Summary

In this episode, Andy talks with Joel Hilchey, speaker, facilitator, and author of The 6½ Habits of Highly Defective Bosses. Joel brings humor, honesty, and a refreshing amount of grace to a topic many leaders quietly struggle with: becoming a boss without training, preparation, or a clear roadmap.

Andy and Joel explore what it really means to be an "accidental boss" and why most bad bosses are not bad people. They unpack the four quadrants every leader must balance: tasks vs. people and short-term vs. long-term, and why focusing only on tasks can quietly erode trust and engagement. You'll hear practical ideas for avoiding mediocrity mongering, removing everyday hassles that drain teams, and providing clarity instead of whiplash leadership.

The conversation also touches on why aiming to be "less terrible" is a surprisingly powerful leadership goal, how recognition can become a force multiplier, and why lessons from leadership often show up at home as well.

If you're leading projects or people and want practical, human-centered ways to become a better boss one step at a time, this episode is for you!

Sound Bites

• "Most bad bosses are actually good people with bad ideas."
• "If you focus only on tasks, people will hate working for you."
• "People don't expect perfection from their boss, but they do expect effort."
• "Recognition is one of the highest leverage tools a leader has."
• "The essence of strategy is saying no."
• "Be a lighthouse for your team, not a disco ball."
• "If you notice yourself getting frustrated that people are doing stuff that's off task or that feels off task to you, like why is this person taking time to do that? That's on you as the leader to say, oh, I must not have made this strategy clear."
• "You can spend the money without asking, but you must tell me you spent it next time we meet."

Chapters

• 00:00 Introduction
• 02:08 Start of Interview
• 02:20 Becoming an Accidental Boss
• 07:10 The Four Leadership Quadrants
• 12:10 Warning Signs You Are Neglecting People
• 15:15 When Task Focus Goes Too Far
• 21:24 Mediocrity Mongering and Good Enough Work
• 25:47 The Value of a Crappy First Draft
• 30:00 Removing Hassles from Team Work
• 35:30 Lighthouse vs. Disco Ball Leadership
• 39:40 Why Being 'Less Terrible' Matters
• 45:40 Applying Leadership Lessons at Home
• 48:31 End of Interview
• 49:15 Andy Comments After the Interview
• 52:38 Outtakes

Learn More

You can learn more about Joel and his work at JoelHilchey.com. Make sure to try the complimentary assessment Joel refers to in the interview.

For more learning on this topic, check out:

• Episode 468 with James Turk. It's a practical discussion about what to do when you are suddenly in charge.
• Episode 467 with Sabina Nawaz, former executive coach to Bill Gates, sharing insights on what no one usually tells you about becoming the boss.
• Episode 419 with Molly McGrath. Her book focuses on fixing your boss, but it almost always inspires listeners to become better leaders themselves.

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Thank you for joining me for this episode of The People and Projects Podcast!

Talent Triangle: Power Skills

Topics: Leadership, People Management, Accidental Managers, Team Culture, Recognition, Project Leadership, Manager Development, Communication, Prioritization, Continuous Improvement

The following music was used for this episode:

Music: Brooklyn Nights by Tim Kulig License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license

Music: Tuesday by Sascha Ende License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license