw-naé’s House on Staten Island, who served her Savage Fries, which are fries topped with braised oxtail, four cheese mac & cheese and collard greens. Bret recommended that highly.

Bret also shared an interview with Chris and Megan Curren, who operate Graceful Ordinary, a restaurant in St. Charles, Illinois, that opened at the tail-end of the pandemic and serves satisfying and slightly cheffed-up food from its wood-burning hearth.

Give a listen.

On this week’s podcast, Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, and Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, discuss recent tasting adventures, starting with more of a smelling experience.

Bret was invited by Via Carota, a gem of an Italian restaurant in Greenwich Village, to try their new bottled cocktails. But the event was held at a perfume shop that crafted personal scents for the attendees while they sipped on espresso martinis, spritzes and white negronis. Bret left with samples of both bottled cocktails and his custom scent.

Pat visited Jones Wood Foundry, a British-style pub with an impressive draft beer selection. Between the Scotch eggs, Yorkshire pudding with blue cheese lemon dip, curried chicken pot pie and toffee pudding, she could have been in London rather than a few blocks from her Manhattan apartment. 

We shared an interview with Anthony Amoroso, the new VP of innovation and growth at Maggiano’s Little Italy. Amoroso has helmed the kitchen in several famous independents and Michelin-starred restaurants, and now welcomes this opportunity to return to his Italian-American roots and work with the chefs across Maggiano’s 50 locations. 

He talks about how he is elevating the dining experience with top-quality ingredients and presentations while retaining the menu’s well-loved favorites and Maggiano’s tradition. Amoroso also works closely with the beverage director and sommelier, and new cocktails and wine selections now complement the food. And he describes what’s next in terms of the Dallas-based chain’s menu, restaurant design and growth. 

On this week’s podcast, Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, and Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, discussed Bret’s trip to the San Francisco Bay area, where he went for The Culinary Institute of America’s annual Worlds of Flavor conference in Napa. 

The theme this year was Borders, Migration, and the Evolution of Culinary Tradition, which Bret acknowledged was quite a mouthful, but basically it was a discussion of how cooks adjust their food based on what ingredients are available and what customs and traditions are around them, as well as their own life experiences. In short: It’s all fusion. Highlights included a demonstration of southern Italian spaghetti and tomato sauce made like it was risotto and accompanied by a lecture of how spaghetti and tomatoes got to Italy, and lentil fritters that combined the traditions of West Africa and East Africa.

Bret then spent the weekend in San Francisco, and a culinary highlight was a pastrami sandwich with horseradish and red pepper aïoli at Mario’s Bohemian Cigar Store Café in the North Beach neighborhood. 

Pat stayed in New York City and checked out a Cambodian restaurant called Bayon. It was her first time trying that particular cuisine and she found it lighter and more subtle than the cuisines of its neighbors, Vietnam and Thailand. She also had brunch at Sarabeth’s, a long-standing concept with four locations in New York City, where she enjoyed tasty popovers and mushrooms with eggs.

Then Bret shared an interview with Cheng Lin, chef and owner of Shota Omakase in the Brooklyn neighborhood of Williamsburg. The chef discussed the importance of rice in sushi and of cultivating regular customers.

On this week’s podcast, Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, and Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, discuss a week’s worth of eating experiences, starting with a dine-around in Chicago.

The two editors were in Chicago for the last conference of the International Foodservice Editorial Council, familiarly known as IFEC, and the opening event featured a tasting tour of three restaurants in the city’s Fulton Market district. Chef-owner Joe Flamm of Rose Mary spoke about his popular Croatian-Italian restaurant while we chowed down Pork Ribs Pampanella with Calabrian Chile Agrodolce and walnut relish as well as Beef Cheek Gnocchi; at Publican Quality Meats we learned how to spatchcock a chicken while nibbling on Grilled Pork & Mango Brochettes, Porchetta Sandwiches and charcuterie; and at Leña Brava, we sampled Watermelon Aguachile and al pastor-marinated Watermelon Steak and sipped a watermelon cocktail and mocktail. 

While in Chicago, Pat also had dinner at Eataly, and was reminded of how this Italian retail emporium is also a worthy restaurant destination. She joined friends at Vino &, an in-store wine bar with a large menu featuring specialties like Tagliolini al Limone, Pollo alla Milanese and Grilled Branzino, all of which her table ordered along with a nice bottle of red wine. 

Bret continues to explore his Brooklyn neighborhood, where he discovered some Eastern European meat dumplings that he brought home for dinner. First, he tried them the traditional way, topped with sour cream, but then concocted an Asian-influenced “ranch dressing” with chili crisp and Chinese black vinegar that took the dumplings into another flavor dimension.

This week we share an interview with renowned chef and restaurateur Michael Mina, whose new cookbook, “My Egypt,” was just published. Subtitled “Cooking from My Roots,” the book relates Mina’s experiences of journeying back to Egypt—which he left at the age of two—to rediscover his family’s culinary legacy. The result is a book filled with stories, firsthand cooking experiences and a lifetime of recipes.

Mina operates more than 30 restaurants in the U.S., including the recently opened Orla in Santa Monica, California—his first to specialize in Egyptian-Mediterranean cuisine. Here he elevates the dishes he enjoyed eating around his mother’s table and shares the food he tasted and cooked in Egypt. Listen as the chef shares his passion for Egyptian food and talks about how Mina Group is ramping up restaurant openings.

On this week’s podcast, Pat Cobe, senior menu editor of Restaurant Business, and Bret Thorn, senior food & beverage editor of Nation’s Restaurant News and Restaurant Hospitality, discussed their recent eating adventures. That included Pat’s visit to a Hampton Inn, home of the original waffle bar, created by the midscale hotel chain 40 years ago. 

That historical milestone is being celebrated by the hotel chain and promoted by Paris Hilton, since Hampton Inn is a brand of her family’s hospitality empire, in the form of special pink waffles with edible glitter that guests can add. The hosts observed that there’s a lot of edible glitter on menus these days, because it’s fun and dazzling on social media and, one hopes, safe to eat. 

It turns out that some onions being served by McDonald’s probably weren’t safe and allegedly sickened a number of people, resulting in one fatality. Pat and Bret discussed that turn of events.

First, however Bret discussed his visit to a sushi restaurant in Midtown Manhattan, which he said was fine, just like a lot of sushi is fine these days, but not with the attention to detail that came with sushi in the past—the server didn’t even bother to explain what type of fish he had been served. Pat suggested that this is what happens when food like sushi becomes ubiquitous. 

She had a chance to visit the newest location of Kernel, a heavily automated quick-service restaurant developed by Chipotle founder Steve Ells, and was happy to report that the formerly meatless chain is now serving chicken. 

While Pat was at Kernel, Bret went to a preview of Hudson Club, a new restaurant in Midtown Manhattan headed up by chef John DeLucie. He particularly enjoyed oysters with an apple mignonette, and that was a nice segue to this week’s guest, Aaron Juvera, a level one certified oyster master and chef de cuisine of Southerleigh Fine Foods & Brewery in San Antonio, Texas. 

Juvera discussed the oyster master certification program, Texas’s burgeoning oyster-cultivation industry and Southerleigh’s increasing use of lesser-known fish species. We hope you’ll tune in.